[Misc] Rise in holocaust denial.

[pastafarian]

The world at war....yes, the mountains of bodies....that was when I decided that facism and racism (which certainly appealed to me when I was 13) were disgusting. And had to be opposed. Always.

Crikey, when i was 13 it was Grange Hill, Clare Grogan and early video games that appealed to me not facism and racism. Were you in the Hitler Youth at 13?

 

[Live by the sea]

Time to move on and forgive and forget, no need to keep holding ‘remberance’ each year in my opinion, same with Poppy Day etc, always come ms across to me as attention seeking. How can we all try to get on in the world if each year we celebrate death and murder. Forgive, forget, move on.

Because you would be forgiving, forgetting and moving on wouldn't you if members of your family were taken away, gassed and then left on a pile of bodies to rot. Before making ignorant comments, how about engaging your brain first. Only from education about the horror of the past can we hope to progress as humans and not repeat the same evil.

If you think HMD and poppy day is attention seeking, you have a serious problem with what is going on inside your head.

 

[Lower West Stander]

Ok, lets talk about our next door neighbour Ireland which had a population of 8M people when the potato famine started. The British insisted they exported the good produce and did nothing to help their colony. Millions died or were forced to emigrate to America, or if they did a petty crime were sent to the out door prison Australia.

Even today the population of Ireland is 5M and we all know the problems of British imperial rule in the North of the island which exist to this day. Just one example.

“British imperial rule”

FFS.....



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[aolstudios]

Time to move on and forgive and forget, no need to keep holding ‘remberance’ each year in my opinion, same with Poppy Day etc, always come ms across to me as attention seeking. How can we all try to get on in the world if each year we celebrate death and murder. Forgive, forget, move on.

Never, ever forget.
We need to be vigilant

 

[aolstudios]

Jewish scousers must feel really put upon

You really are a piece of dirt

 

[Gritt23]

I know quite a lot more than 20 people, and I've NEVER met anyone who denies the holocaust took place, which suggests this "survey" has somewhat skewed the outcome.

What questions were asked, and in what way were they asked? Has a rise in harmless contrarians, and conspiracy theorists played a part where people question (not deny) some of the details in many things. If someone guesses that 100k Jews perished rather than 6m, are they denying the extent of the holocaust, and being categorised in "holocaust denial" or do they completely believe it occurred, but just do not have a grasp on the extent of it?

If we ran a straw poll on here, Holocaust, did it happen. Yes / No then I would be frankly amazed if we had 5% saying it didn't happen.

 

[Gritt23]

Because you would be forgiving, forgetting and moving on wouldn't you if members of your family were taken away, gassed and then left on a pile of bodies to rot. Before making ignorant comments, how about engaging your brain first. Only from education about the horror of the past can we hope to progress as humans and not repeat the same evil.

If you think HMD and poppy day is attention seeking, you have a serious problem with what is going on inside your head.

This. And as for the bit in bold; this will bells and whistles on. Well put, please post more often.

 

[Blue3]

I have looked but not been able to find the survey and it appears only one question from said survey is being reported

But from what I have read it appears 2,000 people were asked if they knew how many people were murdered during the Holicast and if 6 million was not the response it's being taken as proof of denial !

 

[Fignon's Ponytail]

Time to move on and forgive and forget, no need to keep holding ‘remberance’ each year in my opinion, same with Poppy Day etc, always come ms across to me as attention seeking. How can we all try to get on in the world if each year we celebrate death and murder. Forgive, forget, move on.

Not even at the end of January & I think this has my vote for the most moronic post of the year already. Forgive & forget? Attention seeking??

You absolute ****

 

[Bevendean Hillbilly]

Could have been mentioned before...sorry if so but David Irving (the father of denial) who is actually a brilliant historian has retracted his holocaust denial stance since he found written evidence of the slaughter at the three true death camps (Majdanek, Treblinka and Sobibor).

I studied denial as a phenomena since I found out that I am Jewish (grandmother was a Jew but was ashamed of it so claimed Catholicism) the finding by Irving ( that there was no cyanide in the brickwork at Aushzwitz) was the central plank of his argument. The total number of Jews, Homosexuals and Gypsies as well as communists, criminals and Russian POWs will never be known but the three death camps I mentioned killed at least 4 million in a two year period,

Aushwitz was designed as a work camp and the inmates died in horrific numbers from Typhus, Dysentry etc with the weaklings being exterminated.

Those buying goods from German companies such a Mercedes, IGFarben, Braun, Bosch should bear in mind that these factories were situated around Aushwitz to benefit from slave labour.

I could go on to mention that the EU was the last act of Nazi Germany and was planned by German industrialists and Goering at the end of the War as the third Reich crumbled.

