[Politics] If there was a general election tomorrow

[drew]

Conservative.

If Labour we're in power this pandemic would have been a right shit show. As it is, i think Boris and his team have done a good a job as possible in tbe circumstances.

This beggars belief. Every decision they make has been too late. The first lockdown, missing a two week circuit breaker and ending up with another month off, stupid 5 day relaxation at xmas when the experts said no. Now heading for another lockdown in the guise of tier 4. The u-turns over gcse and A'level results, the U-turn over school meals when their hand was forced by a footballer.

I never liked Corbyn and would never vote for him but it would be impossible for him to do worse than the current buffoon.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

Ultimately it's a secret ballot so I'm not sure why it matters, but is it any wonder Tory voters keep quiet when Labour supporters see them as fair game for abuse.



See above, and grow up FFS!

Because the reverse is true of party supporters. There's only one party's supports that consistently goes out of its way to slag of the other party and that's the Labour vote. Conservative voters (big C) are often conservative people (little c) who keep quiet and mind their own business, whereas the constant torrent of shouting, anger and hatred that flows forth from the left just puts me off them. Now that may simply be because those in opposition will always shout louder than those who are not.

Indeed and actually the abuse simply hardens opinion the other way. In what has been a huge irony I do think that Donald Trump learned everything he knows about campaigning from the left.

 

[TugWilson]

To certain extent I agree with you, the pandemic response is a very fine balancing act and would be difficult for anyone.

But off the top of my head, I can't imagine the other parties would enabled their advisors to stay in a job and defended them after publicly flouting the rules, or granted huge contracts to people with no expertise, or been so indecisive so many times, or failed to recognise that the pandemic response should be the priority now, not fish, or used racist and zenophobic rhetoric, or tried to subvert parliament to achieve their goals, or appointed Russian oligarchs to the house of Lords, etc. etc. etc.

We are talking politics here , the place where intelligent thinking goes to die . I cant and wont try to defend any of your comments , in fact i agree with you . But i havn`t seen any of the other parties offer better , in fact on one occasion i saw Starmer being asked how he would do thing`s better . He dodged the question , merely adding that they couldn`t do worse , what sort of answer is that - oh right , a politicians one .

 

[portslade seagull]

This beggars belief. Every decision they make has been too late. The first lockdown, missing a two week circuit breaker and ending up with another month off, stupid 5 day relaxation at xmas when the experts said no. Now heading for another lockdown in the guise of tier 4. The u-turns over gcse and A'level results, the U-turn over school meals when their hand was forced by a footballer.

I never liked Corbyn and would never vote for him but it would be impossible for him to do worse than the current buffoon.

Has Starmer actually made his mind up yet then. He has changed it so many times nobody knows what he would do in the same situation. For what it's worth I think all would be in the same position regardless of party politics

 

[Wardy's twin]

Luckily NSC is just a forum, with a noisy left within it. I've lived and worked through Labour and Tory governments. Boris got dealt the worst political hand in history. Brexit and a worldwide pandemic. He is a poor communicator, but let's not forget he's only been a PM for 5 minutes and I suspect his faculties have been a bit Covid damaged. I'll judge him after Brexit and Covid, not in the middle of a fight for our global position and our financial and actual lives. The Tories may be a long way from perfect, but Labour and the tiddlers will never get my vote.

Boris did not get 'dealt' Brexit he was one of the instigators and prime liars and didn't have a f*cking clue as to how it should or could be done. he wanted to PM you have to take the sh*t dealt and he really has not come up with the goods. he has mumbled and bungled his way through with a shambles around Xmas a good illustration of his inept leadership. I am not a lefty, I believe in a fair and equal society where you can have millionaires but not when people can't feed themselves and see no room for billionaires many of whom use that wealth to bypass democracy.

 

[TugWilson]

Comparator data across the world would say we are with the dunces on both the deaths per capita and economy gdp. Maybe the decisions the govts in the past have made this extra difficult, but we were told we were one of the most prepared in the world and we did a dummy run a few years ago. I may be the looney but i doubt it.

