[Politics] The 2024 US Election - *MATCH DAY*

[peterward]

I wonder now what odds you'd get on a Farage GE win in 2029?

With neo fascist populist bro in Washington, Musks money and his disinfo machine X pointing at the UK, you can bet those forces will be employed to help Farage.

 

[Zeberdi]

Right wing governments elected democratically so the very essence of healthy democracy (except Russia who have never had it), and I really dont think you're ever going to get a balanced article from the Guardian on Trump. Id suggest you stop reading that paper (and any right wing rags too) as you will never get the truth from them. You mentioned Reform in the UK,what threat are they to our democratic process? It sounds that because you dont like the result of a democratic process you are claiming democracy is at risk? A bit ironic.

Let’s just say that you and I are very different places on the political spectrum and suffice to say you have misrepresented my PoV and leave it at that - I don’t want to be accused of ‘silencing debate or ‘stopping you from having a voice’

 

[A1X]

I’ll tell you who absolutely does deserve what’s coming to them is what Trumpists call “the mainstream media”. They’ve spent months sanewashing his inane ramblings and threats.

“Well Trump says he wants CNN shut down and everyone who works there to be fired out of a canon, but what he actually means is…”

 

[rippleman]

Nope. That's based on a Trump lie. Not decriminalised. Charged as a misdemeanour not a felony:

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/08/30/us/california-shoplifting-trump-harris.html

It's not kids nicking sweets here either. Groups of adults walking into the shop and taking booze or high value goods and walking straight out. Reacting aggressively if challenged.

This is a convenience branch of a national supermarket. They used to have a security guard, but the company changed policy to provide them only at the larger stores.

But this is really just a cost-cutting exercise by the retailers. Save costs by not employing security and just bung the costs of stolen goods onto the retail price so us mugs pay for the shoplifting losses. Simples.

 

[raymondo]

I am constantly astonished at how the vast majority of people live their lives like this. Look at the poll on this thread, almost 15% more people thought Harris was going to win than thought Trump was. I find it so odd how people struggle to differentiate between thinking something is going to happen, and wanting it to happen. They are two completely different things.

I also cannot understand why so many people in the UK seem to have absolutely no idea why your average American would vote for Trump. People really do struggle to put themselves in other people's shoes.

You are right, we do struggle with that in many ways. Even understanding rival football fans is a problem.

 

[Garry Nelson's Left Foot]

Is it too much to hope that he goes about the business of being U.S president quietly and we don't have to hear/read about every little inane f***ing thing that dribbles out of his mouth for the next four years?

Can the media just ignore him?

 

[dsr-burnley]

She's a woman Kevo and a black women too. Shouldn't matter in 2024 but it sure as hell will to white non college degree males.

Trump lost to the male candidate on 2020 and beat the 2 females in 2016 and 2024.

Might be something to do with Biden having a genuine political background that gave good reason to elect him, and H.Clinton and Harris did not?

 

[Bold Seagull]

If there's any shred of hope at all, it's that we all feared the worst when Trump won in 2016 and got through those four years. Although I agree it's different this time and much more worrying.

What I don't really understand is how Biden won in 2020 and the Dems have gone backwards, even with a younger more engaging candidate. No doubt to do with Musk and social media manipulation, but also probably inflation and the fact that people like voting for populists and against 'the establishment' when everything is in the sh*t - without realising they are actually voting FOR the establishment (see Brexit).

Regardless of your political leanings, electing successive 78 years doesn't really speak of progressive, high energy future looking thinking. It can't be too hard a job if it can be done by 78 year olds going into their 80s. There is a reason most people retire in their mid to late 60s.

Whether Democrats or Republican, the promise of power has blinded either party from selecting the best candidate. The Democratic primaries in 2020 were contested by a 78 year old, 79, 71, 78 and a 38 year old (5 years younger than JFK being elected). These aren't the actions of parties embracing the future, appealing to younger voters.

Given we then have an incumbent 81 year old where the party in power doesn't usually contest their running for a 2nd term, the Democratic Party was left thinking 'why didn't anyone consider he'd be 81 when we selected him 4 years ago?'. Different with Trump now as constitutionally he will have to step down. But for the democrats, Biden needed to have made it clear he wouldn't stand again 18 months ago, not the sad climb down we witnessed a few months back. Reminds me of telling a parent or grandparent that they should really think about not driving anymore.

 

[raymondo]

He wasnt involved in starting one war during his last term. In fact I think the only president in living memory not to be in the thick of starting/funding one. Why will it be different this time?

It depends how he ends the Russian - Ukraine war. If he pulls all military and humanitarian support from Ukraine, and stops Russian sanctions, and if Europe doesn't step up to the void,vand if Ukraine is then forced to give up all currently occupied land... do you think Russia will stop there? I don't, and many military experts don't either.
It is quite likely Russia will re-arm, will continue to threaten or invade the rest of Ukraine again, in a few years. Trouble/ invasion of Moldova, Georgia, Baltics is also quite likely IMO.
This (well the latter) may not happen until after Trump's term (if it's his last) - so he may proudly say no war started under his presidencies, but his actions may lead directly to further wars.

