sir albion
New member
Well on june the 23rd we have a massive day for this great country and something most of us won't ever see again...Lets get debating on the BIG build up
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The ultimate REFERENDUM thread
- Thread starter sir albion
- Start date
happypig
Staring at the rude boys
I've swayed from firmly in to wobbly.
On free movement of people, I'm IN, but the ability of businesses to move money around to avoid tax disturbs me (I'm not sure the Conservatives would do much to plug these loopholes).
A big thing for me is the amount of money we put in, compared to what we get out; isn't it about £10000000000 more ? What do we get for that £10Bn ? Could that money be better spent ?
What I'd like is facts, not scaremongering and xenophobia.
On free movement of people, I'm IN, but the ability of businesses to move money around to avoid tax disturbs me (I'm not sure the Conservatives would do much to plug these loopholes).
A big thing for me is the amount of money we put in, compared to what we get out; isn't it about £10000000000 more ? What do we get for that £10Bn ? Could that money be better spent ?
What I'd like is facts, not scaremongering and xenophobia.
*** Puts his middle of the road cap on ***
Strictly speaking, mathematically yes, we pay more in than we take out. Some will say we benefit from other things such as the NHS being staffed by immigrants. Some will say that takes away British jobs ( or at least pushes down wages ).
Some say we benefit from the free movement of people - you can go to Europe without a visa. Others say this causes issues with immigration.
Some say peace in Europe has only been achieved because of the EU - others credit NATO for this.
As you can see, all this will boil down to is opinions - there really are no facts regardless of what each side says. So vote with your gut instinct. For the record, I'd vote no.
"safer, stronger, better off"
deletebeepbeepbeep
Well-known member
- May 12, 2009
- 22,265
Christ can we keep this shit to the one thread.
JC Footy Genius
Bringer of TRUTH
- Jun 9, 2015
- 10,568
The UK’s net contribution to the EU Budget in 2015 is estimated at £8.5 billion, up fro £4.3 billion in 2009 and down from £9.8 billion in 2014. It is forecast to fluctuate between £11.1 billion and £7.9 billion a year between 2016 and 2020.
Various studies have attempted to quantify the benefit or cost to the UK of its membership of the EU. This is a very difficult exercise and depends on a wide range of assumptions. Estimates vary significantly. For example, a 2005 study by the Institute for Economic Affairs found a cost of between 3% and 4% of GDP while a 2013 study by the CBI found a net benefit of between 4% and 5% of GDP. A 2015 study by Open Europe found that the cost of the 100 most burdensome EU regulations was £33.3 billion a year.
Further info can be found in the link, I offer no opinion on any of it, hope this helps.
www.parliament.uk/briefing-papers/SN06091.pdf
But less free. I suppose it all boils down to how much your freedom is up for sale.
Hampster Gull
Well-known member
- Dec 22, 2010
- 13,465
Why stick to one thread when we can have many 
There are reason to stay and reasons to leave...there, I've said it
There are reason to stay and reasons to leave...there, I've said it
Chicken Runner61
We stand where we want!
- May 20, 2007
- 4,609
Its an issue that splits every party (except Ukip ob)
Personally I think we had the best deal going - partly in!
Cameron doesn't and didn't want to be the person taking us out of Europe so he set the referendum expecting either Labour or a coalition taking the blame.
He's now had to go to Europe banging a drum but saying he wants to stay in and probably expects the country to narrowly vote in but he's going to get a shock.
The worst possible section of the electorate is going to probably decide the outcome - the xenophobes and racists - Its going to be decided by people who have little idea about the benefits and don't understand the problems.
The best thing about leaving the EU is that in about 2 years after we will know who was right.
WTF are we going to trade with if we leave, we destroyed our manufacturing industries we have few resources and our banking industry is shite, what are we going to sell magic beans? We import so much, we have an ageing population and out indigenous citizens don't want to do the work immigrants do here.
Why is our benefits system so attractive compared to other countries? Why does the EC even want us in with all our griping. I don't like the idea of a superstate but I like the idea of a Europe united for defence and trade - IN OUT OR SHAKE IT ALL ABOUT I dunno but I do know we had a result being half in during the financial crisis and that was pure luck not political planning
Personally I think we had the best deal going - partly in!
Cameron doesn't and didn't want to be the person taking us out of Europe so he set the referendum expecting either Labour or a coalition taking the blame.
He's now had to go to Europe banging a drum but saying he wants to stay in and probably expects the country to narrowly vote in but he's going to get a shock.
The worst possible section of the electorate is going to probably decide the outcome - the xenophobes and racists - Its going to be decided by people who have little idea about the benefits and don't understand the problems.
The best thing about leaving the EU is that in about 2 years after we will know who was right.
WTF are we going to trade with if we leave, we destroyed our manufacturing industries we have few resources and our banking industry is shite, what are we going to sell magic beans? We import so much, we have an ageing population and out indigenous citizens don't want to do the work immigrants do here.
Why is our benefits system so attractive compared to other countries? Why does the EC even want us in with all our griping. I don't like the idea of a superstate but I like the idea of a Europe united for defence and trade - IN OUT OR SHAKE IT ALL ABOUT I dunno but I do know we had a result being half in during the financial crisis and that was pure luck not political planning
Agreed
The per capita method of comparison is distorted with Norway as they have a very low population and a lot of money, thanks to oil, so their expenditure per capita will be higher than it would be for a country like us.
Pavilionaire
Well-known member
- Jul 7, 2003
- 31,516
Referendum will be right in the middle of the Euro 16 tournament, after the final group games. In a tight vote you wonder whether what effect it might have, especially if England have made a swift exit.
I think Germany will still want to sell us their cars. If they make trade unfair, we'll go elsewhere, and they'd lose a lot.
We have the US to the West, and Europe to the East, we're not in danger of being invaded.
Indeed, right now I want independence from Wales.
Ironically I will be in France on 23rd June. Wonder if I will be able to get back in if we vote out!
One of the other things to weigh up is business locating here to gain access to the EU for example, Nissan. Would they stop investment if we left or maybe even move lock stock and barrel to an EU country. There are probably other companies that would consider the same.
Chicken Runner61
We stand where we want!
- May 20, 2007
- 4,609
What are we going to buy cars with - Inside Europe money flows around, (property, goods, manufacturing, assembly etc) Outside Europe everything is imported or Exported - we need something to export.
You don't need to be invaded to be attacked -
Same as now. We're not going to suddenly stop exports because we're not in the EU.
In terms of terrorism, the whole free world work together, and will continue to do so. We want to help France with their current problems, we constantly work with the US to fight terrorism, that's not going to stop if we're not in the EU.