Well i wouldn`t call you a looney , but the country as a whole , yep bloody full of em . We have a Tier system that virtually no one adhere`s to , so consequently any advantage of a lockdown is lost .
Look at the USA , they created F.E.M.A. with an annual budget ( this year 28.7B USD ) and they cant get it right , even though they have been planning for something like this since 1979 . So maybe we aren`t the only dunce`s out there ? .

 

[WATFORD zero]

Toute nation a le gouvernement qu'elle mérite

Reading some of the responses on here today it's obviously as true as ever

 

[R. Slicker]

Has Starmer actually made his mind up yet then. He has changed it so many times nobody knows what he would do in the same situation. For what it's worth I think all would be in the same position regardless of party politics

I think that Starmer's hands have been tied to an extent, because he tried to support the Government in a crisis, until such a time that it became obvious that you cannot support the catastrophe that has unfolded.
It's no good asking what he would have done differently, he is in opposition not in Government.

 

[Guinness Boy]

The government have looked after people through Covid19 .

Well, apart from the 68,000 dead..........

 

[Billy the Fish]

Good answer. I would like to see other parties campaigning for PR, then we would likely not have never ending Tory.

I voted Tory on the poll because that's my natural tendency. I would consider changing before the next election depending on what Labour look like at the time.

I like Starmer and like how he responded to the anti sematism but other than scoring open goals over the pandemic he hasn't had a chance to show which direction he'll take the party. I like Jon Ashworth and Lisa Nandy, don't know anything Dodds so can't really form an opinion there. If they move back to sensible centrist policies I'll consider it, but it's a wasted vote in mid Sussex anyway........

Therefore I agree about PR. I'm fed up with all the bickering all of the time, nothing will change until the system changes.

 

[Mellor 3 Ward 4]

Good answer. I would like to see other parties campaigning for PR, then we would likely not have never ending Tory.

Same goes for Labour - they were in charge for 13 years and had the chance to bring in PR.

Unfortunately it's in neither Labour's or the Tories interest to change the voting system to PR

 

[Billy the Fish]

Note to others - [MENTION=1320]Notters[/MENTION] has engaged in a sensible and amicable conversation with the evil Tory voters and, funnily enough, this thread isn't in the Bear Pit!

 

[drew]

I stay away from Twitter these days. From what I have seen in the past it's bad on both sides, it helps nobody.

What matters to me at the moment is getting through Covid19. I think the government has done a good job under the circumstances. Couldn't ask for anything more.

May be a few less dead people would be a start!!!

 

[midnight_rendezvous]

Couldn't ask for anything more.

Apart from Johnson attending those Cobra meetings at the start of the year in the face of a pandemic.

And then there was the whole boasting of shaking hands in hospitals and his decision to delay a full national lockdown until 23 March which, it's estimated, contributed to around 20,000 deaths.

And then there was the fact that government failed to protect care homes resulting in at least 20,000 of Britain’s oldest and most vulnerable citizens dying as a consequence.

And who could forget our "world beating" Track and trace system. Seven months and £12bn later, it is still not fit for purpose.

Then of course, Johnson undermined his government’s authority in May by refusing to dismiss Dominic Cummings, his chief adviser, for breaking lockdown rules.

There was also the failure to quarantine foreign visitors arriving in Britain until June. Also in June, Johnson began relaxing the lockdown while the infection rate was still high, and against the advice of senior scientists. The restrictions that remained were so complex and scattershot that few people understood them.

But, to be fair, the government did equivocated on the wearing of face masks... in late July.

Then there's the fact that the government has awarded more than £10bn of Covid-related contracts to private companies, many without competitive tender, several to cronies, and with some private consultants paid £7,000 a day. Few have delivered satisfactorily on those contracts.

And to wrap up, we mustn't forget that the government’s communications policy has been characterised by confusion, deception, trite slogans and leaks – even the decision to impose a second lockdown was leaked.

BUT apart from all that (and probably others I have forgotten about...), definitely couldn't have asked for anything more...

