[Politics] Tory meltdown finally arrived [was: incoming]...

[WATFORD zero]

Agree, can't be laid directly at THIS Tory Government, door, but many of the reasons for the cost of living crisis can be historically tracked back to previous Tory Government decisions.

Substitute 'Wholly' for 'Directly' and I'd give you a thumbs up

 

[Seagull27]

Entirely, sure. But their party has now been in power for 12 years, and poverty has grown considerably as a direct result of their policies stretching from the failed austerity to the current rhetoric of 'levelling-up' whilst withdrawing benefits that would alleviate the cost-of-living crisis and increasing taxation on the working poor -- when that could have been targeted at the assets of those that don't work.

This party got into power through blaming Labour for the global financial meltdown -- and for some strange reason, the public bought that narrative. New Labour could have been less accommodating to the financial sector, but their ability to control that was far more limited than the Tories have had in protecting sectors of society over the past 12 years.

Agree, can't be laid directly at THIS Tory Government, door, but many of the reasons for the cost of living crisis can be historically tracked back to previous Tory Government decisions.

I don't disagree with either of you, but the primary reasons for the current cost of living crisis are the pandemic and the war in Ukraine, both of which were largely out of the government's control. In that sense it's quite similar to how the financial crisis finished Labour in 2010, which the Tories took full advantage of, so it would be quite satisfying to see the Tories being blamed for this for a decade despite the issues being global factors

 

[Guinness Boy]

You post very occasionally. If it's going to be like this, for all concerned, please refrain from doing so.

He post very occasionally on THAT account. More so on his other ones.

 

[Motogull]

It also emerged this morning that not only will we be paying the Rwandan government to take our refugees, part of the deal is that we also take a percentage of refugees from Rwanda

It really is just a fake scheme to garner hard right votes.

Eh? We are paying a fortune to exchange light brown refugees for dark brown ones? What does the plonker Farage make of this? Even racists must be troubled with this.

Partygate.
Brexit lies
Misleading Parliament on numerous occasions
Lying to the queen
Having a convicted criminal as a PM
Patel’s inhumane treatment of refugees

All disgusting. All unbecoming of a government. Each one should have seen this government turfed out.

But I don’t think that’s what’s will be their undoing. I think it will be the cost of living crisis that does for them. It’s the one that’s going to hit a lot of their core voters, the working class Tory voters.

I disagree.

bungle**** got brexit done.
Covid was not bungle****'s fault - in fact he handled it as well if not better than anyone else could have done.
The invasion of Ukraine wasn't bungle****'s fault - in fact his response for the UK was up there as among the best, if not the best.

So it'll be down to lefties, chinkies and commies. He deserves another go.

 

[WATFORD zero]

Eh? We are paying a fortune to exchange light brown refugees for dark brown ones? What does the plonker Farage make of this? Even racists must be troubled with this.



I disagree.

bungle**** got brexit done.
Covid was not bungle****'s fault - in fact he handled it as well if not better than anyone else could have done.
The invasion of Ukraine wasn't bungle****'s fault - in fact his response for the UK was up there as among the best, if not the best.

So it'll be down to lefties, chinkies and commies. He deserves another go.

 

[Jim in the West]

I don't disagree with either of you, but the primary reasons for the current cost of living crisis are the pandemic and the war in Ukraine, both of which were largely out of the government's control. In that sense it's quite similar to how the financial crisis finished Labour in 2010, which the Tories took full advantage of, so it would be quite satisfying to see the Tories being blamed for this for a decade despite the issues being global factors

The cost of living crisis wouldn't be a crisis if the government responded appropriately. The actions the government has taken include:

- Removing the £20/week uplift in Universal Credit (ie, making the poorest families £1,000 pa worse off)
- Increasing National Insurance
- Freezing personal tax allowances (and NI allowances) for the next FOUR years
- Providing a paltry £150 discount on fuel bills (via the Council Tax rebate) [The £200 reduction this year is, as we know, not a real reduction, as we have to pay it back over the next four years]

If it wanted to, the government could easily help alleviate the worst aspects of the cost of living crisis - it has the fiscal headroom to do so. But Rishi seemingly wants to keep the money for a pre-election splurge in 2024. Of course, what do he and the rest of the Cabinet know about poverty?

 

[rogersix]

He post very occasionally on THAT account. More so on his other ones.

has bakerlite returned to enlighten us even more?

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

He post very occasionally on THAT account. More so on his other ones.

has bakerlite returned to enlighten us even more?

Johnny "4 accounts" Genius ?

 

[Eric the meek]

Eh? We are paying a fortune to exchange light brown refugees for dark brown ones? What does the plonker Farage make of this? Even racists must be troubled with this.

This may be a PR attempt to head off criticism of the racist / colour prejudice variety at the pass, as in 'How can we be labeled as racist when we are taking in refugees from Rwanda?'

The problem is, there is no detail. There are no numbers, costs, minimum number, maximum number, anything. Who will process these refugees? Rwanda? Will Britain accept the processing carried out by Rwanda? Given the keenness of Patel to outsource the 'processing' of asylum seekers arriving in UK to Rwanda, I would be surprised if traffic the other way would be carried out here.