 

[Stato]

But this is really just a cost-cutting exercise by the retailers. Save costs by not employing security and just bung the costs of stolen goods onto the retail price so us mugs pay for the shoplifting losses. Simples.

Yes and it will be exactly the same in America. They all follow the same policies. Maximise the share price. Nothing else matters.

Quite a lot of the 'wokeism' that the right wing makes such hay with is also just corporate policy. Its about marketing companies as moral enterprises to avoid the kind of backlash that Nestle got over baby milk in the third world. E.g. put a Pride flag out once a year and we can count on the LGBTQ+ friendly consumer, regardless of how we might be exploiting them and everyone else for the rest of the year.

 

[Bold Seagull]

Might be something to do with Biden having a genuine political background that gave good reason to elect him, and H.Clinton and Harris did not?

Trump had no political background when elected in 2016. Both Hilary and Harris have credible and impressive political CVs. Trump has celebrity though.

I think Harris's problem was one of not expecting to be a candidate until 2028, then only having the best part of 3 months to try to convey what she's about and how she would be different from the current President. That was a huge ask for anyone.

 

[raymondo]

Is it too much to hope that he goes about the business of being U.S president quietly and we don't have to hear/read about every little inane f***ing thing that dribbles out of his mouth for the next four years?

Can the media just ignore him?

If only he will do things that won't affect us or our country in any way.

 

[Giraffe]

I wonder now what odds you'd get on a Farage GE win in 2029?

With neo fascist populist bro in Washington, Musks money and his disinfo machine X pointing at the UK, you can bet those forces will be employed to help Farage.

I think definitely think there will be a movement back to the right from voters. We are already seeing this in council elections. However, whilst it's early days, Kemi seems to have got her act together and if she continues as she starts out then the Tories will be much stronger next time round. The question will be whether Reform continue to split the right vote, form some kind of pact, or just dwindle. I suspect a voting arrangement is the most likely outcome.

 

[rippleman]

Trump had no political background when elected in 2016. Both Hilary and Harris have credible and impressive political CVs. Trump has celebrity though.

I think Harris's problem was one of not expecting to be a candidate until 2028, then only having the best part of 3 months to try to convey what she's about and how she would be different from the current President. That was a huge ask for anyone.

In a way I agree.

The fault was that of the Democratic Party for not having proper nominations and just wheeling out Biden as the Presidential candate even though it was clear at the time that he was suffering from dementia. Had the party told Biden a couple of years ago that he wasn't standing again it would have at least have meant they had a sane candidate to stand against Trump who would have had plenty of time to set out their manifesto.

By the time the penny dropped it was far too late. The silly old sod wouldn't sit down and shut up even once Harris became the Democratic candidate doing further damage to her campaign every time he opened his gob.

 

[Mellor 3 Ward 4]

He may end the Ukraine war temporarily (actually I can't even see that!) but he'll cause more wars a few years down the road - I guess he won't care then.

How many wars were started in Trump's last Presidency?

 

[Greg Bobkin]

Is it too much to hope that he goes about the business of being U.S president quietly and we don't have to hear/read about every little inane f***ing thing that dribbles out of his mouth for the next four years?

Can the media just ignore him?

Yes.

No.

 

[Pavilionaire]

I wonder now what odds you'd get on a Farage GE win in 2029?

With neo fascist populist bro in Washington, Musks money and his disinfo machine X pointing at the UK, you can bet those forces will be employed to help Farage.

One of the few positives we can take from the last week is that the Tories decided their leadership election before Trump became President.

Today, why wouldn't Farage must be dreaming of jumping ship, taking Reform's 19.5% in the polls with him, becoming Tory leader, having regular Trans-Atlantic love-ins with Trump, and enacting the version of Brexit that he envisioned back in 2016?

The way I see it, all that is left of the Tory Party is Reform-lite under a fairly uninspiring leader in Badenoch. The Party has been purged of Pro-EU MPS and now One Nation Tories are thin on the ground. I think the stars are beginning to align for Farage.

Last time I looked the bookies were offering 6/1 on Farage becoming Tory leader on or before 2026. That's a shorter price than the favourite for next Labour leader - Rachel Reeves on 13/2.

 

[BBassic]

How many wars were started in Trump's last Presidency?

About 22:

List of wars: 2003–present - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Scroll down to around 2016

 

[Stato]

How many wars were started in Trump's last Presidency?

He didn't say that he'd start them. He said that he'd cause them. Virtually every war that has started post WWII has been connected with a scrabble for territory and / or the associated resources. No country is innocent, but a climate denial approach will accelerate the fight for diminishing natural resources and see more mass displacement of people. Wars will follow.

 

[Brian Munich]

I wonder now what odds you'd get on a Farage GE win in 2029?

With neo fascist populist bro in Washington, Musks money and his disinfo machine X pointing at the UK, you can bet those forces will be employed to help Farage.

Trump’s term will have finished 5-6 months before the U.K. goes to the polls in 2029. You’d also imagine that Labour will get their tough budgets out of the way in the first 2-3 years, then have a couple of give-away budgets to make everyone feel a bit better by the time they’re trying to get re-elected.

A Farage win can’t be discounted all the while we’ve got FPTP though. I’d be much happier if we had PR to prevent the right-wing getting power