Tubby Mondays
Well-known member
Doing his best?!
Id hate to see the shit we'd be in if he was a clueless twat, with no idea and no policies to be able to deal with the shit that we are in then!
Oh hang on.. I am!
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The Right Honourable The Baroness Thatcher LG OM PC FRS lives... Hurrah!
- Thread starter CheeseRolls
- Start date
Doing his best?!
Id hate to see the shit we'd be in if he was a clueless twat, with no idea and no policies to be able to deal with the shit that we are in then!
Oh hang on.. I am!
ROSM
Well-known member
and the award for sweeping generalisations goes to............
what about Heath and his role in economic failure, or Major, even Mrs T, she had number of boom and bust periods, they cant all have been labour's fault? Did Brown cause the eurozone downturn too and the issues in North america?
Beach Hut
Brighton Bhuna Boy
Groovy Gang alert
Tubby Mondays
Well-known member
Who squandered the fortune of North Sea Gas? A far, far worse decision than selling the gold reserves, which not one single person of any of the opposition parties opposed, by the way.
You critices Brown's policy of making the poor dependent on the state, but what this absolute horror show of a female did was put more people into poverty and cast them adrift. And you wonder why people hate her?!
What worse is that two twats who had pictures of her on the wall intheir Eton dorms (where most of us had that picture of the girl tennis player scratching her arse), think thats the sort of behaviour that will win them the next election!
WHAT! Jackanory, Jackanory...fairytale time it seems. Wilson a very cunning and manipulative individual best known for supporting Huddersfield Town, brought us the 'white heat' of technological growth contributed to creating the assets Thatcher would give away (called privatisation). Callaghan great guy knew him on a personal level an outstanding human being, but could not get to grip with some of the unions, particularly coal miners.Intellectually used to take the pee out of Margaret thatcher during P M questions on the radio, very amusing. Thatcher arrives 1979. First act dramatic increase in pay for police and military. She knew she would need them. Set about taking on the miners. Wasted our North sea revenues (just starting at that time what a stroke of luck) by importing and stock piling coal from South Africa. (a pariah and illegal country to deal with at the time..note coal was shipped to Israel and then to here to make it appear legit.) It worked but at huge cost to our future energy needs and wasted money that could have gone to growth rather than unemployment and benefits (note the placing of unemployed on Invalidity benefit so they do not show up as unemployed.)Then through cuts, the planned withdrawal of HMS Endurance in the Falklands gave the Argies a green light to take the islands. Certainly ironic that a cut like that led to her winning a war of her own making and Hey it only cost a few soldiers/sailors lives! So blood on her hands.(p.s are we to see a repeat by Cameron? Cuts to our aircraft carriers and Harriers?) She had looked to be heading for electoral humiliation but thanks to the Falkland factor she won the next election. More damage was to follow, the education system was remodelled on a failing American system, we got SATS and a National Curriculum we set about lowering exam grades to pander to her perceived support so they could get grade 'A's'. Result undermine British education and lay the groundwork for our current need to import skilled labour. Cuts in the NHS privatise cleaning services (oh how did that work out...MRSA anyone?) How about freeing up the financial regulations in 1987. Big Bang they called it.. well that is what got us in the mess we are in now ..i.e 110% or self assessed mortgages hmm! Now we are going to have to try and put that genie back in the bottle. Selling off the nationalised industries, you know the ones that were apparently so inefficient and cheaply run to inefficient glossy and expensive. I just love paying my hard earned to some French or German stakeholder rather than keeping some Brit in work. Then the disaster of unbalancing our economy, we must be a service based economy she said our future is banking and insurance the city...oops never thought that might go tits up! I could go on and on and on about the disaster of Thatcher. How about Major well the grey man just lived off those north sea revenues but at least he started to allow revenues to filter down. Blair or Mr Smooth Labour but I think history will identify him as a Tory. He failed to reverse the Thatcher legacy. He even stated he greatly admired her. As for the future well north sea oil is now in decline but West Scotland oil is about to start up so will we see history repeat? Another Falklands and lovely oil revenues.. Will it all be squandered on political doctrine as with Mrs T? Don't let Scotland go Mr C or England is screwed.
