[Politics] The General Election Thread

[Two Professors]

Taxation, but I suggest you ask Damian Green.

Why would I ask a random MP?Does he make Tory Party policy.I have not seen anything about Cabinet appointments yet-perhaps you have borrowed Watford zero answers ball?Anyway,NI started as Health and Sickness Insurance.I certainly can't find anything about recent protests to do with this INSURANCE.

 

[Murray 17]

Another tosser
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...BMAF6BAgGEAc&usg=AOvVaw3CGOtGIe7lHbDHBNEUyAto
Regards
DF

He's a little weasel. I was very pleased when he lost his seat.

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Exact Damian Green quote

'We all accept there has to be more money to go into the system. You can pay it just out of general taxation and say it's all free, but that means that people who are currently taxpayers - that are currently 30, 40, 50s now - will have to pay towards their own care at the end of life but also they'll instantly start paying for the older generation's care as well, which I think to put it mildly has fairness implications to it. Or you can try some kind of insurance system so that those who can afford to take out an insurance policy should be encouraged to do so, which will buy them peace of mind.'

From what I read, he's saying that the government is struggling with the social care system in later life. Something most are aware of. It's a difficult one.

Current taxpayers also include pensioners. I pay income tax on my small private pension. I pay fuel tax when filling my car and pay VAT when I go shopping.
Please don't try to say only the young & middle aged pay taxes.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

I have no idea what "Momentum" labour is to start with. I know pretty much bugger all about them. Anyway, I thought most of the labour manifesto pledges were pretty good, and apart from the later add on for womens pensions seemed costed.(not that I think they needed to do that, but that is an altogether different macro economic argument).

Apart from their Brexit stance, and I know you dont like Corbyn and his co-conspirators, try and leave personalities out of this, which specific policies did you think contributed to the labour defeat, being the most "momentamy". Which were the most damaging politically in your view? If you were re-writing the manifesto what would you have changed?

The stuff I don't like is Lansman, his attitude, the admission that they got Brexit wrong (should have supported May? ), deselection of sitting MPs, free wifi, nationalising the railways, refusal to use nuclear weapons, 'I condemn all terrorism (but not the IRA by name)', failure to deal with antisemitism yet allowing Degsy to rejoin the party (rescinded days later) and the general political naivety. The political equivalent of Sheffield Wednesday (in a competition with Newcastle United - also shit but in a higher league). I could go on.

 

[dazzer6666]

I wonder how many people have a BUPA policy or similar but still use the NHS?

BUPA (and other insurers) expect you (and in fact force you) to use the NHS for certain conditions/issues and their premiums reflect that......it’s insurance to bypass the NHS if necessary.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

I have no idea what "Momentum" labour is to start with. I know pretty much bugger all about them. Anyway, I thought most of the labour manifesto pledges were pretty good, and apart from the later add on for womens pensions seemed costed.(not that I think they needed to do that, but that is an altogether different macro economic argument).

Apart from their Brexit stance, and I know you dont like Corbyn and his co-conspirators, try and leave personalities out of this, which specific policies did you think contributed to the labour defeat, being the most "momentamy". Which were the most damaging politically in your view? If you were re-writing the manifesto what would you have changed?

You double posted so I'll double reply:

I still maintain you need to win. Corbyn will never win. That's the electorate speaking, not just me

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/uk.mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUKKBN1YH28H
When are these morons going to accept democracy and grow up. It's pathetic. Stamping their feet and having a hissy fit. It's not fair. Wah wah. Grow up you clowns.

And I don't often agree with you.

 

[Eeyore]

Current taxpayers also include pensioners. I pay income tax on my small private pension. I pay fuel tax when filling my car and pay VAT when I go shopping.
Please don't try to say only the young & middle aged pay taxes.

We all pay taxes. I haven't made much of a point above except to say, suggest, that as we all live longer the strain on public services grows more acute. I feel it would be right to discuss this. We cannot deny that future governments will have a huge headache with this concern.

 

[portslade seagull]

Maybe reopen some of the many care homes that have been closed down would be a good start

 

[Thunder Bolt]

We all pay taxes. I haven't made much of a point above except to say, suggest, that as we all live longer the strain on public services grows more acute. I feel it would be right to discuss this. We cannot deny that future governments will have a huge headache with this concern.

