Gordon Brown Labour Speech - Sickening

[Les Biehn]

Did any one see Miliband's speech? Now that was nauseating. He's so David Brent it's unbelievable.

 

[Simster]

OK fair enough, sorry for implying that. However, the point still stands. You aren't going to see a manifesto from any party (certainly not the Opposition) for as long as it would be possible for other parties to jump on it and implement it before an election, given how similar the parties currently are.

On the other hand, looking at the big fucks ups, the Tories have been bereft of ideas on how things SHOULD have been solved. My suspicion is the current opposition will just shirk the big decisions.

They've been shit in opposition. God knows what will happen when they get into power, which they probably will do.

 

[Simster]

why not ? if 3 people live in a 4 bedroom house do they use more services than 3 people who live in a 2 bedroom house ?? of course not.

Bigger house = bigger footprint. A 300 yard road still needs maintaining whether there are 20 houses on it or 200 houses on it. Also, bigger houses will have more garden waste that needs clearing.

Similarly, it DOESN'T cost twice as much to pick up two wheelie bins as it does one. So why should a family of 4 pay twice as much as a childless couple?

In the end I think you can make an economic case for either, so I'll just plump for what I see as fair - and a flat per person tax is a tax on the poor, just like VAT. I'm not a fan. And nor was the population when Thatcher introduced it, because there were riots on the streets and 300,000 protested in London over it. That says all that needs to be said.

 

[User removed 4]

I'm not a fan. And nor was the population when Thatcher introduced it, because there were riots on the streets and 300,000 protested in London over it. That says all that needs to be said.

so the 500,000 countryside alliance protesters were right then ?

 

[Simster]

500,000

And about what? That was some lame protest about no single issue!

 

[User removed 4]

500,000

And about what? That was some lame protest about no single issue!

oh now i understand , people protesting about a cause you agree with are "right" and nothing more needs to be said on the issue, but people protesting about something you dont agree with are somehow "wrong" and lame ?

 

[Westdene Seagull]

Bigger house = bigger footprint. A 300 yard road still needs maintaining whether there are 20 houses on it or 200 houses on it. Also, bigger houses will have more garden waste that needs clearing.

Similarly, it DOESN'T cost twice as much to pick up two wheelie bins as it does one. So why should a family of 4 pay twice as much as a childless couple?

In the end I think you can make an economic case for either, so I'll just plump for what I see as fair - and a flat per person tax is a tax on the poor, just like VAT. I'm not a fan. And nor was the population when Thatcher introduced it, because there were riots on the streets and 300,000 protested in London over it. That says all that needs to be said.

So charging people based on some value of their property is fairer ?? An elderly couple who have spent years working to pay off their mortgage on a house get penalised because they directed their income towards a nice home rather than pissing it up the wall ??

By the way - B&H council don't collect garden rubbish - not usless you put it in your landfill wheelie bin - which to shouldn't - bloody well build a compost heap !!!!

Most those who opposed the Poll Tax were people who had paid nothing before it as they didn't own a property. They were angry that they were no longer going to be able to leech off the rate payers. EVERYONE should pay towards the council services not just property owners - unless of course you want to walk down unlit streets, maybe have no libaries or indeed any nice public spaces. It's about time the scrongers paid their way like the rest of us.

 

[El Presidente]

It's no longer true that public sector workers per se are badly paid - I know this for a very fact

Not sure I agree there Buzz, the average salary for a Chartered Accountant here in the UK is £86k, and I'm on a fraction of that I can assure you.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

EVERYONE should pay towards the council services not just property owners - unless of course you want to walk down unlit streets, maybe have no libaries or indeed any nice public spaces. QUOTE]


...or vote Tory. They tend to cut libraries etc and then blather on about how they have reduced the council tax. Anyone can reduce council tax if they dont spend anything.

 

[El Presidente]

500,000

And about what? That was some lame protest about no single issue!

.....apart from incest being made legal

 

[Simster]

oh now i understand , people protesting about a cause you agree with are "right" and nothing more needs to be said on the issue, but people protesting about something you dont agree with are somehow "wrong" and lame ?

Nope. What exactly were they protesting about?

 

[London Calling]

Has anyone been persuaded to change their views yet?

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

is the absolute truth.

And of course there are absolutly no other taxes abroad are there? As I say, the tax in this country is lower than comparable Western european countries.

 

[Rusthall Seagull]

So charging people based on some value of their property is fairer ?? An elderly couple who have spent years working to pay off their mortgage on a house get penalised because they directed their income towards a nice home rather than pissing it up the wall ??

By the way - B&H council don't collect garden rubbish - not usless you put it in your landfill wheelie bin - which to shouldn't - bloody well build a compost heap !!!!

Most those who opposed the Poll Tax were people who had paid nothing before it as they didn't own a property. They were angry that they were no longer going to be able to leech off the rate payers. EVERYONE should pay towards the council services not just property owners - unless of course you want to walk down unlit streets, maybe have no libaries or indeed any nice public spaces. It's about time the scrongers paid their way like the rest of us.

Lets take your elderly couple who soberly purchased their house then. Is it fair that they pay the same amount of tax as say a city broker who brought a massive house on the back of one bonus (made by going out and pissing it up the wall!??)

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Has anyone been persuaded to change their views yet?

....when they wake up on the first morning of a tory government they will see my point of view. Until then I guess no.

By the way, the tory party so good with economics they are having to sell their Hove HQ after a business venture involving it went tits up.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

Lets take your elderly couple who soberly purchased their house then. Is it fair that they pay the same amount of tax as say a city broker who brought his house on the back of one bonus (made by going out and pissing it up the wall!??)

As it costs exactly the same to collect each house single wheelie bin, as both want to be able to contact the police anytime they need, as they both may want to use the library, as they both want to walk down clean lit streets - I'd say yes, it is fair they both pay an equal tax ( although my elderly couple may get help via means testing ).

When I purchase a service, say plumber, he does charge me on the value of my house or on how much I earn - he charges me the price for the service. Exactly how a local service tax should work and the Poll Tax is the closest thing we've ever had to that.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

( although my elderly couple may get help via means testing )..

make you mind up. In one breath you say people should not pay a different amount due to how much they earn. Then you say people should be means tested....i.e. pay a different amount due to how much they earn.

 

[Simster]

And of course there are absolutly no other taxes abroad are there? As I say, the tax in this country is lower than comparable Western european countries.

You're right on this one. Some people are always bloody MOANING about duty and tax on this country, despite them being more or less in line with our neighbours.

 

[Rusthall Seagull]

As it costs exactly the same to collect each house single wheelie bin, as both want to be able to contact the police anytime they need, as they both may want to use the library, as they both want to walk down clean lit streets - I'd say yes, it is fair they both pay an equal tax ( although my elderly couple may get help via means testing ).

When I purchase a service, say plumber, he does charge me on the value of my house or on how much I earn - he charges me the price for the service. Exactly how a local service tax should work and the Poll Tax is the closest thing we've ever had to that.

ok, say your idea actually works....i.e we all pay the same for 'services provided'. Can you tell me why in the South West (where wages are considerably less than in the South East, that they pay nearly double the amount for their water bills....after all, water is water, we should all pay the same ? ?

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

You're right on this one. Some people are always bloody MOANING about duty and tax on this country, despite them being more or less in line with our neighbours.

Thanks.