The damage Thatcher did to this nation has haunted us for years and I feel unless we are willing to learn from history we are doomed to repeat it. Just as the demise of Hitler was celebrated so should the demise of the dictatorial Mrs T.
Silent Bob
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
- Dec 6, 2004
- 22,172
Her being dead or alive changes nothing.
- Aug 7, 2003
- 8,090
“The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money. ”
looney
Banned
- Jul 7, 2003
- 15,652
apart from agreeing with common as Mook for once all the dregs planning to celibrate are just fucktards.
Its a no win strategy. Either few turn out and they become a laughing stock or there is a lot of idiots out an inevitably there will be trouble.
Old Bill wont hesitate in wading in seeing "The Protestors" dont have a moral leg to stand on and may well be made an example of by the courts.
A lot of thatchers success was because the left was so far up its arse it couldn't see a no win situation, this would hand thatcher her final victory.
Its a no win strategy. Either few turn out and they become a laughing stock or there is a lot of idiots out an inevitably there will be trouble.
Old Bill wont hesitate in wading in seeing "The Protestors" dont have a moral leg to stand on and may well be made an example of by the courts.
A lot of thatchers success was because the left was so far up its arse it couldn't see a no win situation, this would hand thatcher her final victory.
Kalimantan Gull
Well-known member
I'm sorry, but its hopeless to argue anything other than Conservative economic policies, both now and in government's gone by, increase unemployment and force more people to depend on benefits and the state for economic survival.
Don Quixote
Well-known member
- Nov 4, 2008
- 8,362
Surely that is the problem with Capitalism, as has been seen over the past four years.
ROSM
Well-known member
Yes, but, what was really the problems with her
Actually this was a well structured argument that will clearly go above many people's heads. Thanks for taking the time to write it. The fact that a labour party with Michael Foot as leader came so close to winning the 83 election (the falklands effect discounted) should tell people something.
I wont be dancing in the street when she dies - I wont be dancing on her grave ( as a great war leader she'll probbaly screw the haters by being buried at sea) but dont expect me to shed a tear for the demise of a divisive figure who has done more to cause and define the mess we're now in than any PM since. To see the mess we're in now you have to look at the decisions taken a generation ago. That is always true in life and not restricted to Mrs T
Yes, but, what was really the problems with her
Actually this was a well structured argument that will clearly go above many people's heads. Thanks for taking the time to write it. The fact that a labour party with Michael Foot as leader came so close to winning the 83 election (the falklands effect discounted) should tell people something.
I wont be dancing in the street when she dies - I wont be dancing on her grave ( as a great war leader she'll probbaly screw the haters by being buried at sea) but dont expect me to shed a tear for the demise of a divisive figure who has done more to cause and define the mess we're now in than any PM since. To see the mess we're in now you have to look at the decisions taken a generation ago. That is always true in life and not restricted to Mrs T
It is not a well structured argument though is it. It is just a usual left wing blame EVERYTHING on Thatcher reply which is just lazy thinking. You talked about sweeping generalisations earlier on, the poster has just basically blamed Thatcher for all the ills we now face and you want to agree with him, ludicrous, utterly ludicrous.
Why blame a generation (and Thatcher) ago for all ills, why not blame two generations ago and the liberal laws implemented in the late 60's for the crime and the decline in individual and collective morarility we probably all agree has occured. Why not blame Gordon Brown for his mismanagement of the economy (as Chancellor and then PM) for the financial predicament we now face and as for anything in respect of Thatcher's actions in respect of the Falklands, why not compare this to Tony Blair and the Iraq war and his dodgy dossier full of BS.
And what is this about Foot and 1983, do not make me laugh. Thatcher increased her majority by 100 from 30 to 130 MP's in 83. It was an absolutely thumping majority. Without the Falklands, it probably would have been a majority of minimum 20 due to the fact that the Loony left were rampant in Labour in 1983. You can't rewrite history and say Labour were close to or on the brink of power in 1983 when they were not, with or without the Falklands.
