[Politics] Lee Anderson goes full Oswald Mosely

[The Antikythera Mechanism]

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Showing my age but back in the late 70's & early 80's we had an actual large scale Far Right/Fascist/Nazi/Racist problem. The National Front etc. This hysterical over reaction to anything to the right of the Guardian viewpoint is ridiculous. Fair enough people don't like different points of view but smearing everyone you don't agree with with these kind of labels is counter-productive. There are still some real Far-right nutters about but Reform ain't them!

The National Front, you say?
Tell me the differences in policies between the Tories, Reform and the National Front. PS Change Common Market to EU.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

You say that but Ashfield voted Brexit 70/30, so there are enough ignorant plums there who are too stupid to see that he's a tedious, populist, opportunist who is more concerned about his loss of income than anything else.

I predict that a large chunk of those that are claiming to vote reform will end up voting Tories, when it comes to it they won't want Labour in.

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

Showing my age but back in the late 70's & early 80's we had an actual large scale Far Right/Fascist/Nazi/Racist problem. The National Front etc. This hysterical over reaction to anything to the right of the Guardian viewpoint is ridiculous. Fair enough people don't like different points of view but smearing everyone you don't agree with with these kind of labels is counter-productive. There are still some real Far-right nutters about but Reform ain't them!

Agree with this.

What we don't have is the organised militarilsm which is normally associated with fascism. I don't think the occasional Braverman inspired drunken meathead, football thug, statue protection mob currently count. But I'd accept the point this is a situation to be keeping an eye on

In this day and age, risks abound and cool heads are required on all sides.

 

[Guinness Boy]

Agree with this.

What we don't have is the organised militarilsm which is normally associated with fascism. I don't think the occasional Braverman inspired drunken meathead, football thug, statue protection mob currently count. But I'd accept the point this is a situation to be keeping an eye on

In this day and age, risks abound and cool heads are required on all sides.

You missed the recent hints that we might have to reinstate a military draft?

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Yes, that sounds like a pretty good description of my understanding of fascism.

As much as I despise the pungent opportunism of Anderson, Tice and Farage, I just don't believe they fit this description.

Using the Union flag at every opportunity (insisting on MPs having it in their living room whilst being interviewed) Ultranationalist. £8 million set aside for every school to have a large portrait of the king.
Militariasm - patriotism. You're not patriotic if you don't support their policies and even accusing people of being unpatriotic if you criticise them in public (yes, I have been accused of that but then tell them I am a veteran, which confuses them)
Centralised autocracy - deliberately running down funds to local authorities especially Labour-controlled, promising levelling up but not delivering.
Just a few examples.

 

[The Clamp]

I get it's fun to call these types of people fascists, in a Rick from Young Ones sort of a way, but how do you respond then to actual fascism when it arrives. Your words have lost their meaning

Is it fascism yet?
No

Is it fascism yet?
Nooo

Is it fascism yet?
Nooo not quite

Are we at fascism yet?
Almost, not quite..


Is it fascism yet?
Ah. Yes. It is. Too late, I’m afraid. Sorry. Didn’t see it coming.

 

[bazbha]

View attachment 178461
The National Front, you say?
Tell me the differences in policies between the Tories, Reform and the National Front. PS Change Common Market to EU.

Simple. There is a huge difference between stopping illegal immigration & all immigration as per the National Front.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Agree with this.

What we don't have is the organised militarilsm which is normally associated with fascism. I don't think the occasional Braverman inspired drunken meathead, football thug, statue protection mob currently count. But I'd accept the point this is a situation to be keeping an eye on

In this day and age, risks abound and cool heads are required on all sides.

There is a mob akin to Yaxley-Lennon's lot and others who have been led into thinking that lefties and immigrants want to attack War Memorials. Unfortunately, many of them are squaddies who think they are being patriotic. Culture wars.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Simple. There is a huge difference between stopping illegal immigration & all immigration as per the National Front.

Sigh. Asylum seekers are not illegal. Calling them illegal is government propaganda

Here we go, down the rabbit hole.

 

[Guinness Boy]

Simple. There is a huge difference between stopping illegal immigration & all immigration as per the National Front.

Reform policy is net zero immigration.

 

[Acker79]

 

[London Irish]

Reminder that he was a Labour Party member up until 2018 (the main organiser of the then Labour MP) and was accused by all the media of being driven out of Labour by Jeremy Corbyn

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

You missed the recent hints that we might have to reinstate a military draft?

Again, plenty of countries do this which aren't fascist countries.

Some might even do it expressly to fight fascism.

To be totally clear, I'm not in any way supportive of Lee Anderson or right wing politics. I just think that the use of the word fascism is hyperbolic in this context

 

[The Clamp]

The only real difference between the NF and mobs like Reform is the age we live in.

You have to be a bit smarter and not as overt these days. The language NF used won’t fly in 2024. The intent however, is EXACTLY the same.

 

[Baldrick]

I find it odd a lot of socialists on this forum think a politician who is politically centre right is a fascist like Oswald Moseley. Just because someone is centre right doesn't make them far right or a fascist. On a scale of 1 to 10, someone who is centre left is possibly a 4 or 5 and someone centre right is possibly a 6 or 7 out of 10. Someone far right would be an 8, 9 or 10 out of 10. A bit of perspective is needed.

The current Tory goverment keeps piching Labour's policies. There is probably little difference between Sunak's and Starmer's policies . I would say both leaders are centre left in their outlooks, even if they have had different upbringings. I would score both 5 out of 10.

 

[heathgate]

I wonder what is actually causing this general drift to the right.... across Europe, democratic votes have repeatedly returned a swing of increased numbers for parties who can be labelled as various shades of right of centre.

It can't just be down to traditional boomers and older folk sticking to dated views of the world, those guys are getting fewer as years go by but there still seems to be a core of votes holding those numbers on the right.

 

[The Clamp]

In an interview with the right-leaning Spectator shortly before his appointment, Anderson proudly proclaimed that the UK should bring back the death penalty because “nobody has ever committed a crime after being executed”.

“You know that don’t you? 100 per cent success rate,” he added.

And ;


“If they don’t like the accommodation, they can get on a dinghy back to France” Lee told Braverman.


These are fascist comments. If you argue they are not, it’s likely because you hold the same views and don’t want to be recognised as a fascist.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

I find it odd a lot of socialists on this forum think a politician who is politically centre right is a fascist like Oswald Moseley. Just because someone is centre right doesn't make them far right or a fascist. On a scale of 1 to 10, someone who is centre left is possibly a 4 or 5 and someone centre right is possibly a 6 or 7 out of 10. Someone far right would be an 8, 9 or 10 out of 10. A bit of perspective is needed.

The current Tory goverment keeps piching Labour's policies. There is probably little difference between Sunak's and Starmer's policies . I would say both leaders are centre left in their outlooks, even if they have had different upbringings. I would score both 5 out of 10.

The centre right like Dominic Grieve, Anna Soubry, Philip Hammond, Ken Clarke, Rory Stewart, and the other 16 MPs who were forced out by Boris Johnson in 2019?

 

[Nobby]

Showing my age but back in the late 70's & early 80's we had an actual large scale Far Right/Fascist/Nazi/Racist problem. The National Front etc. This hysterical over reaction to anything to the right of the Guardian viewpoint is ridiculous. Fair enough people don't like different points of view but smearing everyone you don't agree with with these kind of labels is counter-productive. There are still some real Far-right nutters about but Reform ain't them!

So what are Reform's aims \ policies?