 

[Bevendean Hillbilly]

I have looked but not been able to find the survey and it appears only one question from said survey is being reported

But from what I have read it appears 2,000 people were asked if they knew how many people were murdered during the Holicast and if 6 million was not the response it's being taken as proof of denial !

6 million is probably correct but I’m not sure that all were Jews. The number of Jews killed is likely to be 4 million but that is the only number actually documented by monsters like Eichmann to Himmler. What isn’t factored is the massacres of Jews carried out by the Einsatzgruppen who were less clinical in their reports.

The Allies knew quite early by cracking Enigma that something dreadful was going on but they couldn’t believe what they were hearing so didn’t act by bombing the camps to free at least some of the detainees.

 

[Bevendean Hillbilly]

“British imperial rule”

FFS.....



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You are wrong but I’ll leave it to you to research why.

 

[Bevendean Hillbilly]

The British empire went on a bit beyond the days of galleons on the high seas.

Having spent a lot of time in India recently I was amazed that the people there largely love the British and will tell you at length that the end of the Raj brought calamity to governance and that, by and large, the British rule was benign (if hugely racist) the ordinary british soldiers or instance married local girls and blended well. It was the officer class and governors that were the issue.

 

[Klaas]

I'm surprised that so many posters seem to doubt that 1 in 20 people could deny that the holocaust happened. I can't say I am these days. And like most people on here I've never met one either. If you'd told me this 20 years ago I might have thought holocaust denial was only the preserve of a few nut jobs but this kind of conspiracy crap has been building up slowly for years.

Slightly off topic with regards to the holocaust but this article about conspiracy theories and their victims is interesting, and maddening ; https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2019/jan/23/conspiracy-theories-internet-survivors-truth

I've seen posts on NSC that give some credence to the Sandy Hook Conspiracy Theory. If people we chat with on here are willing to think there might be something in that, I don't think it takes much of a leap of faith to realise people might also believe the holocaust didn't happen.

 

[Dick Knights Mumm]

I could go on to mention that the EU was the last act of Nazi Germany .

I wouldn't.

 

[Klaas]

Could have been mentioned before...sorry if so but David Irving (the father of denial) who is actually a brilliant historian has retracted his holocaust denial stance since he found written evidence of the slaughter at the three true death camps (Majdanek, Treblinka and Sobibor).

Is that right? I'm finding it hard to find any information on this.

 

[Goldstone1976]

I don't understand why people find it hard to believe that 5% of UK adults are holocaust deniers.

This most recent survey simply echoes a similar one done by CNN last November https://edition.cnn.com/interactive/2018/11/europe/antisemitism-poll-2018-intl/, where they surveyed >1k people in each of seven European countries (including GB) and found "About one European in 20 in the countries CNN surveyed has never heard of the Holocaust".

Still, 5% is somewhat better than the situation in the US, where another survey (referenced in the CNN one) found "...10% of American adults were not sure they’d ever heard of the Holocaust, rising to one in five millennials. Half of all millennials could not name a single concentration camp, and 45% of all American adults failed to do so."

Perhaps unsurprisingly given the level of holocaust denial, "A quarter of Hungarians estimated that the world is more than 20% Jewish, and a fifth of British and Polish respondents said so." 1 in 5 Brits think that Jews make up >20% of the world's population. Just wow.

 

[Bevendean Hillbilly]

Is that right? I'm finding it hard to find any information on this.

Go to YouTube. There’s video there of him publicly retracting his claims.

He stands by his assertion that Aushwitz was a work camp rather than a death camp but now admits that the number killed by the Nazis is probably in line with what standard history claims.

 

[McTavish]

Never met a single person who questions the legitimacy of it, and I know a fair amount over 20.

I know quite a lot more than 20 people, and I've NEVER met anyone who denies the holocaust took place.

Last week I popped into a pub for a quiet pint on the way home. The pub was fairly empty: me, a group of younger men at one end of the bar and a couple of blokes in their 50's/60's sat talking about 10 yards away from me.

I was reading my paper when I heard one of the pair of men say quite loudly, "keep it confidential but - ****ing Jews - Hitler was right." I went over to the bloke and said that if he wanted to think such disgusting things he should keep them to himself. He said that I was taking what he said out of context. "No context necessary for anti-semitic bullshit," I said. He then shouted, "Do you really think 6 million Jews died?" at which point he was thrown out of the pub.

Until last week I would have been equally surprised by the results of the poll - I had never met anyone who denied either the fact or the scale of the holocaust - but I think that until recently, most people who hold these views have kept them to themselves, it now seems that some people feel more emboldened to voice their hatred.

 

[Bevendean Hillbilly]

Is that right? I'm finding it hard to find any information on this.

He has found direct communications between Majdanek, Sobibor and Treblinka and Eichmann which state clearly the millions gassed and burned in huge open pits there.

To this day a walk in the woods uncovers bone, teeth and other fragments of the millions murdered there.