[Politics] Russia invades Ukraine (24/02/2022)

[pb21]

Of course he wants an election so give him and his evil buddies the opportunity to try and insert a pasty into the job who they control.

I see that Musk is now enrolling his X minions to push the message that Zelenskyy is an unelected dictator and elections should happen.

 

[sparkie]

It's sad. Putin was on the edge of a crushing defeat which would have made the world safe for 30 years+.
And then his puppet manages to take the White House and throw Putin a life belt.

Grim. Sort it out, America.

 

[Gazwag]

It's sad. Putin was on the edge of a crushing defeat which would have made the world safe for 30 years+.
And then his puppet manages to take the White House and throw Putin a life belt.

Grim. Sort it out, America.

and its not as if the rest of the world didn't see it coming, will there be a real life James Bond to saves us all

 

[Eric the meek]

This is too depressing. Here's some good news instead.

 

[Triggaaar]

Is Trump telling Putin that Kursk is now part of Ukraine? After all, Ukraine lost soldiers taking it, so it's understandable if they expect to keep it.

 

[slartibartfast]

Of course he wants an election so give him and his evil buddies the opportunity to try and insert a pasty into the job who they control.

Presumably they'll all have a finger in the pie.

 

[Triggaaar]

I see that Musk is now enrolling his X minions to push the message that Zelenskyy is an unelected dictator and elections should happen.

We knew Musk and Trump were bad people, but I'm not sure many of us were prepared for pure evil.

 

[Deportivo Seagull]

I see that Musk is now enrolling his X minions to push the message that Zelenskyy is an unelected dictator and elections should happen.

i think all those that could be converted already have been, so not sure what this will really achieve other than to highlight to 5he stupidity of it all.

 

[rippleman]

We knew Musk and Trump were bad people, but I'm not sure many of us were prepared for pure evil.

They are just Putin's puppets, dancing to his tune. Putin tells Trump that Zelensky is a dictator and Trump's off parroting what he has just been told like a 3 year old.. It's pathetic and would be hilarious if it wasn't so dangerous for the entire world.

 

[Papa Lazarou]

Russia won't be able to mine the land as long as Ukraine commit to bombing them. And American companies aren't going to show up while Ukraine are still bombing the area.

Europe needs to pre-empt this. Some clever diplomacy required.

That's where Elon's boring company comes in. Tunnel from well inside Russia.

 

[Munchkin]

My take on this….

Trump is 100% focused on the rare earth minerals in Ukraine, once again financial gain is the number 1 priority for him over peace.

Zelensky plays hard ball and as a result Trump uses the bully boy tactics to try and get his own way.

I just hope everyone is strong enough to stand up to this cretin and his bully boy tactics starting with our own Prime Minister.

 

[Pavilionaire]

1. Work out what you’re worried about the most, because rearming is going to need a level of re industrialisation and turning the economy around is going to need cheap energy. You can’t do it on net zero. FACT.

2. You’re looking in the rear view mirror, none of it matters. We have 3 broad choices, a) step back from top tier international politics and manage the economy as a second tier Swiss style nation, b) throw our lot in with Europe, join the EU euro etc. or c) align with US. You want b).

3. Ask yourself honestly why Brexit happened. Yes it’s complex however there is a significant cohort of British people that want full fat sovereignty and not hooking into an organisation that (for example) wants to expand into areas that are not Europe.

In the same way the U.K. needs to reset its vision on what it wants to be going forward so does the EU. What it was doesn’t matter now, Trump is going to confront the EU on its protectionism and with Germany getting a new Government that will be favourable to Russia, it will need to change or die.

4. Time will tell, it’s clear that Germany and other Eastern European countries don’t want troops in Russia, Macron supports it but has little power in France domestically and we are military minnow. Starmer currently is in danger of looking like the Wealdstone raider on the international stage.

You seem to see everything in black and white, but the reality is you can pursue your green agenda whilst upping defence spending, and you can request a Customs Union without full EU membership.

All the while the UK remains a nuclear power then your option a) is off the table, and clearly with Trump in charge option c) is also off the table. So, yes, the European option is more attractive but obviously regaining full membership is not the pressing requirement now.

If we propose a Customs Union with the EU, they agree and make a counter-offer about full membership then that can be put to the British people.

Brexit happened because people were worried about immigration, they believed they were helping the NHS, they believed the lies our media had drip-fed then about the EU for 4 decades, and because they were sick of Cameron and his austerity.

