BNP's Election Broadcast

[Dandyman]

This was published on Monday and is I think a useful contribution:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/apr/26/we-need-an-honest-immigration-debate

 

[Gwylan]

I am sorry, I really think this kind of justification for immigration is pathetic, unless as I suspect your tong is firmly planted in your cheek !!!
.

I wasn't using it justify immigration. I was just pointing out in response to another poster as to how people are happy to accept immigrants as part of the landscape.

The justification for immigration is the skills that many of them bring. My last four GPs have all been Asians for example. I imagine that if all NHS workers were sent back to their home countries, the system would collapse completely.

The drugs gangs are a different case. When I lived in Bradford, the only racial tensions appeared to be between Pakistani gangs trying to muscle in on the heroin trade. My personal inclination is for the legalisation of narcotics but that's a different issue.

 

[beorhthelm]

As for heroin gangs being run by Afghan immigrants please do not so readily dismiss it,

i will, heroin has been around for decades and the Afgan community in London is a recent and relativly tiny compared to the Bangledeshi, Indian, Pakistani etc. they dont do drugs and the heroin trade in Afgan stops with the harvesting, its the Turks i believe who take on the refinment and europeans handle the smuggling business.

 

[coventrygull]

This was published on Monday and is I think a useful contribution:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/apr/26/we-need-an-honest-immigration-debate

Its all down to global capitalism. So how to defeat it Dandyman?

 

[Les Biehn]

Your naivety is astounding.

You have wrongly decided to group all immigrants as kitchen workers or chefs, my point was exactly the opposite.

They clearly aren't so therefore to use there impact on our cuisine to somehow justify an open door immigration policy is silly.

As for heroin gangs being run by Afghan immigrants please do not so readily dismiss it, in London there is some justification for this view and if you accept that much of our heroin supply originates from Afghanistan then it is likely that the criminal elements within that community will use its knowledge, contacts and general undetectability to ravage parts of our cities, with the drug and protect the profits with violence.

I didn't mention any particular profession and the restaurant example is just that, an example of a wider phenomonen (sp).

You're deductive logic on arriving at the conclusion that Afghans are somehow largely responsible for the heroin trade in this country does something of a disservice to all the other criminals involved in this trade.

 

[User removed 4]

This was published on Monday and is I think a useful contribution:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/apr/26/we-need-an-honest-immigration-debate

Yes, an honest impartial look from gary younge , give me f***ing strength

 

[Dandyman]

Yes, an honest impartial look from gary younge , give me f***ing strength

Why is it not honest ? You claim to want a debate but seem to be incapable of responding to any of his points.

 

[simmo]

This was published on Monday and is I think a useful contribution:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/apr/26/we-need-an-honest-immigration-debate

I have just read that and most of what he states is absurd. This is laughable.

"This country has long needed a thoroughgoing conversation about immigration that could raise the debate among the general public. The fact that we have yet to have one is not because the left is unprepared or unwilling to engage, but because the right has proved itself incapable of contributing anything to that discussion that is intelligent, honest or informed"

It is because every time on question time for example the moment that anyone mentions immigration control they are always shouted down by the most left wing person on the panel and the audience as being a racist that sensible (and necessary) immigration control policies are never discussed.

 

[User removed 4]

Why is it not honest ? You claim to want a debate but seem to be incapable of responding to any of his points.

I havent even read it, ive seen other articles by gary younge where he claims he is bajan, will never be british etc, the bloke has got a chip on his shoulder the size of barbados, i'll have a read and come back to you.

 

[Dandyman]

Its all down to global capitalism. So how to defeat it Dandyman?

Certainly not by racism or fascism.

Migration is prompted by a variety of push & pull factors. Policies that don't prop up repressive regimes overseas, promote fair trade, back affordable and available housing here, adopt progressive taxation and clamp down on massive evasion are all among possible ways of addressing the issues.

Blaming "darkies", Muslims, Jews, the Irish, Crystal Palace fans, etc for the effects of a global system is not only obnoxious filth but no solution.

 

[Dandyman]

I have just read that and most of what he states is absurd. This is laughable.

"This country has long needed a thoroughgoing conversation about immigration that could raise the debate among the general public. The fact that we have yet to have one is not because the left is unprepared or unwilling to engage, but because the right has proved itself incapable of contributing anything to that discussion that is intelligent, honest or informed"

It is because every time on question time for example the moment that anyone mentions immigration control they are always shouted down by the most left wing person on the panel and the audience as being a racist that sensible (and necessary) immigration control policies are never discussed.

There have been immigration measures in this country since 1905. The only "open door" is within the EU. What measures exactly are you advocating ?

 

[mejonaNO12 aka riskit]

The Sikh man saying he will vote BNP was WELL GOOD

 

[simmo]

There have been immigration measures in this country since 1905. The only "open door" is within the EU. What measures exactly are you advocating ?

I would like sensible parties i.e the Conservatives not to be shouted down as racists when they put policies forwarded concerning immigration control. It is because the left (for e.g Galloway) shout them down as racists, which they are not (Howard a Jew was their last leader for e.g), when they propose policies that we do not get a sensible debate on this issue in this country.

