[Help] #WeAreAllZelenskyyNow

[heathgate]

Is this not partially NATO's fault - Russia gave clear warnings not to encroach on it's borders? Is this a self fulfilling prophecy? The only beneficiaries for such a conflict would be the arms industry at the cost of tax payers across the world.

Forgetting of course that the three Baltic nations, Finland, and Norway are all NATO, and all have a border with Russia.... so you have to ask why Putin is objecting to Ukrainian membership given there is zero history of NATO nations attacking or even just threatening Russian territory..... in fact, the opposite has been, and still is true....

Putin is simply scared that in Europe, and in NATO, Ukraine will probably challenge Russia's economic preeminence in that part of the east.... macho man won't like his ego diluted.

 

[heathgate]

Yes, but we didn't have the psychopathic megalomaniac Hitler twins (Trump and Putin) in charge then.

Oh, I think Khruschev, Castro and Mao would easily give them a run for their money....

 

[GT49er]

Oh, I think Khruschev, Castro and Mao would easily give them a run for their money....

Really? I mean, really?

 

[heathgate]

Really? I mean, really?

Yes, really......

 

[A1X]

Is this not partially NATO's fault - Russia gave clear warnings not to encroach on it's borders? Is this a self fulfilling prophecy?

NATO did not “encroach”. Neighbours of Russia asked to join NATO. Given what subsequently happened to Ukraine it should be pretty obvious why.

Russia does not get to tell it’s neighbours what it can and cannot do, any more than we have the right to tell France or Ireland what they can and cannot do.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

Again as i've told others, respond with facts not feelings - just an example on coverage around this topic - before responding do some research;

Why NATO Expansion Explains Russia’s Actions in Ukraine - Australian Institute of International Affairs

Finland joined NATO because of Russia's invasion of Ukraine. If Russia had kept within it's own internationally recognised borders then Finland wouldn't have joined as they preferred to be a neutral country. And that is a FACT.

 

[cheshunt seagull]

Again as i've told others, respond with facts not feelings - just an example on coverage around this topic - before responding do some research;

Why NATO Expansion Explains Russia’s Actions in Ukraine - Australian Institute of International Affairs

What is your view of the rights of the sovereign states bordering Russia to choose which defence alliances and economic communities they join?

 

[GT49er]

Yes, really......

 

[SouthSaxon]

Is this not partially NATO's fault - Russia gave clear warnings not to encroach on it's borders? Is this a self fulfilling prophecy? The only beneficiaries for such a conflict would be the arms industry at the cost of tax payers across the world.

You have it backwards I’m afraid. Russia encroached on Ukraine’s borders, which led to Sweden and Finland joining NATO.

During the Cold War, NATO didn’t conduct a single military action. Exercises only. Article 5 has been triggered once in its history, by the US following 9/11.

 

[heathgate]

You have it backwards I’m afraid. Russia encroached on Ukraine’s borders, which led to Sweden and Finland joining NATO.

During the Cold War, NATO didn’t conduct a single military action. Exercises only. Article 5 has been triggered once in its history, by the US following 9/11.

Exactly, despite all the sabre rattling from the East, diplomacy and the odd proxy skirmish kept things in a relatively stable place overall....

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Is this not partially NATO's fault - Russia gave clear warnings not to encroach on it's borders? Is this a self fulfilling prophecy? The only beneficiaries for such a conflict would be the arms industry at the cost of tax payers across the world.

Neither Finland nor Ukraine were bothered about joining NATO until they were threatened.
NATO is a defensive force only and not pre-emptive.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Forgetting of course that the three Baltic nations, Finland, and Norway are all NATO, and all have a border with Russia.... so you have to ask why Putin is objecting to Ukrainian membership given there is zero history of NATO nations attacking or even just threatening Russian territory..... in fact, the opposite has been, and still is true....

Putin is simply scared that in Europe, and in NATO, Ukraine will probably challenge Russia's economic preeminence in that part of the east.... macho man won't like his ego diluted.

Why did Finland join NATO? It was just 2 years ago because of the Russian threat.

Norway has been in NATO since 1949, indeed is a founding member, and has a tiny smidgen of a border with Russia north of Finland.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Why are idiots posting utter bollocks and lies on this thread?

Luckily I have one of them on ignore but can see the replies.

It is pitiful

 

[Blue3]

I would be supportive of increasing taxation specifically to get our defence spending up to 5% GDP and to increase our support for Ukraine.
I would also like to see more of that spend made on European manufactures.
Its also time to seriously consider a European defence structure outside of NATO with the current US administration being so unpredictable we need our own back stop.
Finally I was not happy with Trumps first state visit and this second state visit now looks far to premature especially in light of disgraceful and what looked like deliberate ganging up upon Zelenskyy yesterday.

 

[seagurl]

Worth signing this

No second state visit for Trump

This is UNBELIEVABLE. Keir Starmer has just handed Donald Trump a letter from King Charles, inviting him for a second state visit to the UK. It’s totally unprecedented, and I was so outraged when I heard, I dropped everything to let the 38 Degrees community know straight away. This is the same...

you.38degrees.org.uk

 

[Triggaaar]

Is this not partially NATO's fault - Russia gave clear warnings not to encroach on it's borders? Is this a self fulfilling prophecy?

No. You're falling for Russian propaganda. Russia are afraid of a successful democratic Ukraine on the border, they're not afraid of Nato invading.

 

[jcdenton08]

No. You're falling for Russian propaganda. Russia are afraid of a successful democratic Ukraine on the border, they're not afraid of Nato invading.

Falling for or propagating?

 

[SouthSaxon]

Worth signing this

No second state visit for Trump

This is UNBELIEVABLE. Keir Starmer has just handed Donald Trump a letter from King Charles, inviting him for a second state visit to the UK. It’s totally unprecedented, and I was so outraged when I heard, I dropped everything to let the 38 Degrees community know straight away. This is the same...

you.38degrees.org.uk

I’m in two minds about this still. One mind says that the Orange Tangoman is around for a while yet and his Hired Goons possibly for longer still. Whatever we think of them, we have to deal with them - revoking the invite will have consequences.

The other mind says, f*** it, revoke the invite and hang the consequences. And let’s plough up one of his golf courses for good measure.

Somehow, I can’t see the latter being the Whitehall position.

 

[dippy2449]

It’s a different world now compared to the easy brainwashing of youths back then.
Ask around the young people today and they will tell you they feel let down by their own county. The old war time spirit everyone must do their bit won’t exist in modern times.

In addition, those that queued in line to volunteer were refused because of flat feet or heart mummers. Now if you try to force the youth to sign up by conscription the moral and medical reasons will be endless. The societal pressures put on young men during both major European wars difficult to ignore not sure if that is the case now.

One volunteer is better than ten pressed men/women/others.

I served in the military and can absolutely state that for most of my career my unit was undermanned and recruitment and retention poor. This country does not have the military to defend the Isle of Wight.

 

[Hometownglory]

Worth signing this

No second state visit for Trump

This is UNBELIEVABLE. Keir Starmer has just handed Donald Trump a letter from King Charles, inviting him for a second state visit to the UK. It’s totally unprecedented, and I was so outraged when I heard, I dropped everything to let the 38 Degrees community know straight away. This is the same...

you.38degrees.org.uk

Oh good, a petition. Trump is a total bellend BUT we have to keep him onside, not act all weak and offended. Showing Putin fractions between Western leaders is the worst thing we could do right now.