BadFish
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- Oct 19, 2003
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Gaza / Israel
- Thread starter Mellor 3 Ward 4
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BadFish
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- Oct 19, 2003
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My research......(Scary aren't they those direct questions.)
Would you please be so good as to tell me why you see the Palestinians as the aggressors?
Steve Foster
Well-known member
Most Palestinians are not aggressors, regrettably Hamas is the aggressors. Hamas do not want peace, will never make peace & do not have any western values. Shooting rockets indiscriminately into Israel week in week out is unacceptable. Most importantly Obama has stated that Israel has the right to defend itself & has full support. Looking at things slightly differently, if Israels population were the same as UK, 24 million people would be in the range of the Hamas rockets.
BadFish
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- Oct 19, 2003
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Why are Hamas firing rockets into Israel?
somerset
New member
No, dyor....
You can quote all the pro-palestinian facts you like, all relevant in this discussion of course, but unless you educate yourself by reading and acknowledging the other side to that story, you are not in the game.
You have to learn to read, seriously, my posts at no time talk about who is or isn't at fault, I just need you to pick out all the perspectives before blurting out random generalisations.... OK?
BadFish
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- Oct 19, 2003
- 18,204
The full support of the American government (Israel's closes ally and arms supplier) but NOT the UN.
BadFish
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- Oct 19, 2003
- 18,204
So you are happy to bandy about your opinion as fact, until you are asked a direct question? I have listed my reasons (referenced and undisputed facts) for seeing the Israelis as the aggressors in this conflict and am simply asking you to give me your reasons why you disagree. I am struggling to understand why you refuse to do so. Surely if I am so uninformed and my information so biased you would be able to shot my arguments down easily rather than shy away from them by asking me to do my own research.
BadFish
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- Oct 19, 2003
- 18,204
somerset
New member
As I said before, you really can't read properly.... re-read my last post..... go on, treat yourself.... read it and absorb what I have said, there's a good lad.
BadFish
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- Oct 19, 2003
- 18,204
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2012/11/18/hamas-aims-high-in-conditions-for-truce-saying-calm-linked-to-end-gaza-blockade/
Using my highly left wing pro Palestine source here I am going to make the suggestion that Hamas's demands are not particularly outrageous or (shock horror) much different to the i posted earlier (maybe I know what I am talking about after all).
- Open borders for Gaza (no illegal wall or checkpoints) and a free movement of people and goods in and out
- Israel to cease attacks on Gaza
Seems diplomacy is possible, demands have been made by one side.....I wonder how the other will react (actually I don't but you get what I mean).
Using my highly left wing pro Palestine source here I am going to make the suggestion that Hamas's demands are not particularly outrageous or (shock horror) much different to the i posted earlier (maybe I know what I am talking about after all).
- Open borders for Gaza (no illegal wall or checkpoints) and a free movement of people and goods in and out
- Israel to cease attacks on Gaza
Seems diplomacy is possible, demands have been made by one side.....I wonder how the other will react (actually I don't but you get what I mean).
BadFish
Huge Member
- Oct 19, 2003
- 18,204
Go on humour me
What is it you are actually trying to say?
Where do you actually stand on this topic?
Go on be brave put it out there.
somerset
New member
Not interested mate....... this subject has been done to death on here.
BadFish
Huge Member
- Oct 19, 2003
- 18,204
genuine LOL
If you are so no interested in discussing this topic with someone so ill informed as me then WTF are you doing here?
Go do something you are interested in.
enjoy!
GNF on Tour
Registered Twunt
BadFish
Huge Member
- Oct 19, 2003
- 18,204
According to several reports this latest violence was sparked when a 13 year old Palestinian by was killed when playing football with his mates. Israel are investigating the death but at present deny responsibly
An Australian-Palestinians view on the current troubles
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/world/life-goes-on-in-gaza-where-no-place-is-safe/story-e6frg6so-1226518360933
Life goes on in Gaza, where no place is safe
by: SAMAH SABAWI
From: The Australian
November 17, 2012 12:00AM
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A BOMB falls close to our neighbourhood in Gaza; I check Facebook to see if everyone has survived. A young cousin, Nihal, writes in her status: "Shoot, I should have had my nap earlier today, didn't know it was going to be a sleepless night.". Another cousin jokes: "We were happy it rained in Gaza but weren't expecting the water falling to turn into bombs."
