[Albion] Penalty or not so much?

[Berty23]

Watch the Sky sports replay angles to see best. Not the above. He’s late and essentially head butts JP. It’s much less a clash of heads and more a late dangerous challenge via headbutt.

This is the bit they ignored on motd. Just because Saliba has the ball headed in a way that happened to hit him it was ball to head rather than his head to ball. He clattered him.

 

[Berty23]

The highlight before was Pervis winning a clear header against rice but was rightly penalised for a foul because he got ball but fouled him. In fact Pervis actively headed the ball rather than the ball hitting his head. Both were fouls.

 

[Oh_aye]

I have a neutral view of officials. I don't assume bias and just accept decisions, unless there was an obvious error. I saw two in this game, one where Minteh was denied progress for a foul I felt he didn't commit. Another where Pervis really should have been pulled up and booked for an aerial lunge into Rice.

I tried an experiment in the second half. And that was to view the ref's game through the eyes of a partisan Arsenal fan. It only lasted a few minutes. I found this alternative me moaning about everything and anything. He was clearly a Liverpool fan...

To me this demonstrates how it is impossible to have a rational debate about refereeing. Folk say European refs are best. But that is only because, ironically, they view them through neutral eyes. Taylor, as a point of note, is one of Europe's highest ranked officials (Nations league Final and Europa League Final)- although I think Spain and Germany have the most elite referees at present.

You did a controlled experiment in your own brain. Impressive!

I just did one as well. Just got the vidi printer readouts and the results are conclusive. It says 'he's a f*king moron'.

 

[oldboyroy]

I couldn't believe they said that Saliba headed the ball - he bloody didn't.

Joao Pedro got there first and the ball was deflected onto Saliba's head as he followed through and clattered into Joao Pedro...

Exactly this. The ball deflected off his head rather than him heading it

 

[London Irish]

There was a more recent example of one of our players touching the ball and then tripping a player in follow through and it being given a pen. Quite a few on here took the Arteta position that any touch on the ball allows you to do what you like afterwards. I wasn’t convinced. It was at the Amex in the past couple of years in front of south stand away fans - think it might have been Lamptey? (But I’m not sure)

 

[Affy]

It’s not so much the penalty it’s the f*** off Arteta I voted for.

But it was a pen. Soft. But a pen. Regardless, f*** off Arteta.

 

[Littlemo]

Tbh I don't think it is and I’d be upset if it was given against us. It was just both going for the ball and I think headers are harder to get out of than tackles, once you commit to it that’s it really.

I voted yes in the poll though, because I could never be #TeamArteta

 

[BN41Albion]

This is the bit they ignored on motd. Just because Saliba has the ball headed in a way that happened to hit him it was ball to head rather than his head to ball. He clattered him.

Funny how motd pundits all said no pen whilst sky sports pundits all said pen

 

[portlock seagull]

Funny how motd pundits all said no pen whilst sky sports pundits all said pen

It wasn’t but then neither was Villas. So they got lucky then as did we tonight. Swings and roundabouts.

 

[Slum_Wolf]

There was a more recent example of one of our players touching the ball and then tripping a player in follow through and it being given a pen. Quite a few on here took the Arteta position that any touch on the ball allows you to do what you like afterwards. I wasn’t convinced. It was at the Amex in the past couple of years in front of south stand away fans - think it might have been Lamptey? (But I’m not sure)

This game? Lamptey 'fouled' Jesus after touching the ball first...

Brighton 0-3 Arsenal: Bukayo Saka, Kai Havertz, Leandro Trossard goals send Gunners top of Premier League

Report and free match highlights as Arsenal move top of the Premier League with victory at Brighton; Bukayo Saka scores first-half penalty after Tariq Lamptey brings down Gabriel Jesus; Kai Havertz doubled Arsenals leading second half; Leandro Trossard adds late third against former club

www.skysports.com

 

[Reagulls]

MOTD say never a penalty. To which I say "time for a clearout BBC, let's get some brains on the show".

I’ve not watched tonight’s MOTD yet or the one with us against villa, what was the general consensus from MOTD about the villa penalty against us?

 

[trueblue]

At Villa Pedro mistimed his kick and caught an opponent with the follow through. That was a penalty, apparently. This week, Saliba mistimes his header and butts Pedro. Equally unfortunate - but, if the Villa decision was right, has to be a penalty too.

 

[Wozza]

 

[London Irish]

This game? Lamptey 'fouled' Jesus after touching the ball first...

Brighton 0-3 Arsenal: Bukayo Saka, Kai Havertz, Leandro Trossard goals send Gunners top of Premier League

Report and free match highlights as Arsenal move top of the Premier League with victory at Brighton; Bukayo Saka scores first-half penalty after Tariq Lamptey brings down Gabriel Jesus; Kai Havertz doubled Arsenals leading second half; Leandro Trossard adds late third against former club

www.skysports.com

Ha hilarious it was Arsenal

 

[Yes Chef]

It's not only a pen but Saliba should have been booked as well

 

[METALMICKY]

Probably the best simplistic way to explain why it is a penalty is to ask the question that if the same scenario happens with the feet is it a foul? Of course it is. Pedro nudges ball away and Saliba arrives late and kicks his foot. A foul all day and and even if it's accidental and with a genuine attempt to play the ball is still irrelevant. And as people have pointed out if the Villa penalty against Pedro was given then this decision was correct.

The only concession I would make is that I doubt VAR would have intervened had it not been given.

 

[Triggaaar]

The highlight before was Pervis winning a clear header against rice but was rightly penalised for a foul because he got ball but fouled him. In fact Pervis actively headed the ball rather than the ball hitting his head. Both were fouls.

Just thought the same when I saw that on MOTD. Estupinan won the ball, but he wiped out Rice, so a foul was given. Much like the penalty.

 

[Triggaaar]

Tbh I don't think it is and I’d be upset if it was given against us. It was just both going for the ball and I think headers are harder to get out of than tackles, once you commit to it that’s it really.

So you're saying that it shouldn't count because headers are harder to get out of. Which means that when there's a clash of legs, we need to judge whether or not the defender could have got out of it? No, that's bloody stupid. Sometimes a defender is just unlucky when they catch an opponent and there's no way they could pull out of it, but it's a pen because they've caught them. This is the same.

 

[Triggaaar]

Put it this way: if a defender kicks an opponents leg inside their box, it's a penalty. If that defender had slightly glanced the ball before contact, would that stop it being a penalty? No.

So why would this be different?

This game? Lamptey 'fouled' Jesus after touching the ball first...

Brighton 0-3 Arsenal: Bukayo Saka, Kai Havertz, Leandro Trossard goals send Gunners top of Premier League

Report and free match highlights as Arsenal move top of the Premier League with victory at Brighton; Bukayo Saka scores first-half penalty after Tariq Lamptey brings down Gabriel Jesus; Kai Havertz doubled Arsenals leading second half; Leandro Trossard adds late third against former club

www.skysports.com

Perfect, thank you. Player glances the ball, but follows through and fouls the opponent. How the hell is today's penalty any different?

 

[brighton_tom]

The image used in that Telegraph article shows exactly why I can understand the pen being given. Look at how the contact on JP ends up. You cant jump in for a header, mistime it, and smash someone in the face with a headbutt. The replays on the sky sports website show it very clearly.