Is this another Albion management shambles?

[Rusthall Seagull]

Tony Bloom has done nothing to upset me.

My concerns are very simple and focus on his lack of experience of running a complex organisation like a football club. It isn't the case - in my opinion - that "spunking a lot of money" on the playing side will bring automatically bring success on the pitch. Nor is it the case that offering a big budget to a big name manager will necessarily work. My impression of Tony Bloom is that he is like MOST football fans. He desperately wants success for his team. But very few of us know how to achieve that. I certainly don't. He's easy to relate to because he is a fan. But the impression I have of him is that he knows not much more about football than the rest of us.

His money has kept this club alive and still moving forward - and we should all be more than grateful for that. But I don't buy into the argument that his wealth alone means that he will get the rest of the package right. Events of the last few days suggest that some people who DO know their football (Steve Coppell, for example) also have their doubts about whether this club is in the right shape to succeed. That is very worrying.

Lord B, your post was absolutely spot on until the last couple of sentences.....why you would even assume that Coppell turned down the job on the basis of us not being 'in the right shape to succeed is baffling and stinks of you having a problem with the Blooms

 

[pork pie]

It was "all spin"? Bollocks.

Yes spin. For example, his promise of "two million pounds of ring-fenced money to spend on players" that got us all to support him in his power struggle with Archer in the first place.

I believe that he has said himself that he had a very steep learning curve when he first became Chairman. The same can only be expected of Tony Bloom.

The difference appears to be that Tony Bloom is a VERY clever man, who has built a nice little business empire at a young age. What did Dick Knight do in business apart from advertising bras?

 

[chimneys]

"Give the guy a break"? Of course. If you could see more clearly ... that is exactly what I am saying. Others may think that the money will see us through. I'm saying it will take more than that.

Are you advocating a Peter Kenyon type appointment i.e. a football business brain type advisor to Bloom? Wouldnt disagree if you are, but where does Ken Brown fit into all this?

 

[Rusthall Seagull]

I suppose you're entitled to the opinion that this club moved backwards between 1997 and 2009. I'll beg to differ.

Apart from getting Falmer, DK's biggest achievement might eventually be seen as keeping the Bloom family on board.

can I ask why you think it was Dick Knight that 'kept' the Bloom family on board ? Do you really believe that ?

 

[Lord Bracknell]

What did Dick Knight do in business apart from advertising bras?

He also advertised election campaigns for the Liberal Democrats. But pointing that out might make some people think I am having a pop at him.

 

[Lord Bracknell]

He also advertised election campaigns for the Liberal Democrats. But pointing that out might make some people think I am having a pop at him.

... and on that BOMBSHELL ... I'm afraid I have to go to work.

I'll rejoin this thread this evening.

 

[Dick Knights Mumm]

What did Dick Knight do in business apart from advertising bras?

Is there any greater calling ?

 

[BigGully]

Arthur and others have made some really quite good points.

I think there was an amateur culture at times at the club, something that I think will not happen again soon.

I think the Board have been bruised recently, their judgement has been proved to be questionable and they are of course determined, more than ever to get the next stage right.

They would of spoken to many many football people recently including listening to some of the views of current and past employees that experienced that unprofessional culture.

Quickly moving on those that they now feel were in some way responsible for some of that, whilst trying to secure a manager and coaching team that must overhaul some aspects of the club.

No longer will you get a Chairman casually offering critical views of players, managers or staff to random fans or players offering their views on their team mates or current/ex managers here on NSC.

Of course it will sideline some on here that couldn't help but be infatuated by a Chairman who offered morsels of information about the club that made them feel important and closer to its politics, even doing there bit on here by offering the club line as fact.

I like the change, its called professionalism and its hurting some.

 

[ROSM]

Yes spin. For example, his promise of "two million pounds of ring-fenced money to spend on players" that got us all to support him in his power struggle with Archer in the first place.

Okay Pork Pie - prove this statement (as you've put it in speech marks) was ever actually made. Because i'll tell you now this has never been said and is typical of the misquotes that any football chairman has to live with.

 

[pork pie]

He also advertised election campaigns for the Liberal Democrats. But pointing that out might make some people think I am having a pop at him.

Enough said!

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Is there any greater calling ?

Knickers?

 

[pork pie]

Okay Pork Pie - prove this statement (as you've put it in speech marks) was ever actually made. Because i'll tell you now this has never been said and is typical of the misquotes that any football chairman has to live with.

Oh do behave! We all remember him offering that! Do you expect me to have a recording of him saying it? It has even been spoken about openly on here in the past, with back-tracking of his cyndicate not understanding the full financial situation at the Club when they promised it (which is fair enough, because they had not had an opportunity to undertake due dilligence).

 

[Chicken Run]

... and on that BOMBSHELL ... I'm afraid I have to go to work.

I'll rejoin this thread this evening.

Good when your back answer post#121 please.

 

[Chicken Run]

Arthur and others have made some really quite good points.

I think there was an amateur culture at times at the club, something that I think will not happen again soon.

I think the Board have been bruised recently, their judgement has been proved to be questionable and they are of course determined, more than ever to get the next stage right.

They would of spoken to many many football people recently including listening to some of the views of current and past employees that experienced that unprofessional culture.

Quickly moving on those that they now feel were in some way responsible for some of that, whilst trying to secure a manager and coaching team that must overhaul some aspects of the club.

