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[Politics] The Labour Government



dsr-burnley

Well-known member
Aug 15, 2014
2,583
Who is suggesting that? We're talking about subsidies on investment for new oil & gas in our territory
The figures for "subsidies" includes favourable tax treatment for consumers. So the 15% VAT discount for domestic customers counts as a subsidy to the fossil fuel industry (and also to the renewables industry).
 




Harry Wilson's tackle

Harry Wilson's Tackle
NSC Patron
Oct 8, 2003
55,764
Faversham


nicko31

Well-known member
Jan 7, 2010
18,463
Gods country fortnightly
The figures for "subsidies" includes favourable tax treatment for consumers. So the 15% VAT discount for domestic customers counts as a subsidy to the fossil fuel industry (and also to the renewables industry).
Well no one is talking about 20% VAT utilities in the UK, electricity is increasingly made from renewable energy anyway and its rising every year.

What I would like to see is VAT on aviation fuel but I think it would be hard to enforce. Another fossil fuel driven industry fuelled by tax breaks
 


Papa Lazarou

Living in a De Zerbi wonderland
Jul 7, 2003
19,320
Worthing
Well no one is talking about 20% VAT utilities in the UK, electricity is increasingly made from renewable energy anyway and its rising every year.

What I would like to see is VAT on aviation fuel but I think it would be hard to enforce. Another fossil fuel driven industry fuelled by tax breaks
Yes. I may be taking this far too simplistically, but how can fossil fuel companies be getting tax breaks and subsidies when they are making billions of dollars of profit per quarter? They can afford to pay a fair amount of tax and fund their own research and development.

All subsidies need to be focussed on de-carbonising our electricity generation, transmission, storage and usage.
 


nicko31

Well-known member
Jan 7, 2010
18,463
Gods country fortnightly
Yes. I may be taking this far too simplistically, but how can fossil fuel companies be getting tax breaks and subsidies when they are making billions of dollars of profit per quarter? They can afford to pay a fair amount of tax and fund their own research and development.

All subsidies need to be focussed on de-carbonising our electricity generation, transmission, storage and usage.
Basically there is a big windfall tax on the fossil fuel industry and they can get around it if they re-invest in new fossil fuel exploration. It’s what happens when ministers in government are in the pockets of these people.

The fossil fuel majors just need to be bounced into putting more investment into renewables via tax breaks instead. The likes of BP engage in a lot of green wash about renewables, but the reality is its hardly any of their investment. I really hope Labour stand firm, there's a huge amount of lobbying at the moment and crying poverty.
 
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beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
35,968
Yes. I may be taking this far too simplistically, but how can fossil fuel companies be getting tax breaks and subsidies when they are making billions of dollars of profit per quarter? They can afford to pay a fair amount of tax and fund their own research and development.

All subsidies need to be focussed on de-carbonising our electricity generation, transmission, storage and usage.
they dont. there are no direct tax breaks or subsidies, people count deductions for investment, which apply to any other company. they have some quite large decommisioning costs too, which reduce the balance sheet reported profits, get counted as a subsidy/tax break. paying >70% duty to the treasury though, the windfall tax increase this some, though when the oil price rises the amount of duty rises too. otoh the oil industry like to play up on investments on green energy, of course those are not affected by duties and windfall taxes. some do invest in green energy, trouble is a lot of it is loss making and not offering the returns the old business does.
 
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Herr Tubthumper

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 11, 2003
62,487
The Fatherland
You misunderstand. I don't want you to be glib, I want you to think about what you're writing instead rather than moronically parrotting anti-Labour anti-union bollocks.

You may not have noticed, but under the Tory watch food bank usage has become a staple in British society. There were literally just 35 of them in 2010, 650 in 2013 and thousands of them now. An awful lot of these places are being used by people in work and the public sector is a significant chunk of those.

This government can do something about that in the public sector, whereas food bank usage by those paid in the private sector will need a lot more consideration. Rushing into ill-considered legislation (in this case, around minimum wage or contract law) is the sort of crap you might expect from Reform, not Labour.
You won’t get what you want from @Is it PotG? I challenged him over something glib he was parroting about 6 months ago. The silence was deafening. He did eventually come up with a reply a week later but it was just link so some crap he’d obviously searched the internet high and low for. It was also notable that the link was dated well after his initial comment.
 


