The ultimate REFERENDUM thread

[cunning fergus]

Cunning Fergus, never

PS Mr Fergus....where on earth did you get those ludicrous Irish US UK trade figures?

Business section of the Irish Times, one day this week.

It was an article on Brexit, there is a general election there currently, and this issue is having quite an effect on debate.

I'm sure you will be able to hang me out to dry with your own formidable array of facts and academic insight.

 

[larus]

I've swayed from firmly in to wobbly.

On free movement of people, I'm IN, but the ability of businesses to move money around to avoid tax disturbs me (I'm not sure the Conservatives would do much to plug these loopholes).

A big thing for me is the amount of money we put in, compared to what we get out; isn't it about £10000000000 more ? What do we get for that £10Bn ? Could that money be better spent ?

What I'd like is facts, not scaremongering and xenophobia.

Read something that during our membership, we've contributed something like £552bn in total to the EU. That's when £552bn was a lot of money.

 

[alfredmizen]

Ive got to say that i think all this talk of a benefits break is a massive distraction and not at the forefront of most peoples concerns , certainly not mine , though i think child benefit paid abroad should certainly stop, lets be honest, very very few EU immigrants come here to claim benefits, most come here to work , but this fact is the one that drives down wages for our own low skilled workforce , and all this talk of immigrants doing the jobs that british workers ''wont'', they soon will if the choice is a stark one between doing a job or withdrawal of unemployment benefit..

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

I wonder which group the economist interviewed? I believe the high unemployment figures for graduates would be pared down significantly if one took out virtually useless degrees such as media studies etc. I'd there is high unemployment for graduates it's due to too many worthless degrees.

Media, that 66bn UK industry which is rocketing year on year. Media is one of the UK's biggest success stories in recent times and one of the biggest industries around.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

Media, that 66bn UK industry which is rocketing year on year. Media is one of the UK's biggest success stories in recent times and one of the biggest industries around.

Okay, media is a great industry as you say. Perhaps it's just not true that there are loads of people who have taken degrees in it and can't find jobs. I know several.

 

[pastafarian]

3 reasons to vote in





Loons and crackpots.

what a dickhead way to vote

3 reasons to vote OUT

Democracy
Accountability
Sovereignty

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Business section of the Irish Times, one day this week.

It was an article on Brexit, there is a general election there currently, and this issue is having quite an effect on debate.

I'm sure you will be able to hang me out to dry with your own formidable array of facts and academic insight.

I cant believe that 90% of Ireland's trade is with just the UK and US. And a quick look on the internet at numerous sites suggests it's well below this.

 

[Johnny RoastBeef]

what a dickhead way to vote

3 reasons to vote OUT

Democracy
Accountability
Sovereignty

Meh!

 

[5ways]

You're falling into the trap of thinking this is a left v right issue. It really isn't.

I think most of the people voting out are Right of centre.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

I think most of the people voting out are Right of centre.

I'm not convinced personally.

 

[larus]

3 reasons to vote in

Loons and crackpots.

Farage has taken the EU to task many times. I don't agree with everything, but the waste and unaccountability of the EU are staggering.

And Boris is actually a very intelligent guy. Forget the public persona, he's far from a buffoon and, in my opinion, is popular with a lot of voters. Yes, I know the usual suspects on here will disparage him, but he has a certain charisma and an ability to laugh at himself.

His declatrationfor the Brexit camp is a big blow to the In group.

 

[French Seagull]

So many questions.

Whats the criteria to vote? Do UK citizens living in Spain get a vote? Do long-term Polish residents in Britain get a vote?

British, Irish and Commonwealth citizens over 18 who are resident in the UK, along with UK nationals who have lived overseas for less than 15 years. Members of the House of Lords and Commonwealth citizens in Gibraltar will also be eligible, unlike in a general election. Citizens from EU countries - apart from Ireland, Malta and Cyprus - willnot get a vote.

Can you get a postal vote if you're out of the country?

Believe so

What about immigrant Asian and Carribbean communities, would they prefer to be out to reduce competition for low-skilled jobs, or simply refuse to vote alongside UKIP-ers and other anti-immigrant types?

Big assumption

Will the Scottish be so determined to vote IN that its going to be damn hard for English outers to overturn that?

- Scotland's population is 5,347,600 so it will have an effect but the whole UK has reached 64.6 million, so as a percentage if all voted to stay that would be less than 10%

 

[pastafarian]

Meh!

meh indeed

if you are indifferent to democracy,accountability and sovereignty then i suggest you really do vote to stay IN the EU.
You have found a perfect ally.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

And Boris is actually a very intelligent guy. Forget the public persona, he's far from a buffoon

he's not a buffoon but he's not an intellectual heavy weight either; he's a cheer leader politician and very weak on policy.

 

[Chicken Runner61]

With respect mate, this is a debate we have not had in this country for over 40 years, you would have to be over 50 years old to have had the chance to exercise any meaningful democratic mandate.

We have been promised a vote numerous times, and I suspect we are only getting one now because enough of the older generation that would feel confident that GB can stand on its ow 2 feet are dead, and there are enough younger and/or newcomers that are conviced that an EU supranational Govt is a force for good.

I have been waiting nearly 30 years to have a meaningful say.........4 months to have it all out in the open seem fair to me.

If I were you I would just avoid threads like this................

I would say that this vote is more meaningful to people under 50 than over - they will have to live with the result for possibly longer. Some of was relevant 30 years ago has changed now. Whilst we were worried about immigration and jobs then its more about benefits for migrants and the effect on wages now.

And there are far more issues than than immigration and what immigrants think about immigration - but to the out campaign majority not much else matters.

Just like the Scottish independent vote its not an political hot potato that will go away with a stay in win - perhaps we need a out vote to answer whether it was right or not? but even then an out vote might lead to the break up of Europe because I can't see why Europe would want to meet our demands for any other reason.

I still think it will be 4 months of debate but a result based on one issue really

 

[alfredmizen]

looks like Boris is going to join the No campaign .

 

[lawros left foot]

Good for them. It is sad that this odious man has latched on to the exit campaign. This is a man that would give our rights and borders over to anybody. He is very anti English as well.

George Galloway has never been right about anything, and, he is maintaining his proud record on this issue.
An egotistical arse of a man, and I'm far more left wing than right.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

3 reasons to vote in

Loons and crackpots.

Idiot - what about Cameron, Osbourne, Corbyn and Milliband wanting an 'IN' vote if you want loons. See, we can all make utterly wankerish posts !

 

[5ways]

this is pretty good : http://capx.co/exclusive-first-draft-of-boris-johnson-column-on-brexit/

 

[Westdene Seagull]

looks like Boris is going to join the No campaign .

Good. I get he comes across as slightly eccentric but I really don't get the hatred on here towards him. He's run London very successfully AND been re-elected.