No longer will you get a Chairman casually offering critical views of players, managers or staff to random fans or players offering their views on their team mates or current/ex managers here on NSC.

Of course it will sideline some on here that couldn't help but be infatuated by a Chairman who offered morsels of information about the club that made them feel important and closer to its politics, even doing there bit on here by offering the club line as fact.

I like the change, its called professionalism and its hurting some.

I totaly agree with all of the above

 

[Perry Milkins]

Good when your back answer post#121 please.

ahem I think post #97 made the point first.

 

[ROSM]

Oh do behave! We all remember him offering that! Do you expect me to have a recording of him saying it? It has even been spoken about openly on here in the past, with back-tracking of his cyndicate not understanding the full financial situation at the Club when they promised it (which is fair enough, because they had not had an opportunity to undertake due dilligence).

exactly! the exact quote is:

'The new board will be investing £2m. The primary purpose of which will be for team strengthening'.

'Primary purpose of which will be for...' is not the same as 'all to be spent on...'.

The statement was made at the CEDR arranged press conference to announce the new structure which took place a full 14 weeks before the handover was actually signed and took place.

In that 14 weeks the following things happened (and this is not being an apologist but a realist - although it will be taken that way for those it suits to):

- the true financial position of the Albion was discovered to be (through due dilligence) 200k in debt once taking into account commitments to the ground share at Gillingham and the rent on the offices/shop on queens road rather than 600k in credit (even after the sale of the ground) as had been presented to CEDR.

- the league imposed on the club a payment of a 500k bond to be returned to the club upon returning to Brighton and Hove within 3 years. This (some people wont like) was paid by Bill Archer as part of his 'investment' in the new board

So this was a net reduction of 1.3million from the originally known finances which meant the need to accept Ray Bloom (and his investment) back onto the board and also a scaling down of all other planned activities. The one thing that wasn't essential to the immediate future of the club was the playing side.

 

[Pavilionaire]

Is this another management shambles? That's a harsh word. Bloom is an ambitious chairman but it looks as though we've spunked what cash we had in the summer. Therefore, any "name" manager putting his reputation on the line will not just have the athletics stadium albatross to contend with but also no transfer kitty.

One of the unknowns is what goals Bloom has set for the next 2 seasons, i.e. "Keep us up in Year 1 and push on in Year 2" or "Top half finish Year 1, play-offs Year 2". A high expectation with no cash at a club in our position is too risky for someone like Coppell, Curbishley, Hoddle etc.

There was a time when we were dealing in "name" managers like Coppell, Taylor, McGhee but our last 3 have been Wilkins, a spent Micky Adams and Slade, so not a good trend. We'll probably end up with someone between the 2, like a Cotterill or Dowie.

 

[pork pie]

exactly! the exact quote is:

'The new board will be investing £2m. The primary purpose of which will be for team strengthening'.

'Primary purpose of which will be for...' is not the same as 'all to be spent on...'.

The statement was made at the CEDR arranged press conference to announce the new structure which took place a full 14 weeks before the handover was actually signed and took place.

In that 14 weeks the following things happened (and this is not being an apologist but a realist - although it will be taken that way for those it suits to):

- the true financial position of the Albion was discovered to be (through due dilligence) 200k in debt once taking into account commitments to the ground share at Gillingham and the rent on the offices/shop on queens road rather than 600k in credit (even after the sale of the ground) as had been presented to CEDR.

- the league imposed on the club a payment of a 500k bond to be returned to the club upon returning to Brighton and Hove within 3 years. This (some people wont like) was paid by Bill Archer as part of his 'investment' in the new board

So this was a net reduction of 1.3million from the originally known finances which meant the need to accept Ray Bloom (and his investment) back onto the board and also a scaling down of all other planned activities. The one thing that wasn't essential to the immediate future of the club was the playing side.

You obviously, have a better memory than me. However, I distinctly remember the words "ring fenced" being used, as I was asked to explain to someone what they meant. Can you remember when and where they were used?

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Tony Bloom has done nothing to upset me.

My concerns are very simple and focus on his lack of experience of running a complex organisation like a football club. It isn't the case - in my opinion - that "spunking a lot of money" on the playing side will bring automatically bring success on the pitch. Nor is it the case that offering a big budget to a big name manager will necessarily work. My impression of Tony Bloom is that he is like MOST football fans. He desperately wants success for his team. But very few of us know how to achieve that. I certainly don't. He's easy to relate to because he is a fan. But the impression I have of him is that he knows not much more about football than the rest of us.

His money has kept this club alive and still moving forward - and we should all be more than grateful for that. But I don't buy into the argument that his wealth alone means that he will get the rest of the package right. Events of the last few days suggest that some people who DO know their football (Steve Coppell, for example) also have their doubts about whether this club is in the right shape to succeed. That is very worrying.

A couple of points.

1) Just how many people who take over football clubs have experience of running a football club? You get a few like Ridsdale who have moved from one club to another but by and large club owners are virgins.

2) Just how complex is running a league 1 football club? Whilst football has particular business characteristics, which in some cases are unique to the sport, it does not strike me as an industry much more complex than others. In fact Karen Brady once said running a football club was little different to running a baked bean factory.

 

[Finchley Seagull]

If we appoint John Barnes next week and make it clear he was fifth choice, then maybe this poll would be fair. At the moment it seems to be extremely unhelpful to call it a shambles when all that has happened is Steve Coppell wants a Premier League job and Dennis Wise has ruled himself out when we didn't want him anyway.