Mellor 3 Ward 4

Well-known member
Jul 27, 2004
10,211
saaf of the water
Think we all knew, the Tories burnt the house done and now it needs to be rebuilt. Will take at least a decade
The Tories, particularly in the last few years were a shambles - and left with a black hole of circa £20 / £22 billion depending on what figures you believe. Perhaps the Tories shouldn't have spent £60 Billion paying people to stay at home (a huge percentage of which which was claimed fraudulently)
 




Mellor 3 Ward 4

Well-known member
Jul 27, 2004
10,211
saaf of the water
What a weird comment.
It was a somewhat strange comment - and it's good to have some adults back in the room.

However, it's very clear where the new Govt. priorities lie.

Settle all strikes (Teachers/Train Drivers/Doctors) by paying way above inflation pay rises - after all who do you think the 5.9 million public sector workers voted for?
Who do you think finances the Labour Party?

Tories - in the pocket of their 'mates' in the City and big business.
Labour - in the pocket of the Unions.

Not sure which is worse.
 


Thunder Bolt

Silly old bat
You want VAT on domestic fuel to rise from 5% to 20% as a way of hitting the oil companies? Don't you think it would have more effect on the domestic consumers than it would on the oil companies, who after all don't get any of that money anyway?
We were promised that VAT on energy would be removed once we left the EU.
 


Bob!

Coffee Buyer
Jul 5, 2003
11,593
It was a somewhat strange comment - and it's good to have some adults back in the room.

However, it's very clear where the new Govt. priorities lie.

Settle all strikes (Teachers/Train Drivers/Doctors) by paying way above inflation pay rises - after all who do you think the 5.9 million public sector workers voted for?
Who do you think finances the Labour Party?

Tories - in the pocket of their 'mates' in the City and big business.
Labour - in the pocket of the Unions.

Not sure which is worse.

Let me correct that for you.


Tories - in the pocket of their 'mates' in the City and big business.
Labour - For ordinary people
 




Simster

"the man's an arse"
Jul 7, 2003
54,916
Surrey
Let me correct that for you.


Tories - in the pocket of their 'mates' in the City and big business.
Labour - For ordinary people
I'm not ready to back either of you on your view of Labour - I guess we'll see. But I do know that this country is built on small businesses (the people who weren't supported over Covid) more than trade union members, and I speak as someone who is not anti-union at all.
 




Mellor 3 Ward 4

Well-known member
Jul 27, 2004
10,211
saaf of the water
I'm certainly not anti-union either - just stating facts that the new Govt. will reward those that voted them in, plus those that finance them.

In the same way the Tories rewarded big business.
 




nicko31

Well-known member
Jan 7, 2010
18,463
Gods country fortnightly
We were promised that VAT on energy would be removed once we left the EU.
I seem to recall VAT got put on utilities at 5% after the poll tax got rejected. Its really always was utter BS about us not being able to control it at the rate we wanted
 




Thunder Bolt

Silly old bat
I seem to recall VAT got put on utilities at 5% after the poll tax got rejected. Its really always was utter BS about us not being able to control it at the rate we wanted
It was 1993, with the government citing EU regulations and in 2016, Johnson & Gove promised that Brexit would mean it being abolished.
In the meantime, I believe Spain has stopped the 5% VAT on their energy bills.
 


Lever

Well-known member
Feb 6, 2019
5,443
What a weird comment.
I think the clue is definitely in the poster's name in this case; there was no supporting evidence or explanation for such a vacuous outburst. maybe a thought just crossed his/her mind (what a lonely journey that must have been!) and s/he just had to share it;

but I suppose we shouldn't stop stupidity in full flow....
 




Lever

Well-known member
Feb 6, 2019
5,443
Nothing to do with caving in to the Unions then?
You frequently make some ridiculous comments but you have achieved the nonpareil of daftness there. You can put whatever spin your tribal mind wishes on it but the tory government ruined the economy and the new government is in the process of fixing it....

PS Thanks for the thumbs up... again; not that it changes your mindset (or mine!) one iota.....
 
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seagullsovergrimsby

#cpfctinpotclub
Aug 21, 2005
43,930
Crap Town
It was 1993, with the government citing EU regulations and in 2016, Johnson & Gove promised that Brexit would mean it being abolished.
In the meantime, I believe Spain has stopped the 5% VAT on their energy bills.
Another lie from Boris , no wonder he is best of mates with Trump.
 


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