[News] Nigel Farage and Reform

[Nobby]

The unassimilated and hostile.

How can you tell them apart?
Is there some sort of sign?

 

[Eric the meek]

The unassimilated and hostile.

Half the first nation population then.

 

[WATFORD zero]

If I were to vote for Reform it would be as a protest vote, not as support for Farage. The differences between the other parties are only playing round the edges - essentially they're all supporters of tax and spend and tax some more. They bleed the productive sector of the economy dry, and then say they want to go for growth. The shut down the oil industry and import oil instead and claim they are doing good for the environment. It's universal.

No way is Farage going to win, but if he gets votes it might make the other parties (well, the Conservatives at least) realise that being Conservative would be a good way to get Conservative votes. Their entire election campaign is "we're bad but Labour would be worse" and Labour's is "the Tories are bad and we couldn't be worse". Liberal election campaign is "watch me go down this zipwire into the pool" and SNP's is "we hate the English".

Well him and his candidates have certainly wrapped up the racists, facisists, homophobes, islamophobes, misogynists, antisemites, nazi sympathisers, Putin supporters, Trump supporters, Andrew Tate supporters and conspiracy theorists so I'm sure a few of the shyer element amongst them will be claiming they are doing it as a 'protest vote'

 

[Thunder Bolt]

 

[TomandJerry]

Leaving the ECHR would also be the same as flushing the Good Friday agreement down the toilet?

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

to put it another way, if the tactical vote site says vote Reform to keep out the Tory, do you follow that?

Christ no. I'd deffo vote tory to keep reform out. And I'm a labour member.

 

[A1X]

Obviously only two polls but looks like “Leave that nice Mr Putin alone” isn’t going down terribly well with the electorate

 

[WATFORD zero]

Leaving the ECHR would also be the same as flushing the Good Friday agreement down the toilet?

Yes it would. But I don't think you should make people who want to get rid of the ECHR look as if they don't know what they're talking about

 

[Crawley Dingo]

Obviously only two polls but looks like “Leave that nice Mr Putin alone” isn’t going down terribly well with the electorate

Before the lies about Russia, 21st to 24th and an outlier poll. Polling is a bit like reading tea leaves and often wrong.
Try sticking to one company not ones that favour your political biases.

 

[A1X]

 

[Baldseagull]

Looking at his head, he either was a forceps delivery, or fell under a bus, we have to give him some leeway for the probable brain damage.

 

[worthingseagull123]

You do know that Farage lies ? Like when he said Brexit would lower/stop immigration

And Farage's financial backers would benefit hugely if Britons decided to give up their rights under the ECHR.

If you are really concerned about 'illegal' immigrants and asylum seekers you should simply encourage the next Government to reverse the four steps taken by the current Government in order to create the whole people risking their lives in boats nightmare which simply didn't exist before 2018.

1. Reinstate the ability to claim Asylum from abroad.
2. Re-open the closed legal Asylum routes to claimants.
3. Start working with Interpol again to target people traffickers
4. Increase the numbers of caseworkers processing applications, get rid of the backlog, get approved and working or sent back (not that they would be here see 1.)
And then Britons won't have to give up any of their hard earned rights and we won't be wasting money on Rwanda, camps, barges, hotels etc etc

Surely what we want is fewer people coming to the UK to seek asylum? When you talk about wasting money, what percentage of those that have been granted refugees status are long-term unemployed and a financial burden to taxpayers? I assume you have the figures?

When did the UK ever allow people to claim asylum in the UK from abroad? We had various UNHCR settlement schemes, but we’ve never offered people the opportunity to claim asylum from outside the UK.

You are right though, we need more caseworkers and better decision makers (why do we grant 75% of applications when the EU average is less than 40%). We also need mass roll out of immigration detention centres where we can keep failed asylum seekers detained until deported. Some sort of fast track scheme for all asylum seekers would be best.

 

[Baldseagull]

Surely what we want is fewer people coming to the UK to seek asylum? When you talk about wasting money, what percentage of those that have been granted refugees status are long-term unemployed and a financial burden to taxpayers? I assume you have the figures?

When did the UK ever allow people to claim asylum in the UK from abroad? We had various UNHCR settlement schemes, but we’ve never offered people the opportunity to claim asylum from outside the UK.

You are right though, we need more caseworkers and better decision makers (why do we grant 75% of applications when the EU average is less than 40%). We also need mass roll out of immigration detention centres where we can keep failed asylum seekers detained until deported. Some sort of fast track scheme for all asylum seekers would be best.

Beware of the statistics, UK does grant around 75%, but only 65% on the first application, the EU average is 40% on the first application. There are some factors that affect that, e.g. Spain has a first time asylum approval rate of 12%, but it grants about half of refugees right to remain on a slightly different basis.
There is a problem of each country having different systems, so if you want to claim asylum and hope to bring your Family in, it takes months in the UK, compared to years in some other countries.
But mostly, people want to get somewhere they can speak the language, so Spain gets more South Americans, France gets more Africans, etc.

