[Travel] Assault after the game tonight

Talby · Sunday at 9:14 PM

PILTDOWN MAN said:
I'm amazed at the amount of people frightened to stand up for themselves. If the op has been wronged I'd want to take it as far as possible to stamp out this type of officialdom. Far too many tip their brow.

I think a clarification of the ‘rules’ and tackling the rail company is fine.

Don’t make it a football related matter as the club only want good new stories.

But I completely agree about standing up for yourself, just choose your battles wisely as a football fan.

browneggsandham · Sunday at 9:30 PM

The Optimist said:
I think the midnight cutoff is more about the end of the day than a time after the game ends. As posted elsewhere on the thread the club website states 3.5 hrs before and 4 hrs after.

It doesn't say that though - in the screenshot posted it says 'up to 4hrs after'.

Admittedly it is vague, there is more info in the help section of the website although even that doesn't clarify 5.30pm kick offs.

It says free travel ends at:

9pm for a 3pm KO (circa 4hrs after)
Midnight for a 7.45 KO (circa 2.5hrs after)

Help - Free matchday travel

drew · Sunday at 9:33 PM

PILTDOWN MAN said:
I'm amazed at the amount of people frightened to stand up for themselves. If the op has been wronged I'd want to take it as far as possible to stamp out this type of officialdom. Far too many tip their brow.

Can you be a bit more specific about 'taking it as far as possible'? What exactly does that, in your eyes, entail?

bluenitsuj · Sunday at 9:36 PM

Talby said:
Sounds like an unpleasant experience but if the fan pursued it I don’t think it’s worth trying to get the Club involved - I’d anticipate that their relationship with the rail company is important to them and they’ll take a line of ‘we weren’t there/ only you had the issue/we’re not in a position to question actions of the rail staff etc.

Plus there’s the added issue of potentially being deemed to then be a problematic football fan which, although the fan is undoubtedly not, they could get pulled into the ‘behaviour to & from a football match/bringing club into disrepute’ issue. It could really & seriously backfire on the fan.

If it’s not on the club’s radar then don’t put it on there. Regrettably I think it’s far safer to just move on.

If the club are not clearly communicating to staff and security about valid travel times then the OP has every right to raise this with them. It seems hardly any fans are clear either so it needs addressing.

jcdenton08 · Sunday at 9:39 PM

jonny.rainbow said:
The club’s Pre-Match Brief email always recommends giving yourself additional time to get to and from the Amex.

When we arrived at Falmer at about 1:35, we were held at the barriers and told we’d have to wait 30 minutes or buy a train ticket.

There were quite a few people being held including a mother and her child who had been invited to the pre-match ‘meet the players’ event. There were also several Japanese fans in half and half scarves who didn’t seem to understand the situation.
Eventually one of the Revenue Protection Officers saw sense and let people through.

I can’t see the logic in forcing people to travel in a narrow window rather than spreading customers out over the day. They have our money already, what difference does it make to their operating costs which service we travel on?

Southern Rail aren’t exactly known for being good though… I f***ing hate them so much and happily blame them for everything, even when they aren’t involved. I don’t think I’ve ever hated a person, entity, business or anything with quite the venom that I loathe Southern.

Talby · Sunday at 9:44 PM

bluenitsuj said:
If the club are not clearly communicating to staff and security about valid travel times then the OP has every right to raise this with them. It seems hardly any fans are clear either so it needs addressing.

Clarification yes, but the ‘assault’ isn’t the Club’s issue. I’m not sure whether the rail officials took the OP’s name etc….i think there are certain elements of this that could come back to bite for the OP if the security team all stick together and paint a worse picture.

But, if he’s got a video and they were complete arseholes then f*** them and go for it.

jcdenton08 · Sunday at 9:45 PM

TugWilson said:
Maybe one or more was an arsenal fan , either way they had no right to touch you .

I think this is the crux of it. I can only judge based on the description of events from the OP, but it sounds heavy handed if accurate to what occurred.

There’s been a few people getting slightly sidetracked with what-ifs about ticket validity; this is actually irrelevant to the allegation at hand which is of assault by use of excessive force by a revenue protection officer.

SOP in the case of suspected “fare dodging” is to caution the individual, take their details, and if believed to be intentionally fare evading potentially prosecuted.

