- Oct 20, 2022
- 6,905
of what?
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[News] Middle East conflict
- Thread starter Greenbag50
- Start date
Billy the Fish
Technocrat
Hamas planned sexual violence as weapon of war - Israeli campaigner
An Israeli campaigner says militants planned acts of sexual violence committed in October's attack.
www.bbc.co.uk
Google it, there's 100s.
aolstudios
Well-known member
aolstudios
Well-known member
aolstudios
Well-known member
Only if people genuinely want to look.
Hamas planned sexual violence as weapon of war - Israeli campaigner
An Israeli campaigner says militants planned acts of sexual violence committed in October's attack.www.bbc.co.uk
Google it, there's 100s.
Some on here don't.
& won't
WIDESPREAD RAPE committed by HAMAS ON OCTOBER 7 - propaganda, hearsay or true?
Further to the link, I posted above, I am absolutely not saying these claims are untrue (and if they are true then that’s horrific) just that the bodies found were not examined for forensic evidence of assault before they were burned or buried, nor interviews done with any survivors of the alleged rape (despite all the claims of testimony after testimony) - in fact no survivors of rape have been produced according to EI The one witness on Israel’s video to the Western media claiming to have seen a woman being gang raped with her own eyes also says in the next breath, “ Hamas soldiers were celebrating with decapitated Israeli heads on sticks” - no first hand proof or evidence for that has been found.
Therefore, before taking what you read in the media as being the absolute truth about these allegations of systematic rape and assault by Hamas on 7 October, and before accusing anyone that questions them to be on the side of Hamas allow yourselves the benefit of at least considering an alternative explanation, then decide what you want to believe …but you won’t find it on X or unadulterated form of it in the Western media - the real truth might be somewhere in between.
Please - Just watch the video by Electronic Intifada - it’s basically saying what I have been trying to say above…and what the report says that I linked to …and while I don’t go as far as debunking the mass rape claim myself, I at least take it on board as a possibility that the claims of systematic rape by Hamas on October 7 are emanating out of a very sophisticated propaganda exercise:
This is also food for thought - Are the English translations of Arabic videos depicting Hamas being posted on Social media accurate?
EI are an independent group covering the Israeli Palestinian conflict
The Electronic Intifada - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
As far as I know Hamas haven't denied the accusations made by Israel or do you know otherwise ?
- Oct 20, 2022
- 6,905
Good question (not that that is an endorsement by me of anything Hamas has to say btw!)
“NPR cannot independently verify allegations of sexual violence. Hamas denies that its fighters committed sexual assault and rape...Asked about the allegations at a press conference Wednesday, U.N. High Commissioner for Human Rights Volker Türk said he supported an investigation..."Atrocious forms of sexual violence need to be thoroughly investigated. We need to make sure that justice is served because that's what we owe the victims," Türk said.”
(“National Public Radio (NPR, stylized as npr) is an American non-profit media organization headquartered in Washington, D.C., with its NPR West headquarters in Culver City, California.[2] It serves as a national syndicator to a network of over 1,000 public radio stations in the United States.[3] It differs from other non-profit membership media organizations, such as the Associated Press, in that it was established by an act of Congress.[4]”)
From Reuters News Agency:
“Reuters reviewed images matching some of the descriptions or attesting to other possible atrocities. However, it could not independently verify all the accounts... Taher- al-Nono, the media adviser to the head of political bureau of Hamas, denied Hamas fighters were responsible for any sexual assaults in the attack and called for "a serious and impartial international investigation into the matter…A U.N. commission of inquiry investigating war crimes on both sides of the Israel-Hamas conflict will probe the allegations of sexual violence by Hamas, amid Israeli criticism the U.N. had remained silent. Israel accuses the commission of bias and has said it will not cooperate with the investigation.”
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I was about to ban at least one person from this thread, but I'll issue a final warning. There won't be any more. Next time people will be banned, permanently, from this thread.
I don't care what "side" you are on, please debate the subject. If you attack other posters directly then you will be removed from this thread and, potentially, the site completely.
No subsequent apologies/appeals/grovels/"What about..."s will be listened to.
I don't care what "side" you are on, please debate the subject. If you attack other posters directly then you will be removed from this thread and, potentially, the site completely.
No subsequent apologies/appeals/grovels/"What about..."s will be listened to.
I found that post/video really informative and provided another perspective on that topic.
Please continue what you are doing. I know you have received abuse and false accusations but you can always ignore those users or take time off this thread. You have been a valuable part of this thread/discussion and I have learned a lot about this conflict from you - and other NSCers here.
BadFish
Huge Member
- Oct 19, 2003
- 18,194
Yes, asking for validation of sources and trying to find proof to substantiate claims is being factual and balanced, of course it is.
Accepting without question unsubstantiated 'claims' is buying into propaganda. While accusing others looking for proper evidence of ,downplaying' or 'denying' is the absolute opposite of being factual and balanced and evidence of bias and a clouded viewpoint.
Hence.my post.
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I agree.I am not sure that condemnation Top Trumps is terribly helpful, frankly.
I condemn Bibi.
I condemn Hamas.
With that I am comfortable that I have done all I can do, nothing more to see, and I can get on with my life. The argument is settled.
Once I realised that both sides are as bad as each other I disengaged with this conflict with just a fool's hope remaining that they all one day see sense.
armchairclubber
Well-known member
- Feb 22, 2014
- 2,806
I wonder if this will make the mainstream media. I am not holding my breath.
aolstudios
Well-known member
They filmed, shared them & boasted they'd repeat them.
No one could *honestly* doubt they happened. But some on here are.
Repeatedly
Sorry, are you saying they filmed, shared and boasted about repeating the alleged sexual assaults? I don't think they did.
Billy the Fish
Technocrat
Are we in some kind of weird parallel universe?
So the BBC, CNN, NYT, amongst others, are printing unsubstantiated claims.
But don't worry everyone, ignore those respected organisations because @Zeberdi has been on the Internet and found some proper evidence on a Palestinian only website called Electronic Infatada.
NYT investigation.
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BadFish
Huge Member
- Oct 19, 2003
- 18,194
It's a weird parallel universe where someone is personally attacked for asking for further evidence of something a news paper article posted as 'claims'. I may have missed zeberdi drawing any kind of conclusion about this stuff but from what I saw he was simply asking for more information.
Whether the claims were true or not, my point was that the personal attacks and accusation on a poster asking for more information were way beyond the Pail and totally unnecessary. Surely the civilised and logical response was to provide the extra evidence requested?
Yeah, I haven't seen @Zeberdi making any claims on this topic - although this statement can be proven wrong if anyone can provide any evidence showing these claims.
I thought the Electronic Intifada was posted to provide another perspective from the Palestinian side. I have read some of their articles and found them very insightful, albeit it is up to the reader to decide their reliability - likewise with BBC articles, etc.
BadFish
Huge Member
- Oct 19, 2003
- 18,194
I expect you'll get some laughing emojis instead of evidence of deberdi supposed claims.
Anyway as I said these posters are best ignored as they don't add much to the discussion.