What rivalry?! For a rivalry to exist it has to surely be a two way thing, yet I don't think the Germans think of us as rivals, they would probably more likely consider the Netherlands or Italy as their traditional footballing rivals.
I was comparing Germans, not teams. Like you care.
With the greatest respect England fans DO expect to win tournaments and loudly proclaim so. Our last manager got us to two major finals and a semi, and was vilified.
...however Trigger, do note that your 'we think we' part of your question is some sort of psychological desire to belong to a collective but doesn't exist in reality. In reality people from England and England fans are various different people with different opinions. There's no "we think", its an illusion. And thats good because then you don't belong to a group of people who believe England could jog home a title because of players like "Owen" etc.
Germany’s footballing rivals are indeed the Netherlands and they aren’t that serious about it either.
Well I don't see how you can't NOT count it. We are better than we were - which isn't saying much. When we can win tournaments and consistently, not every time, but 50% of the time, beat the real top nations when it actually matters, then I'll accept we've 'arrived'.
What makes English men's football so different when it comes to appointing a foreign manager compared to women's football, rugby, cricket, athletics, etc?
This rivalry only exists from England's side. I know numerous German football fans, none of them feel any sense of rivalry at all; they save this for The Nederlands. To me, this England Germany thing feels weird as I know that it's so one sided, tin pot even; you cannot have a rivalry if one side does not give two hoots.
Rio Ferdinand did. This is what turned me off England many years ago. He said England derserved to win tournaments.......without giving any meaningful explanation when pressed on this matter.
c.f. the putative Brighton/Chelsea 'rivalry'.
Yeah!Never heard that said out loud before.....supporting England and glory hunting!
We support England because we have to, not because we want to! They may be serial under-achievers, they may be at times a load of unlikeable prima-donnas, some of our fellow fans may be arseholes, but like the Albion is our local team so England is our national side. As has been mentioned international football is different to club football, you can't just pick a team a team at random because you saw them on Match of the Day once when you were younger and liked their colours or something.Have you ever been to an England v Germany match?
Which is completely irrelivant to the context of this debate.
Reading fans will understand
