[Politics] Russia invades Ukraine (24/02/2022)

[Eric the meek]

Sometimes I bloody love Erdogan. He's a despot, but he's our despot!

I doubt if he's got Ukrainian lives as his priority. He will have bigger fish to fry. Old scores to settle. Old Ottoman territories to take back.

What better time to pounce than when Russia has downed the tools it's got left?

 

[Triggaaar]

It would be a massive mistake to agree to a quick "peace" or cessation of fighting. Russia has massive problems coming just down the track if Ukraine stays in the fight

This has been my opinion all along.

 

[peterward]

I doubt if he's got Ukrainian lives as his priority. He will have bigger fish to fry. Old scores to settle. Old Ottoman territories to take back.

What better time to pounce when Russia has downed the tools it's got left?

Sure, but he also saw that the Turkik crimean tartars were treated well and with respect in Crimea in Ukraine and they've been arrested, killed and marginalised by Russia.

Maybe its not just lives of ethnic Ukrainians as you say, I'm sure you're right and he probably eyes up a revived Ottoman empire in some form, but for sure he will know his ethnic kinsman are much better off under Ukraine and I'd guess there's domestic political pressure with the Tartars have been so badly abused by Russia, so he will need to tread that line for his domestic audience.

 

[Eric the meek]

Sure, but he also saw that the Turkik crimean tartars were treated well and with respect in Crimea in Ukraine and they've been arrested, killed and marginalised by Russia.

Maybe its not just lives of ethnic Ukrainians as you say, I'm sure you're right and he probably eyes up a revived Ottoman empire in some form, but for sure he will know his ethnic kinsman are much better off under Ukraine and I'd guess there's domestic political pressure with the Tartars have been so badly abused by Russia, so he will need to tread that line for his domestic audience.

I remember reading that many of the Crimean Tatars were previously moved out of Crimea to somehere else in Russia. Sorry my details are sketchy on this. But your point is definitely valid. The fact that the video (the one I can't find) mentioned the Tatars are descendents of Turks adds weight to it.
I think the video may also have mentioned there are some Turks (not Tatars) living in Crimea.

 

[Eric the meek]

'I remember reading somewhere' - I'm going to copyright that phrase, before @raymondo does.

 

[Sirnormangall]

Gleaned this from bbc thread.

• Donald Trump said on Tuesday that in return for the deal Ukraine would get "the right to fight on", but didn't confirm if the US would continue supplying military equipment and ammunition

Ukraine has the right to fight on regardless of what Trump says. They don’t need his permission

 

[peterward]

'I remember reading somewhere' - I'm going to copyright that phrase, before @raymondo does.

#IRRS

 

[Cordwainer]

If that’s a verbatim quote from Donny..that’s real big of him allowing Ukraine to fight on. No doubt if a deal is struck then it will be down to him and him alone and of course will be the greatest deal in the history of humankind because literally everyone has told him so and now they’re erecting statues of him in Kyiv.

 

[SouthSaxon]

That quote is also further proof, as if we needed it, that this was never about peace. Same with the Trump Gaza nonsense.

 

[raymondo]

Yeah it'll be Trump lying. He'll think that if he just says it, Putin will go along with it rather than fall out.

Yep, that's his style - and it's truly familiar to me from some US bosses (when I had a career).

 

[SouthSaxon]

Yep, that's his style - and it's truly familiar to me from some US bosses (when I had a career).

I think it translates to “they’ll have to be fine with it because it’s happening regardless”.

 

[raymondo]

Sometimes I bloody love Erdogan. He's a despot, but he's our despot!

And I hope he stays our despot!! He's a funny one, stays on the edge of things, then gets his bludgeon out when needed. Will they ever get into the EU...does he really WANT to be in the EU

 

[raymondo]

I think it translates to “they’ll have to be fine with it because it’s happening regardless”.

Yes, and many ARE afraid to contradict them. The ultimate bullying by words.

 

[raymondo]

If that’s a verbatim quote from Donny..that’s real big of him allowing Ukraine to fight on. No doubt if a deal is struck then it will be down to him and him alone and of course will be the greatest deal in the history of humankind because literally everyone has told him so and now they’re erecting statues of him in Kyiv.

'Trump Towers' Mariupol would be nice...

 

[raymondo]

Really interesting perspectives by ISW.

It would be a massive mistake to agree to a quick "peace" or cessation of fighting. Russia has massive problems coming just down the track if Ukraine stays in fight.

Exactly, the big picture re Russia is getting lost in all the daily announcements and misinformation.

 

[raymondo]

With a **** like him running the USA is anyone surprised at anything he says or does. I don't know if this has been posted before but I found myself nodding along with it.

Apologies it’s slightly off topic but I think it’s relevant to the thread?

I still can't decide if it's his cognitive health, or that he's a self-centered, malevolent, vindictive, manipulative, bullying bastard. For now, I think it's the latter, but it may morph into the former.

 

[Triggaaar]

Yep, that's his style - and it's truly familiar to me from some US bosses (when I had a career).

Yeah I don't think it's going to work with Putin

 

[SouthSaxon]

This has brightened my day. Also, my opinion of Macron has increased immeasurably this last week or two.

 

[raymondo]

This has brightened my day. Also, my opinion of Macron has increased immeasurably this last week or two.

He DID use the words very lightly re Zelenskiy. He's an arse licking bastard re Putin.

 

[armchairclubber]

This has brightened my day. Also, my opinion of Macron has increased immeasurably this last week or two.

As said beneath;

'Was he smiling with him or at him?'

Are you questioning their friendship?

'Hats off to the journalist that asked it' though.