For the 1.5 million Palestinians trapped in Gaza, humour helps to mask the terror they are experiencing. The bombs keep falling; they have nowhere to run and no place to hide.
At the time of writing, Israel's aerial and ground assault on Gaza has claimed the lives of more than 10 Palestinians, including seven-year-old Ranan Arafat 7-year-old child - and an 11-month-old baby. Charred bodies of dead and injured women and children are pouring in to al-Shifa Hospital and other medical centres in the impoverished and underequipped Gaza Strip. Three Israelis have also been killed by Hamas in retaliation.
The toll will rise, no doubt. Israeli sources have confirmed that since Wednesday, Israel's army has struck more than 100 targets in Gaza, with Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu confirming that the operation involving Israeli ground forces, aerial strikes and navy gunboats is likely to expand.
Digital Pass $1 for first 28 Days
What prompted this brutal Israeli assault on the trapped population of Gaza, and who is to blame? Israel insists it is all being done in the name of self-defence. The media too has branded it "tit-for-tat violence". Lacking from all the coverage is an important component: context.
The majority of people in Gaza are in fact stateless refugees whose homes were taken from them by the early Jewish settlers 65 years ago, in order to establish what is now Israel. To add insult to injury, those refugees are still living under siege and military occupation by the same state that stole their homes and chased them into the far corners of their historic homeland, confining them in refugee camps, denying them the right to citizenship, the right to self-determination, the right to freedom of movement and even the right to basic security.
A trigger for this recent escalation against Gaza came on November 8, when the Israeli army killed a 13-year-old Palestinian boy while he was playing football with his friends. In that same week, Israeli forces killed three children playing football. Really, what argument for self-defence can there be?
Even the killing of Hamas leader Ahmed Jabari was puzzling, to say the least. Hours before his assassination, Hamas had agreed to a ceasefire with Israel, brokered by Egypt, and Jabari was responsible for keeping the border secure by cracking down on militants firing rockets into Israel. After agreeing to the ceasefire, Israel broke it by killing the man who was supposed to have enforced it. If anything, Jabari's assassination will draw Israel further into this blood path without an end.
So, why did Israel go to war? Some Israeli commentators think it is the usual election side-effect. Aluf Benn writes in the Israeli newspaper Haaretz: "When the cannons roar, we see only Netanyahu and (Defence Minister Ehud) Barak on the screen, and all the other politicians have to applaud them."
Israel's power-wielders need the war to keep the power. Jabari was killed because Israel can't have peace and survive. Peace requires justice and a change of ideology. Peace requires compromise, and nasty words such as freedom, justice and equality tend to sneak into people's mindsets when there is peace. Israel's leadership knows it can only survive as long as there are threats, wars and fear.
I check my laptop once again. The family is doing well but they are tired after a day of not sleeping and edgy because the bombing has not stopped. I open a message from a friend, Ayman. He tells me that two of his children are at his mother's house and the other two are home with him. He jokes: "This way we increase our chances of survival." I ask him: "Which place is safer - your building or your mother's?" He writes back: "Nowhere. No place is safe!"
Samah Sabawi is a Palestinian-Australian writer and political analyst. She is a policy adviser for al-Shabaka, Palestinian Policy Network.
An Australian-Palestinians view on the current troubles
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/world/life-goes-on-in-gaza-where-no-place-is-safe/story-e6frg6so-1226518360933
Life goes on in Gaza, where no place is safe
by: SAMAH SABAWI
From: The Australian
November 17, 2012 12:00AM
Increase Text Size
Decrease Text Size
A BOMB falls close to our neighbourhood in Gaza; I check Facebook to see if everyone has survived. A young cousin, Nihal, writes in her status: "Shoot, I should have had my nap earlier today, didn't know it was going to be a sleepless night.". Another cousin jokes: "We were happy it rained in Gaza but weren't expecting the water falling to turn into bombs."
