Ian Tomlinson,unlawful killing.

[I'll Get Me Coat]

I remember being outside Worthing Station a few, few seasons back when Cardiff were returning from a game against the Albion. There was 15 mini buses full of riot coppers, the ones with the black eyes and broken noses, they informed me that Cardiff had decided to get off at Worthing for a few beers and they were going to get a fcuking good hiding (as stated by one of the officers). He said we could watch the fireworks from the Central, but not to come out and get mixed up with the evenings entertainment.

The Cardiff fans were directed to the Clifton were thay drank merrily for a few hours until of course they stated to get a little rowdy, so the old bill lead them back to the station via cross street and surrounded them and beat the living daylights out of them, they fcuking loved it.

If this had been taken to court then Section 143 (1) of the Criminal Justice Act: Determining the seriousness of an offence : In considering the seriousness of any offence, the court must consider the offender’s culpability in committing the offence and any harm which the offence caused, was intended to cause or might forseeably have caused.

They were Welsh !

 

[franks brother]

Part of the inquest verdict indicates his death was partly due to cirrhosis if the liver. A good barrister will get plod off with that kind of evidence

 

[Husty]

All of them?

Bullshit. Some are amazing people who serve the community in which they work helping victims of crime and in some cases saving lives. Other times a minority are dicks, and some are harsh (this guy) but ultimately don't say he set out to kill that bloke. He could have killed him much more convincingly. A tragic event, for both parties in a sense - the office will live with that for the rest of his life when he did not intend to kill but ultimatley he acted wrongly and deserves punishment.

You're blanket comments however, are wrong.

I'm sure there are SOME good police officers, but I have yet to meet a single on that isn't a failed bully with a massive ego who feeds on his position of power.

 

[siclean]

i know where the said copper lives...... 999 letsbe avenue

 

[clapham_gull]

Part of the inquest verdict indicates his death was partly due to cirrhosis if the liver. A good barrister will get plod off with that kind of evidence

No the verdict concludes he was killed unlawfully.

It does however acknowledge that if you twat a man with a kidney in that condition with a blunt instrument for no good reason, he may have trouble getting up afterwards.

 

[kevo]

This happened during a riot after a basketball match. The police accused the student of attacking the officer and his horse. He was subsequently arrested and charged before someone released the video footage revealing what actually happened...

 

[Cuffs]

I passed Ian on my way to work every day at 8.05am Every day without fail he was very very drunk.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

Watching the various news broadcasts and the video makes me even more angry.

If he was being an obstruction, it is not going to help by putting him on the floor in such fashion.

The policeman in question deserves to be punished. Trying circumstances aside, you sign up for something and you don't react in such a way or at least, shouldn't.

Maybe there will be a bit more trust of the met, if they deal with this properly. As far as I am concerned, they have a lot of work to do since the assassination of De Menezes.

 

[simonsimon]

Not one comment in support of the PC BULLY.
At last NSC is in agreement.

 

[mistahclarke]

mob mentality goes both ways.

Notice how the copper with the dog tries to get him out of the way first and says something to him. then the other cooper comes in to shove him out the way for not moving. He wasn't a threat, just an annoyance. Have no doubt the cooper feels terrible, because who wouldn't?

Bully? yes.... murderer? no.... those Seattle cops were far worse and that's a savage beating, just like Rodney King.

No doubt that cooper's actions lead to an unfortunate death, but so do those of the unpeaceful protesters as without them it wouldn't have happened either so they also have blood on their hands. I've been unfortunate enough to be caught up in the Mayday protests while working in London years ago, and if I was a riot police getting showered with bits of wood, etc, I would not be able to stand and take it either.

It did seem vicious considering the non-threatening behaviour of the bloke and the other footage of the PC showing violence elsewhere; he clearly lost the plot.

 

[The Spanish]

What a sad, sad story. The officer is in the wrong but manslaughter for that is harsh. He's pushed the bloke over, not smashed his skull.

if he had smashed his skull instead would ian tomlinson have been a lot more dead?

 

[Barrel of Fun]

Quite. Surely many police officers have seen, first hand, what might happen when there is an 'innocent' shove or kick?

 

[Woodchip]

Not one comment in support of the PC BULLY.
At last NSC is in agreement.

Wll the video My esteemed lab partner (BoF) posted is pretty damning evidence.

 

[clapham_gull]

What a sad, sad story. The officer is in the wrong but manslaughter for that is harsh. He's pushed the bloke over, not smashed his skull.

Hit with a baton then pushed over to fall would be a more accurate description. Since the push took place when Mr Tomlinson had his hands in his pockets (pretty much the definition of "unable to defend oneself") and fell heavily, a smashed skull could easily have been the outcome.

If the same offence had been committed elsewhere I wonder how many countries would prosecute that officer for manslaughter. Not many I guess.

Which I find reassuring, although he is yet to be prosecuted for anything.

 

[clapham_gull]

Not one comment in support of the PC BULLY.
At last NSC is in agreement.

Although when presented with the same evidence a couple of years ago, a few posters begged to differ.

 

[tezz79]

mob mentality goes both ways.

Notice how the copper with the dog tries to get him out of the way first and says something to him. then the other cooper comes in to shove him out the way for not moving. He wasn't a threat, just an annoyance. Have no doubt the cooper feels terrible, because who wouldn't?

Bully? yes.... murderer? no.... those Seattle cops were far worse and that's a savage beating, just like Rodney King.

No doubt that cooper's actions lead to an unfortunate death, but so do those of the unpeaceful protesters as without them it wouldn't have happened either so they also have blood on their hands. I've been unfortunate enough to be caught up in the Mayday protests while working in London years ago, and if I was a riot police getting showered with bits of wood, etc, I would not be able to stand and take it either.

It did seem vicious considering the non-threatening behaviour of the bloke and the other footage of the PC showing violence elsewhere; he clearly lost the plot.

Nobody said murder, we said manslaughter plus that copper agreed to take a job and receive a wage to deal with such incidents without breaking the f***ing law himself & killing an innocent man. I know he wouldn't have meant to have done it but that is not the point, the point is he did kill someone by using unreasonable force so he should be punished like anyone else..... Why the f*** should he be above the law he was supposed to be enforcing ?

 

[Barrel of Fun]

Although when presented with the same evidence a couple of years ago, a few posters begged to differ.

guy that died during G20 protests. video

 

[tezz79]

if he had smashed his skull instead would ian tomlinson have been a lot more dead?

Yeah I couldn't work out what the relevance of that comment was either

 

[Pavilionaire]

Yeah I couldn't work out what the relevance of that comment was either

Intent. If you smash somebody's skull with a baseball bat you've got to assume there's a good chance they might die or be brain-damaged.

I don't believe that PC was intent on causing any physical trauma to Tomlinson other than some cuts and bruises.

The officer is clearly in the wrong. But when you're policing a G20 protest there's a good chance you'll have to use physical force at some stage, and then it becomes a complete lottery for the police.I get the impression there would be far less sympathy on this board if a policeman was killed by a crazed protester.

There's a lot of generalising about the police on this thread and a hell of a lot of negativity towards them, but in terms of police brutality ours are probably one of the most placid forces in the world.

 

[Easy 10]

I'd not seen the other footage of that officer flooring a BBC cameraman as well. It would seem he was a little pumped up for action that day.