[Albion] Fab out?

[Justice]

I'm on the fence. Young manager deserves to be given a decent chance.
My biggest concern is the progression of the young player's under a young manager. The club's policy is to buy young, improve and sell for a profit.
Would the younger player's learn more from a more experienced manager and speed up development?

I get buying prospects and selling for profit no problem with that although a prospect manager does not make much sense. The player needs to respect the coach and feed of his experience. Without FH having much experience I’m not sure how that works.

 

[Hiheidi]

We had the master and hired his disciple.

That has actually reminded me that we supposedly looked at (interviewed?) RDZ's actual disciple - Francesco Farioli. Not sure if we turned him down or him us in favour of Ajax - he seems to be doing well though.

 

[The Fits]

I’m not sure the new guy is head coach material. More of a technical guy who oversees coaching.

There is an interesting article in the Athletic re the 7-0 drubbing. ( behind a paywall).
Apparently the Athletic ( probably Naylor) asked about our set piece stats this year, directly after the game. Goals conceded and scored from corners. We are stand out bad. Only Southampton are worse.
The response from FH was that we are poor because we haven’t had any consistency with the corner takers. What a load of nonsense Fab. Ayari has been in the team consistently to take them and our defence line up has been relatively consistent in terms of defending corners. When he first came FH stated that this was an area which he’d be looking to improve and yet there has been no improvement at all.
Too little time on the training pitch possibly.
Some posters have challenged the Fab Out brigade with a ‘lack of evidence’ statement. Well there is one piece which is very clear.
If anyone can make the stat available via the article you can see for yourselves.

Posts like this and @Stato from earlier in the week are really damning and very difficulty to argue with. It’s quite clear to me now there are broadly two camps (with extreme frothers at either end of that)- those who are simply hoping that there is genuine potential or that simply assume (hope) B and B wouldn’t have got this wrong. And then others (myself included) who haven’t seen enough evenidence to suggest the potential is there. The stats now seem to overwhelmingly back these fears up. You cannot be underperforming so badly on fundamental things like set pieces, chance creation, shot conversion, shots to goals conceded etc without concern. Anyone who saw the stats on MOTD about Moyes impact at Everton will have seen that managers can make huge and immediate changes. They don’t need months and months, they don’t need new players. They take what they have and make key changes to improve things.
The plus is there’s a hell of lot of room for improvement. Has he got what it takes to do that?
It’s been mentioned previously the reality is that we are a stat driven club. People behind the scenes will be on top of all these, plus more. The question is how important is that to them and do the stats that we haven’t seen give them any confidence?

 

[The Fits]

I get buying prospects and selling for profit no problem with that although a prospect manager does not make much sense. The player needs to respect the coach and feed of his experience. Without FH having much experience I’m not sure how that works.

This is massive for me. With a lot of the more experienced back room team leaving, with senior players leaving and with THE rookie coach, who are young players learning off?

 

[chaileyjem]

This is massive for me. With a lot of the more experienced back room team leaving, with senior players leaving and with THE rookie coach, who are young players learning off?

Who are all these people that are leaving ? Crofts has been around for years as a coach. . Welbeck, Milner, Dunk, Veltman, Solly and Steele have been at the club now for years.

Name em.

 

[The Fits]

Who are all these people that are leaving ? Crofts has been around for years as a coach. . Welbeck, Milner, Dunk, Veltman, Solly and Steele have been at the club now for years.

Name em.

Lallana. Gross. Ashworth.

 

[chaileyjem]

Lallana. Gross. Ashworth.

David Weir is hardly a rookie is he - he’s worked in football as a coach, player for nearly 40 years and has been at the Albion since 2019 running the football side of things. . Barber and Bloom have been at the helm for nearly 15 years together. Even Gordon Greer has now been here for a long while. And other experienced back room staff as well that I assume everyone leans on.

Ofc any set up would miss Gross and Lallana. But Dunk, Veltman, Solly, Welbeck, Webster and Steele have racked up dozens and dozens of seasons of top flight football now.