For the 1.5 million Palestinians trapped in Gaza, humour helps to mask the terror they are experiencing. The bombs keep falling; they have nowhere to run and no place to hide.
At the time of writing, Israel's aerial and ground assault on Gaza has claimed the lives of more than 10 Palestinians, including seven-year-old Ranan Arafat 7-year-old child - and an 11-month-old baby. Charred bodies of dead and injured women and children are pouring in to al-Shifa Hospital and other medical centres in the impoverished and underequipped Gaza Strip. Three Israelis have also been killed by Hamas in retaliation.
The toll will rise, no doubt. Israeli sources have confirmed that since Wednesday, Israel's army has struck more than 100 targets in Gaza, with Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu confirming that the operation involving Israeli ground forces, aerial strikes and navy gunboats is likely to expand.
Digital Pass $1 for first 28 Days
What prompted this brutal Israeli assault on the trapped population of Gaza, and who is to blame? Israel insists it is all being done in the name of self-defence. The media too has branded it "tit-for-tat violence". Lacking from all the coverage is an important component: context.
The majority of people in Gaza are in fact stateless refugees whose homes were taken from them by the early Jewish settlers 65 years ago, in order to establish what is now Israel. To add insult to injury, those refugees are still living under siege and military occupation by the same state that stole their homes and chased them into the far corners of their historic homeland, confining them in refugee camps, denying them the right to citizenship, the right to self-determination, the right to freedom of movement and even the right to basic security.
A trigger for this recent escalation against Gaza came on November 8, when the Israeli army killed a 13-year-old Palestinian boy while he was playing football with his friends. In that same week, Israeli forces killed three children playing football. Really, what argument for self-defence can there be?
Even the killing of Hamas leader Ahmed Jabari was puzzling, to say the least. Hours before his assassination, Hamas had agreed to a ceasefire with Israel, brokered by Egypt, and Jabari was responsible for keeping the border secure by cracking down on militants firing rockets into Israel. After agreeing to the ceasefire, Israel broke it by killing the man who was supposed to have enforced it. If anything, Jabari's assassination will draw Israel further into this blood path without an end.
So, why did Israel go to war? Some Israeli commentators think it is the usual election side-effect. Aluf Benn writes in the Israeli newspaper Haaretz: "When the cannons roar, we see only Netanyahu and (Defence Minister Ehud) Barak on the screen, and all the other politicians have to applaud them."
Israel's power-wielders need the war to keep the power. Jabari was killed because Israel can't have peace and survive. Peace requires justice and a change of ideology. Peace requires compromise, and nasty words such as freedom, justice and equality tend to sneak into people's mindsets when there is peace. Israel's leadership knows it can only survive as long as there are threats, wars and fear.
I check my laptop once again. The family is doing well but they are tired after a day of not sleeping and edgy because the bombing has not stopped. I open a message from a friend, Ayman. He tells me that two of his children are at his mother's house and the other two are home with him. He jokes: "This way we increase our chances of survival." I ask him: "Which place is safer - your building or your mother's?" He writes back: "Nowhere. No place is safe!"
Samah Sabawi is a Palestinian-Australian writer and political analyst. She is a policy adviser for al-Shabaka, Palestinian Policy Network.
BadFish
Huge Member
- Oct 19, 2003
- 18,204
and a report from The Times of Israel
http://www.timesofisrael.com/palestinian-boy-reportedly-killed-by-israeli-fire-in-gaza/
Gaza boy reportedly killed by Israeli troops
Palestinian medical sources say 13-year-old died from machine gun fire
By Ilan Ben Zion November 8, 2012, 8:07 pm
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Gaza Strip
Khan Younis
IDF Israel Defense Forces
A 13-year-old Palestinian boy was reportedly killed by Israeli fire on Thursday in the southern Gaza Strip, Palestinian media reported. Some reports also claimed that three Palestinians were injured in the strike near Khan Younis.