It is highly unusual unless an individual poses an immediate risk to the safety of other passengers or the police/revenues officer to be forcibly removed from a service.

jcdenton08 · Sunday at 9:47 PM

HangletonGull said:
You say you got video footage maybe post it

Absolutely do not do this

Harry Wilson's tackle · Sunday at 9:59 PM

jcdenton08 said:
I think this is the crux of it. I can only judge based on the description of events from the OP, but it sounds heavy handed if accurate to what occurred.

There’s been a few people getting slightly sidetracked with what-ifs about ticket validity; this is actually irrelevant to the allegation at hand which is of assault by use of excessive force by a police officer.

SOP in the case of suspected “fare dodging” is to caution the individual, take their details, and if believed to be intentionally fare evading potentially prosecuted.

It is highly unusual unless an individual poses an immediate risk to the safety of other passengers or the police/revenues officer to be forcibly removed from a service.

I suspect a 'but we all know what football hooligans are like' narrative from those with the Big Trousers here.

Don't share the footage but make it clear you have it when pursuing, OP.

Peacehaven Wild Kids · Sunday at 10:17 PM

Harry Wilson's tackle said:
Don't share the footage …..

HHGull · Sunday at 10:18 PM

jcdenton08 said:
I think this is the crux of it. I can only judge based on the description of events from the OP, but it sounds heavy handed if accurate to what occurred.

There’s been a few people getting slightly sidetracked with what-ifs about ticket validity; this is actually irrelevant to the allegation at hand which is of assault by use of excessive force by a police officer.

SOP in the case of suspected “fare dodging” is to caution the individual, take their details, and if believed to be intentionally fare evading potentially prosecuted.

It is highly unusual unless an individual poses an immediate risk to the safety of other passengers or the police/revenues officer to be forcibly removed from a service.

I think you’ve become a little sidetracked - there is no suggestion these people were police officers.

jcdenton08 · Sunday at 10:19 PM

HHGull said:
I think you’ve become a little sidetracked - there is no suggestion these people were police officers.

Sorry, RPO’s acting like police officers.

PILTDOWN MAN · Sunday at 10:49 PM

drew said:
Can you be a bit more specific about 'taking it as far as possible'? What exactly does that, in your eyes, entail?

Completely depends on exactly what happened. Rightfully the OP hasn’t posted here.

Far too many appear to accept it. Especially don’t upset the club etc. boo f***ing boo. If something is wrong it needs to be sorted

drew · Sunday at 11:01 PM

PILTDOWN MAN said:
Completely depends on exactly what happened. Rightfully the OP hasn’t posted here.

Far too many appear to accept it. Especially don’t upset the club etc. boo f***ing boo. If something is wrong it needs to be sorted

Nice side step.

At the end of the day, there is only so far you can take it without resorting to physical retaliation. In this case, once they had made it clear he should leave the train, what's going to be gained by resisting. Record what is happening, pay the fare or leave the train and then take it up with the club and/or the train operator.

Easy 10 · Sunday at 11:09 PM

Bry Nylon said:
PM sent

(Available most Tuesday eves plus weekends with notice)

OK.

Not the face though. We've all got to make a living.

nsclurker · Monday at 12:03 AM

Many GTR staff now wear body cameras, and I would suspect RPOs may be likely to wear them too. Might be worth checking/asking for footage from Southern/GTR.

PILTDOWN MAN · Monday at 12:37 AM

drew said:
Nice side step.

At the end of the day, there is only so far you can take it without resorting to physical retaliation. In this case, once they had made it clear he should leave the train, what's going to be gained by resisting. Record what is happening, pay the fare or leave the train and then take it up with the club and/or the train operator.

If you believe I’d do anything else but the correct legal way you really haven’t understood my posts. Never mind.

Harry Wilson's tackle · Monday at 12:40 AM

Easy 10 said:
OK.

Not the face though. We've all got to make a living.

Time and time again you crack me up.

The Hunter S Thompson of NSC :bowdown:

drew · Monday at 7:23 AM

PILTDOWN MAN said:
If you believe I’d do anything else but the correct legal way you really haven’t understood my posts. Never mind.

You're posts were a bit vague as to how far you would go but glad you clarified it. There are plenty on here that would brag about taking it further, physically!!

Chinman3000 · Monday at 9:20 AM

A couple of clarification points based on replies to this.

They did tell me I was trespassing
They did tell me I was being denied permission to travel due to invalid ticket.

They did NOT give me a chance to buy another ticket
They did NOT ask/tell me to leave
They did NOT give me any warning they were going to physically remove me or give me a chance to leave if my own accord before doing so.

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