Because people in certain areas of this country do know there are massive problems concerning immigration but it is not being dealt by the mainline parties because there is no sensible debate that they are driven into the arms of such parties as the BNP.

 

[BigGully]

Makes you pine for the return of Ronnie and Reggie, dunnit?

That is part of the problem TLO.

To somehow dismiss the criminal elements of immigration just because some East End white working class gang has done blags in the past is again missing the point.

With each influx of immigration it is reasonable to suspect there comes a criminal element too, each nationality sometimes offering a different speciality or threshold to violence and crime.

I sometimes wonder if the Jamaican Yardies willingness to use quite new and extreme types of violence twenty odd years ago was the start of the so called 'Gun Culture' if indeed one exists.

Of course it doesnt mean that all Jamaicans themselves are gun toting criminals, but it might beg the question that if we might have foreseen the likely proliferation of gun crime due to that criminal minority should this disqualify immigration from that Country or even offer a debate on it.

 

[User removed 4]

Migration is prompted by a variety of push & pull factors. Policies that don't prop up repressive regimes overseas, promote fair trade, back affordable and available housing here, adopt progressive taxation and clamp down on massive evasion are all among possible ways of addressing the issues.

I would suggest that white working class families, who see their children in schools where the majority of children speak english as a second language, or their children are unable to obtain social housing , but they see 'asylum seekers'( yeah right ive got one who lives below me who holidays in the place he fled from twice a year)obtaining it with ease, or they see with frustration the local health services put under increasing strain, dont really care about 'push and pull' factors in migration, repressive regimes overseas or fairtrade, but getting a fair crack of the whip here and now.

 

[Kumquat]

I would like sensible parties i.e the Conservatives not to be shouted down as racists when they put policies forwarded concerning immigration control. It is because the left (for e.g Galloway) shout them down as racists, which they are not (Howard a Jew was their last leader for e.g), when they propose policies that we do not get a sensible debate on this issue in this country.

Because people in certain areas of this country do know there are massive problems concerning immigration but it is not being dealt by the mainline parties because there is no sensible debate that they are driven into the arms of such parties as the BNP.

You don't think scaremongering by the BNP has anything to do with preventing a serious debate too? Everyone is at fault here and the only party i've seen try and start a debate is the Lib Dems, although Clegg's naivety on the subject has not helped. The Tories have moved to the centre-ground opening up a place on the right for the BNP an d have consistently failed to address a real debate for the same reason as Labour. They are scared to. It workds both ways. The only way a sensible debate will happen is if we get a hung parliament where a lot of other political taboos may be brought into the open too.

 

[Stoo82]

You don't think scaremongering by the BNP has anything to do with preventing a serious debate too? Everyone is at fault here and the only party i've seen try and start a debate is the Lib Dems, although Clegg's naivety on the subject has not helped. The Tories have moved to the centre-ground opening up a place on the right for the BNP an d have consistently failed to address a real debate for the same reason as Labour. They are scared to. It workds both ways. The only way a sensible debate will happen is if we get a hung parliament where a lot of other political taboos may be brought into the open too.

Where have you been for the last 10 years? The Tories have been branded racists every time they try and bring up imagration. Its no wonder they stop trying to talk about it, Labour just smear them. Which was the plan all the time.

 

[Dandyman]

I would suggest that white working class families, who see their children in schools where the majority of children speak english as a second language, or their children are unable to obtain social housing , but they see 'asylum seekers'( yeah right ive got one who lives below me who holidays in the place he fled from twice a year)obtaining it with ease, or they see with frustration the local health services put under increasing strain, dont really care about 'push and pull' factors in migration, repressive regimes overseas or fairtrade, but getting a fair crack of the whip here and now.

Do you think that the failure to build virtually any social housing for 30 years combined with massive house price inflation might play their part in keeping people, white or otherwise, for obtaining property ?

As someone who works in social housing, I can tell you for a fact that refugees do not just walk into properties.

 

[coventrygull]

Certainly not by racism or fascism.

Migration is prompted by a variety of push & pull factors. Policies that don't prop up repressive regimes overseas, promote fair trade, back affordable and available housing here, adopt progressive taxation and clamp down on massive evasion are all among possible ways of addressing the issues.

Blaming "darkies", Muslims, Jews, the Irish, Crystal Palace fans, etc for the effects of a global system is not only obnoxious filth but no solution.

I guess you won't be voting for one of the three main parties then. All of which support a globalist agenda.

I do hope the blaming darkies bit was not aimed at me. I don't support racism or fascism. I am a nationalist

 

[The Large One]

Where have you been for the last 10 years? The Tories have been branded racists every time they try and bring up imagration. Its no wonder they stop trying to talk about it, Labour just smear them. Which was the plan all the time.

Have they been branded racists?

Or was it people within the party (and outside of it too) over-simply blaming society's ills on immigration thereby stifling a long-overdue debate?