You are assuming that being old equates a strain on public services. Many older people are fitter and healthier than previous generations. People in their 80s running marathons.
I know a veteran aged 101 still living in his own home with a carer calling in once a day.
Then you get others like my father in law who died just after he retired, at 65, so therefore getting nothing he paid in.
Don't generalise about old people.

 

[Hastings gull]

Maybe reopen some of the many care homes that have been closed down would be a good start

Ideally yes, but then why did they close down?

 

[Hastings gull]

You are assuming that being old equates a strain on public services. Many older people are fitter and healthier than previous generations. People in their 80s running marathons.
I know a veteran aged 101 still living in his own home with a carer calling in once a day.
Then you get others like my father in law who died just after he retired, at 65, so therefore getting nothing he paid in.

Reasonably enough, you mention specific examples, but in fairness to the poster it is a fair statement to say that as we get older, then the strain on the NHS becomes ever more noticeable. As we age, things don't work as well, and we need the GP rather more frequently -that's life.


While it is unwise to have a ca

 

[portslade seagull]

Ideally yes, but then why did they close down?

In most cases to save money at a guess

 

[Weststander]

National Insurance is just an addtional, historical tax add-on that doesnt really any more relate to the reality of the costs of social security benefits and the NHS. I`d scrap it and just increase general taxation (assuming taxation is needed at all - but that is another debate). Its totally realistic to pay for the NHS out of general taxation.

Exactly.

NI does NOT go into a separate fund, to pay for state pensions and social security. All taxation goes into the one pot, to pay for current expenditure and to service the national debt.

Nye Bevan jovially admitted joked: "The great secret about the National Insurance fund is that there ain't no fund."

NI should be scrapped and the income replaced by an increase in income tax rates. With a person’s record of income tax paid for additional state pension and some benefits, replaced the NI record. Would save huge admin costs and remove an unnecessary dichotemy.

 

[melias shoes]

And I don't often agree with you.

I feel very privileged H.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

An Indian caller from Birmingham just rang LBC to accuse Corbyn of not only racism against Jews but also against Indians. The gist was that Corbyn and Momentum favour Islamic causes. He used a local example where he lives. Maybe the extent to which the Corbynistas misunderstand the complex ethnic make up of the UK needs to be explored when analyzing the election result.

 

[Two Professors]

An Indian caller from Birmingham just rang LBC to accuse Corbyn of not only racism against Jews but also against Indians. The gist was that Corbyn and Momentum favour Islamic causes. He used a local example where he lives. Maybe the extent to which the Corbynistas misunderstand the complex ethnic make up of the UK needs to be explored when analyzing the election result.

It is how most people in Birmingham feel about Corbyn.Jess Phillips did the opposite and ranted against moslem fundamentalists at a demo in Hall Green which confused the issue even more.Hope she becomes Labour leader-the less we see of her the better.

 

[ManOfSussex]

An Indian caller from Birmingham just rang LBC to accuse Corbyn of not only racism against Jews but also against Indians. The gist was that Corbyn and Momentum favour Islamic causes. He used a local example where he lives. Maybe the extent to which the Corbynistas misunderstand the complex ethnic make up of the UK needs to be explored when analyzing the election result.

This organisation that was campaigning for the Indian diaspora to not vote Labour in the election may have had something to do with that - http://ofbjpuk.org/

They took objection to a motion at Labour's conference on Kashmir. They were also active in the election in Canada in October after Justin Trudeau invited a Sikh separatist to an official event when visiting India.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

This organisation that was campaigning for the Indian diaspora to not vote Labour in the election may have had something to do with that - http://ofbjpuk.org/

They took objection to a motion at Labour's conference on Kashmir. They were also active in the election in Canada in October after Justin Trudeau invited a Sikh separatist to an official event when visiting India.

Which perhaps bares out my point. White Brits need to be careful to remain as neutral as possible when involving themselves in the politics of other parts of the world. I’m not sure Labour can really object when it’s opponents use Momentum style organization to oppose its policies. That said, I don’t know much more about this than the Corbynistas so I have no idea of the rights and wrongs of the particular issue.

 

[AmexRuislip]

I think the Tories are on a par with Watford FC, in relation to how many leaders they've had over the last few years.