 

[nwgull]

I stay away from Twitter these days. From what I have seen in the past it's bad on both sides, it helps nobody.

What matters to me at the moment is getting through Covid19. I think the government has done a good job under the circumstances. Couldn't ask for anything more.

Interesting opinion . From my viewpoint, which accounts for one of the highest death rates per capita and billions wasted on stuff like failed track and trace or substandard PPE, our government has objectively done the worst job of any in the world.

 

[WATFORD zero]

Apart from Johnson attending those Cobra meetings at the start of the year in the face of a pandemic.

And then there was the whole boasting of shaking hands in hospitals and his decision to delay a full national lockdown until 23 March which, it's estimated, contributed to around 20,000 deaths.

And then there was the fact that government failed to protect care homes resulting in at least 20,000 of Britain’s oldest and most vulnerable citizens dying as a consequence.

And who could forget our "world beating" Track and trace system. Seven months and £12bn later, it is still not fit for purpose.

Then of course, Johnson undermined his government’s authority in May by refusing to dismiss Dominic Cummings, his chief adviser, for breaking lockdown rules.

There was also the failure to quarantine foreign visitors arriving in Britain until June. Also in June, Johnson began relaxing the lockdown while the infection rate was still high, and against the advice of senior scientists. The restrictions that remained were so complex and scattershot that few people understood them.

But, to be fair, the government did equivocated on the wearing of face masks... in late July.

Then there's the fact that the government has awarded more than £10bn of Covid-related contracts to private companies, many without competitive tender, several to cronies, and with some private consultants paid £7,000 a day. Few have delivered satisfactorily on those contracts.

And to wrap up, we mustn't forget that the government’s communications policy has been characterised by confusion, deception, trite slogans and leaks – even the decision to impose a second lockdown was leaked.

BUT apart from all that (and probably others I have forgotten about...), definitely couldn't have asked for anything more...

But, I'm given to understand from posts on this thread, that all those things would have happened no matter who was in charge

 

[midnight_rendezvous]

But, I'm given to understand, all those things would have happened no matter who was in charge

Definitely! It would have worse under Labour! Jam making commie, wouldn't bow low enough, looks scruffy, note left in the treasury etc etc

 

[BBassic]

Lib Dem probably for me, for the first time ever.

Labour aren't up to the job and I'd sooner chop my cock off than vote Tory so Lib Dems it is.

 

[raymondo]

I’m a traditional Conservative voter as I think Labour have shown budget ineptitude in the past but I think budgets are out of the window in the current climate and I would vote Starmer. He’s a very bright, decent and reasoned man but a bit naive.

The issue for both parties is the lack of quality in ministerial positions. Politics can attract good people (mainly Labour) but the job changes dramatically if your party gains power. From representing constituents, you’re suddenly dealing with complex national and international negotiations, points of law and bureaucratic influence. Some take to it and many find themselves out of their depth. There are too many of the latter representing both parties.

The solution to find more capable people is not just more money for MPs. It’s a ground up re-education of society, partly via the press of the need for the best individuals possible running the country, regardless of their political persuasion. This is incredibly important now that it appears we are out of the EU.

Right now the options, aside from Starmer himself, are poor. Those options need strengthening.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I think it's true. I've always thought the clever folk are in the Civil Service, if anywhere.

 

[Wardy's twin]

Well i wouldn`t call you a looney , but the country as a whole , yep bloody full of em . We have a Tier system that virtually no one adhere`s to , so consequently any advantage of a lockdown is lost .
Look at the USA , they created F.E.M.A. with an annual budget ( this year 28.7B USD ) and they cant get it right , even though they have been planning for something like this since 1979 . So maybe we aren`t the only dunce`s out there ? .

How on earth can you think to compare us to American where the president was a COVID denier, where people think its ok to rock up to polling booths with automatic rifles where the central belt is as extreme in its religious views as anyone in the middle east.

Big mistakes have been made and that is down to the character of the current PM whose strings were being pulled by the obnoxious Cummings