 

[WATFORD zero]

Surely what we want is fewer people coming to the UK to seek asylum? When you talk about wasting money, what percentage of those that have been granted refugees status are long-term unemployed and a financial burden to taxpayers? I assume you have the figures?

When did the UK ever allow people to claim asylum in the UK from abroad? We had various UNHCR settlement schemes, but we’ve never offered people the opportunity to claim asylum from outside the UK.

You are right though, we need more caseworkers and better decision makers (why do we grant 75% of applications when the EU average is less than 40%). We also need mass roll out of immigration detention centres where we can keep failed asylum seekers detained until deported. Some sort of fast track scheme for all asylum seekers would be best.

This Government closed the option for claiming asylum while abroad in September 2011. For decades we always had asylum schemes where people could claim asylum, whilst abroad, get their claims processed and get allowed in if their claim was valid. Nearly 12 years ago we stopped accepting Asylum requests from abroad and insisted the person had to be in the UK, then gradually closed various safe and legal routes forcing people onto boats.

As a signatory to the 1951 Refugee Convention, the UK fully considers all asylum applications lodged in the UK. However, the UK’s international obligations under the Convention do not extend to the consideration of asylum applications lodged abroad and there is no provision in our Immigration Rules for someone abroad to be given permission to travel to the UK to seek asylum. The policy guidance on the discretionary referral to the UK Border Agency of applications for asylum by individuals in a third country who have not been recognised as refugees by another country or by the UNHCR under its mandate, has been withdrawn. No applications will be considered by a UK visa-issuing post or by the UK Border Agency pending a review of the policy and guidance.

20 September 2011

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/5a747ee940f0b604dd7ae602/applicationsfromabroad.pdf

Applying for Asylum while abroad was stopped by the Government when Cameron was PM

The money spent on the Rwandan scheme so far (with no asylum seekers having gone there under the scheme, but 15 Rwandan asylum seekers having come to the UK ) is sufficient to have cleared the total backlog of asylum seekers 3 times over with money to spare. There is no need for 'immigration detention centres', Rwanda, barges, hotels, people risking their lives in small boats if the Government simply run a proper Asylum system, as was the case before they came to power.

And here's some figures for what this Government has done to Asylum numbers

Boat Crossings
(Numbers weren't recorded prior to 2018 as the government thought them inconsequential).
2018 - 299
2019 - 1,890
2020 - 8,466
2021 - 28,526
2022 - 45,755

Asylum Backlog
2012 - 9,800
2018 - 27,000
2022 - 161,000

And some 'legal' immigration statistics (NOT asylum) for this Government

How do you think we have got to this 'crisis' ? Gross incompetence by the Government or did they have another reason for taking all these measured steps over a significant number of years to get us here ?

 

[A1X]

Before the lies about Russia, 21st to 24th and an outlier poll. Polling is a bit like reading tea leaves and often wrong.
Try sticking to one company not ones that favour your political biases.

The 21st was the date of those lies about Russia from Farage, so it falls slap bang at the start of this.

Worth noting more polling of this period has shown Reform dropping 2 points, and in the interests of balance one has shown no change. None have shown an increase.

 

[nicko31]

Before the lies about Russia, 21st to 24th and an outlier poll. Polling is a bit like reading tea leaves and often wrong.
Try sticking to one company not ones that favour your political biases.

Do you think his Russia comments will give him a boost?

 

[BadFish]

The 21st was the date of those lies about Russia from Farage, so it falls slap bang at the start of this.

Worth noting more polling of this period has shown Reform dropping 2 points, and in the interests of balance one has shown no change. None have shown an increase.

Crawley Dingo is here to put the case for Reform and Farage so we can expect them to increase by a few points.

 

[Baldseagull]

Applying for Asylum while abroad was stopped by the Government when Cameron was PM

The money spent on the Rwandan scheme so far (with no asylum seekers having gone there under the scheme, but 15 Rwandan asylum seekers having come to the UK ) is sufficient to have cleared the total backlog of asylum seekers 3 times over with money to spare. There is no need for 'immigration detention centres', Rwanda, barges, hotels, people risking their lives in small boats if the Government simply run a proper Asylum system, as was the case before they came to power.

And here's some figures for what this Government has done to Asylum numbers

Boat Crossings
(Numbers weren't recorded prior to 2018 as the government thought them inconsequential).
2018 - 299
2019 - 1,890
2020 - 8,466
2021 - 28,526
2022 - 45,755

Asylum Backlog
2012 - 9,800
2018 - 27,000
2022 - 161,000

And some 'legal' immigration statistics (NOT asylum) for this Government

View attachment 184696


How do you think we have got to this 'crisis' ? Gross incompetence by the Government or did they have another reason for taking all these measured steps over a significant number of years to get us here ?

I can't remember where I saw it, but an economist had estimated that all economic growth in the UK last year was accounted for entirely by immigration, both students and workers.

 

[Dick Swiveller]

Crawley Dingo is here to put the case for Reform and Farage so we can expect them to increase by a few points.

Quite apt given the Looney nature of Farage

 

[Peteinblack]

Looking at his head, he either was a forceps delivery, or fell under a bus, we have to give him some leeway for the probable brain damage.

Or maybe created in a test-tube!