The IDF said it was not aware of the incident and was investigating the report.
Hamid Younis Abu Daqqa was hit by “machine gun fire, either from Israeli helicopters or tanks” east of Khan Younis, the Palestinian Ma’an news agency quoted Gaza Health Ministry spokesman Ashraf al-Qidra saying.
He was pronounced dead at a Khan Younis hospital, the Wafa news agency reported.
Wafa also reported that four IDF bulldozers and six tanks pushed 400 meters into the Gaza Strip as part of the operation.
Earlier on Thursday, IDF soldiers exchanged fire with Palestinian terrorists from Gaza.
According to initial reports, a work crew came under fire near Kibbutz Nirim on the Gaza border and the soldiers returned fire.
Tanks and attack helicopters were dispatched to the scene and opened fire toward suspicious areas.
http://www.timesofisrael.com/palestinian-boy-reportedly-killed-by-israeli-fire-in-gaza/
Gaza boy reportedly killed by Israeli troops
Palestinian medical sources say 13-year-old died from machine gun fire
By Ilan Ben Zion November 8, 2012, 8:07 pm
submit to reddit
Share
Related Topics
Gaza Strip
Khan Younis
IDF Israel Defense Forces
A 13-year-old Palestinian boy was reportedly killed by Israeli fire on Thursday in the southern Gaza Strip, Palestinian media reported. Some reports also claimed that three Palestinians were injured in the strike near Khan Younis.
The IDF said it was not aware of the incident and was investigating the report.
Hamid Younis Abu Daqqa was hit by “machine gun fire, either from Israeli helicopters or tanks” east of Khan Younis, the Palestinian Ma’an news agency quoted Gaza Health Ministry spokesman Ashraf al-Qidra saying.
He was pronounced dead at a Khan Younis hospital, the Wafa news agency reported.
Wafa also reported that four IDF bulldozers and six tanks pushed 400 meters into the Gaza Strip as part of the operation.
Earlier on Thursday, IDF soldiers exchanged fire with Palestinian terrorists from Gaza.
According to initial reports, a work crew came under fire near Kibbutz Nirim on the Gaza border and the soldiers returned fire.
Tanks and attack helicopters were dispatched to the scene and opened fire toward suspicious areas.
BadFish
Huge Member
- Oct 19, 2003
- 18,204
http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2012/11/who-started-the-israel-gaza-conflict/265374/
I am just loving this article where the writing is looking for an unbiased timeline of the problems and asks this woman to write it for him:
Emily L. Hauser is an American-Israeli writer. She lived in Tel Aviv for 14 years and has studied and written about the contemporary Middle East for 25; she writes for Open Zion on The Daily Beast, and also at her own blog. She can be followed on Twitter at [MENTION=15788]Emily[/MENTION]lhauser.
Funnily enough to me it does seem quite biased.
I am just loving this article where the writing is looking for an unbiased timeline of the problems and asks this woman to write it for him:
Emily L. Hauser is an American-Israeli writer. She lived in Tel Aviv for 14 years and has studied and written about the contemporary Middle East for 25; she writes for Open Zion on The Daily Beast, and also at her own blog. She can be followed on Twitter at [MENTION=15788]Emily[/MENTION]lhauser.
Funnily enough to me it does seem quite biased.
GNF on Tour
Registered Twunt
Do not have any Western values, what the fcuk are you talking about? China, India, Thailand etc etc don't have any Western values, shall we murder them as well? "Hamas does not want peace" WRONG, Hamas don't want peace on Israels terms, and I don't blame them. Also, who suddenly made Obama God? Yes, Israel should defend their territory, and the Palestinians should be able to defend their own country.
You really are a nasty one-eyed apologist for muderers and invaders, I wish you would fcuk off from this board and take youre shit predictions threads with you.