The UK population - when asked the question - "In hindsight, do you think Britain was right or wrong to leave the European Union?" has been solidly c. 55% wrong, 33% right, 12% don't know since November 2022, so for 27 months the polls have produced the same answer. And a Customs Union is not even rejoining, so even some of the remaining 45% will be OK with that.

The international, populist lurch to the right has been fuelled by two main factors: inward migration and social media disinformation and 'fake news'. The right - and the rich - have become very adept at manipulation, and now we see blatant meddling in the elections of other countries, of cross-pollenation of extremism.

I think the UK and EU states will happily foot the bill for a peacekeeping force in a demilitarised zone within Ukraine, but Russia have said they don't want that. Starmer is right that the US have to be the security backstop, it's just not in America's interests to walk away from this conflict without giving that because any future Trump / American guarantee on anything will be viewed as worthless.

He wouldn't even have to provide soldiers, just ammo, tech, hardware and surveillance, and even that could be financed by a deal involving minerals. His domestic armaments manufacturers and construction companies will not be happy to see the contracts and the minerals go elsewhere.

 

[Anger]

People should take action in any way they can and wherever possible.

1. Don't buy from companies where Russia profits from your purchase.
2. Don't buy or use either Trump's company products or his cronies' company products (obvious ones being X and Tesla but there are so many more).
3. Don't holiday in America (if you can make that choice).
4. Do make sure that your MP knows that you want the right UK response to Trump spouting Pootin's lies and continued support for Zelensky and Ukraine.

Other methods are available.

Our battle for Falmer and the many creative ways we found to make our voices heard proved that you can get action if you make the effort in all of the right ways.

 

[Pavilionaire]

No one is walking away from NATO apart from the US and if that happens NATO ceases to exist. If NATO ceases to exist the Europeans will have driven away the only country that would protect them from an aggressive Russia. The likes of Starmer need to wake up and smell the cawfeee.

Shitting the bed about Trump prioritising US taxpayers money over EU nations protection is not a sirsmic shift. He warned European leaders in his first term and they’ve done nothing since, with the exception of the Poles.

Trump may lack political finesse but his intentions have been in plain sight for years.

The Russian population is 144million, whereas the combined population of the EU, UK and NATO members Canada and Turkey is c 640 million.

In 2023 Russia's GDP was 2.02 trillion, Canada's alone is 2.14 trillion, the UK's is 3.4 trillion, Turkey 1.12 trillion and the EU is c. 12 trillion.

Therefore, in terms of manpower and money then what is left of NATO still dwarves Russia. Their economy is weak and their ruler is old, and when peace comes they will find they have less friends than before the war. This is not the Soviet Union of old.

Granted, the immediate threat is sizeable but in numerical terms the Russian threat should be able to be managed, with or without the USA.

 

[Peacehaven Wild Kids]

EDIT now clarified

 

[Hugo Rune]

My take on this….

Trump is 100% focused on the rare earth minerals in Ukraine, once again financial gain is the number 1 priority for him over peace.

Zelensky plays hard ball and as a result Trump uses the bully boy tactics to try and get his own way.

I just hope everyone is strong enough to stand up to this cretin and his bully boy tactics starting with our own Prime Minister.

A tiny positive is that there is rare earths deposits in some areas of seized Ukrainian land. Trump will obviously want this back in Ukrainian hands so he can try and get his 50% deal through. Unfortunately, it only looks like about 20% of the seized land is of value to Trump.

 

[timbha]

On a change of subject have all the Israel/Palestine threads been removed or have I gone blind?

If it’s the former I was merely puzzled that there appears to be no explanation/warning from Bozza etc. (unless of course I have gone blind)

(Personally I’m pleased I can’t see them, we were going round in circles)

Have a look at the sticky

 

[Sirnormangall]

A tiny positive is that there is rare earths deposits in some areas of seized Ukrainian land. Trump will obviously want this back in Ukrainian hands so he can try and get his 50% deal through. Unfortunately, it only looks like about 20% of the seized land is of value to Trump.

Maybe - but if Ukraine doesn’t get that land back, Trump will presumably try for a rare earth deal with Putin (if he hasn’t already)

 

[Sirnormangall]

My take on this….

Trump is 100% focused on the rare earth minerals in Ukraine, once again financial gain is the number 1 priority for him over peace.

Zelensky plays hard ball and as a result Trump uses the bully boy tactics to try and get his own way.

I just hope everyone is strong enough to stand up to this cretin and his bully boy tactics starting with our own Prime Minister.

Trump’s behaviour needs to be called out for what it is - blackmail

 

[peterward]

Trump’s behaviour needs to be called out for what it is - blackmail

It's actually treason.