Britain in 1979 was EXCELLENT.
We were just about to win promotion to the FIRST DIVISION!!!!!!!
She was the first to break with the post war consensus style of government. Labour had tried this approach in the sixties and failed to bring the non metrolpoitan country with it. Before her the Tories had been rather patrichian (Macmillan, Chucrhill,Eden, Douglas Hume - very much the old money) against labour who were desperately trying to become the sparky leaders of the 'FUTURE' through the white heat of technology, which foundered on the old Labour achilles heel of personal ambition. Then came Heath, devaluation, confrontation, winters of discontent,
Indeed at the time Thatcher was thouight very unlikely to take over the Tory leadership. When she did, she suprisingly moved away from the old Heath Euro centric Conservative party and became ideaolligally associated with hard line keynesian monetarism through controlling the money supply (which these days we don't give a toss about but then the M0 was a big deal!)
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Having watched the off duty Police federation members march through London today, I would pay very good money to watch their colleagues "wading in" to the demonstrators. Cop v Cop. now there's a riot...........................
That's because he had left power when the decision was taken in 1970
The one political decision that cemented the left's view of Margaret Thatcher nine years before she entered Number 10 as prime minister was the one that left her dubbed "Thatcher, Thatcher Milk Snatcher". But documents published today reveal that she was considering cuts elsewhere at the same time...
As Sir Edward Heath's Conservatives took power from Harold Wilson in June 1970, the economic outlook was looking bleak.
Wilson's government appeared to have postponed some key economic decisions because of the General Election - and the Conservatives were looking for cuts to meet election pledges on tax.
The most infamous cut of all was the Department of Education's decision to end universal free school milk- taken by Secretary of State Margaret Thatcher.
But documents released under the 30-Year-Rule paint a more complicated picture of what the future prime minister was prepared to sign up to.
Shortly after election, Prime Minister Heath wrote to his cabinet, telling them: "We shall need determination and a willingness among spending ministers to accept reductions in programmes which, from a departmental stand point, they would be reluctant to make."
And in August 1970, the new Secretary of State for Education responded to a Treasury demand for education cuts in four areas:
•Further Education fees
•Library book borrowing charges
•School meal charges
•Free school milk
In principle, the minister who became known for her public-spending cutting zeal once she took power in 1979, appeared concerned at what the public perception of the cuts would be.
Responding to the demands to end free school milk, Mrs Thatcher said: "I think that the complete withdrawal of free milk for our school children would be too drastic a step and would arouse more widespread public antagonism than the saving justifies."
She proposed the compromise, later accepted, that milk would only be available to pupils in nursery and primary schools.
Gritt23
New member
Not until we had a Thatcher Government though.
She was elected on the Thursday, and we were promoted on the Saturday.
Kumquat
New member
- Mar 2, 2009
- 4,459
You beat me to it on the Michael Foot comment. Made me laugh out loud. He was nowhere near winning. The only thing you didn't point out was that the Alliance Party (the then lib Dems) polled 50% in an opinion poll. Personally I think thatcher did some awful things that this country is still paying for, but that shower of shit that was the Labour Party in 1983 were as much to blame. They were f***ing clueless.
Hi Simmo actually I am not left wing I leave that to Will Buckley! Seriously, I am however a trained historian. I make my living by analysing the crap out of issues. On a board such as this it is not really possible to reach the depth I would like its more a case of a precise, a summary to make a point. You ask why blame Thatcher? Well this particular topic was referring to her demise, so that is why? If you would like me to consider other areas of influence then please put up a topic and I will give it a go. I will take issue with one of your points. The 1983 election. The polls for Mrs T prior to the Falklands war had her heading for political oblivion. This despite the left and centre left having divided in two. The rump of the Labour party and the new Social Democrats. This had the effect of splitting the traditional Labour vote. It should have been a walk over. It was indeed a victory for Mrs T but she needed the divided opposition and Falklands victory to swing it. The consequences of those times divided a nation. You only have to mention the word Thatcher and look at the response from both sides of the fence. I think that says it all about Mrs T.