What does the two nations' agreement actually say? All I can find is:

'It also emerged that some refugees in Rwanda will be sent to the UK under the terms of the two nations' agreement.' in the following BBC article

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-61137081

Imagine if the agreement did not specify actual numbers...

(WZ, I know you covered some of these points above).

 

[Thunder Bolt]

He post very occasionally on THAT account. More so on his other ones.

That doesn't surprise me. He hasn't even got the courage of his convictions to use his other accounts in case someone knows who it is. A coward as well as a hater.

 

[Pavilionaire]

These are reasonable observations, but Starmer and co will have to find a way to show dyed in the wool Tory voters that, not only are they a much better alternative to team Boris, but also they will not be another Blair and Brown combo. I might be able to stomach Starmer, but Angela Rayner? Count me out.

The corresponding version of this is that someone who wouldn't vote Tory because they couldn't stomach Dominic Raab ,i.e. ludicrous. Rayner is to Starmer what Prescott was to Blair, i.e. a necessary evil to cut through to northern working class traditional labour voters. She will have zero effect on policy, the title of Deputy Prime Minister means little.

 

[Super Steve Earle]

so what will you do with your vote?

Fair question. After 50 years voting Tory, I've finally jumped on to the fence.

 

[WATFORD zero]

Fair question. After 50 years voting Tory, I've finally jumped on to the fence.

Christ ! It shows the effect Johnson has had on the most ardent of hard core Tories

 

[Super Steve Earle]

But you'd vote for a party that has housed Johnson, Fabricant and Mogg for more than two decades?

Your comment about stomaching Starmer is sufficient to reveal your preference. I suppose that in the summer you stomach the warm weather.

It is clear that some people are just going to vote tory, no matter what.

Indeed. But as I mentioned to another poster, after 50 years voting Tory, I've moved on to the fence. In my pysche that's one hell of a leap. Starmer is welcome to try and drag me on to the other side of it.

 

[The Clamp]

Eh? We are paying a fortune to exchange light brown refugees for dark brown ones? What does the plonker Farage make of this? Even racists must be troubled with this.



I disagree.

bungle**** got brexit done.
Covid was not bungle****'s fault - in fact he handled it as well if not better than anyone else could have done.
The invasion of Ukraine wasn't bungle****'s fault - in fact his response for the UK was up there as among the best, if not the best.

So it'll be down to lefties, chinkies and commies. He deserves another go.

I think I would be correct in thinking this post is a parody.

 

[Eric the meek]

He post very occasionally on THAT account. More so on his other ones.

So he's got at least three accounts going then.

Are people allowed to do that? Is it actually against the rules? Sorry if I appear naive, but it's probably because I am.
I can see why a mod might want to join a discussion in a different account, but not for your standard member. What's the point?

To let off a bit of steam and become abusive? He should find a hobby or do some gardening. (Getting a girlfriend is probably being a bit ambitious).

 

[Motogull]

I think I would be correct in thinking this post is a parody.

Yes. For some, that'll be the explanation for not linking any cost of living issues to the clusterfukk that is the current government.

 

[Seagull27]

The cost of living crisis wouldn't be a crisis if the government responded appropriately. The actions the government has taken include:

- Removing the £20/week uplift in Universal Credit (ie, making the poorest families £1,000 pa worse off)
- Increasing National Insurance
- Freezing personal tax allowances (and NI allowances) for the next FOUR years
- Providing a paltry £150 discount on fuel bills (via the Council Tax rebate) [The £200 reduction this year is, as we know, not a real reduction, as we have to pay it back over the next four years]

If it wanted to, the government could easily help alleviate the worst aspects of the cost of living crisis - it has the fiscal headroom to do so. But Rishi seemingly wants to keep the money for a pre-election splurge in 2024. Of course, what do he and the rest of the Cabinet know about poverty?

I'm not sure your first paragraph is entirely true - the crisis is a global one (or European at least). By all means they could have done plenty to alleviate the problems, but the issues would still be there at some level.

Which is in contrast to the other things [MENTION=33848]The Clamp[/MENTION] listed, where the Tories were the root cause of the issues, but managed to get away with less than they deserved.

I'm not looking to defend the government in the slightest, just pointing out the irony that Labour were blamed by the Tories for an unavoidable global crisis which saw them in the political wilderness for years, and now (hopefully) the Tories may be punished by voters for something similar.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

In the wider context, of course. But inside parliament?

I was responding to a post blaming the opposition as equally responsible.

"Worst crop of politicians in my lifetime on every side." [MENTION=865]clapham_gull[/MENTION]

Nonsense.

Agree. But each and every person who voted for the Tories at the last election has to take their share of the responsibility. It’s not like Boris’ suddenly became a lying self-centred toad; he has been like this in his personal, professional and parliamentary life well before he became leader. Don’t be a weasel; own your decisions in life.

 

[vegster]

The corresponding version of this is that someone who wouldn't vote Tory because they couldn't stomach Dominic Raab ,i.e. ludicrous. Rayner is to Starmer what Prescott was to Blair, i.e. a necessary evil to cut through to northern working class traditional labour voters. She will have zero effect on policy, the title of Deputy Prime Minister means little.

Looking like it will be Raab v Rayner for PMQ's this week as Johnson is trying to duck out by staying in India a bit longer. I pity Raab, he will be shredded by Rayner as usual.