I think FAB is flawed and still finding his way and the PL is hard but the answers that explain the disappointing performances and results - and a decent number of good ones aren’t easily explained or are complex. . (Is this one “No wise heads to consult ?” )- And anyway he’s hardly the first coach in the PL to have no PL experience. Graham Potter for starters. (Oh no - that will set off all the Graham “fans” ha ha )

 

[oldboyroy]

Going back to the comeback win at home to spurs. We were awful 1st half but Fab changed things at half time and we were great. However, 1 player interviewed afterwards said something " it was Milly(Milner) and Steeley who said their views and we came out fighting". Think it was a direct question of what did the manager say you would at half time?.
Wonder if Milner still has influence?
My frustration is mainly down to the fact that we look worse in a season that City United and Spurs have have had a poor season and this was a chance for us to take advantage (we may still manage it) whereas the likes of Muff and Forest have.

 

[Justice]

David Weir is hardly a rookie is he - he’s worked in football as a coach, player for nearly 40 years and has been at the Albion since 2019 running the football side of things. . Barber and Bloom have been at the helm for nearly 15 years together. Even Gordon Greer has now been here for a long while. And other experienced back room staff as well that I assume everyone leans on.

Ofc any set up would miss Gross and Lallana. But Dunk, Veltman, Solly, Welbeck, Webster and Steele have racked up dozens and dozens of seasons of top flight football now.

I think FAB is flawed and still finding his way and the PL is hard but the answers that explain the disappointing performances and results - and a decent number of good ones aren’t easily explained or are complex. . (Is this one “No wise heads to consult ?” )- And anyway he’s hardly the first coach in the PL to have no PL experience. Graham Potter for starters. (Oh no - that will set off all the Graham “fans” ha ha )

Not many coaches have PL experience on arrival only the ones that get recycled like Moyes, Dyche, Howe what’s required is pedigree. McKenna looks just as clueless as Fab with Ipswich fans turning on his bizarre picks and formations.

 

[chaileyjem]

Going back to the comeback win at home to spurs. We were awful 1st half but Fab changed things at half time and we were great. However, 1 player interviewed afterwards said something " it was Milly(Milner) and Steeley who said their views and we came out fighting". Think it was a direct question of what did the manager say you would at half time?.
Wonder if Milner still has influence?

He’s been travelling with the team to away games. And is (I think) in the dressing room/ sitting with the coaches/bench.

 

[The Fits]

I wonder what Milner thinks about all this. We know one of the reasons he joined was Lallana’s enthusiasm for the club but also RDZ. Basically ‘you have to see this guy.
Now he’s taking team talks.

 

[Kosh]

Not many coaches have PL experience on arrival only the ones that get recycled like Moyes, Dyche, Howe what’s required is pedigree. McKenna looks just as clueless as Fab with Ipswich fans turning on his bizarre picks and formations.

Yes, but… in McKenna’s defence he’s coaching a team who’ve had successive promotions and were always likely to go straight back down… little wonder he’s starting to feel the strain and perhaps starting to look for solutions where there aren’t any…

Fabian is not coaching Ipswich, he’s coaching an established PL team with solid recruitment and a very decent PL level squad… he’s underperforming, not catastrophically (7-zip aside) but it’s not great… if he lacked PL experience, well the club knew this and the associated risks and STILL appointed him… Indeed, if our target was to trouble the lesser European spots the appointment has thus far proven to be a significant miscalculation - with associated statistics now starting to prove the rule… Fab is clearly a very good talker with suits, not so (perchance) with the blokes wearing the boots…

For me, and I think we all know/recognise this, Fabian was about third choice and he’s performing at about the level I’d expect from third pick of our favoured options… C-.

 

[One Love]

What’s clueless about this? That’s how we’ve set up for most of this se

What’s clueless about this? That’s how we’ve set up for most of this season?

Well if you think it's a good idea to leave a big hole in midfield then OK, carry on.

 

[Oscar]

There needs to be a response this weekend and, before that, Fab is going to need to convey some fight in his press calls this week.

But however long he remains as manager, I don't EVER want to see those snippets of Fab's pre or post-match team talks again. They do the guy no favours, whatever the players might think of them.

 

[The Fits]

Yes, but… in McKenna’s defence he’s coaching a team who’ve had successive promotions and were always likely to go straight back down… little wonder he’s starting to feel the strain and perhaps starting to look for solutions where there aren’t any…

Fabian is not coaching Ipswich, he’s coaching an established PL team with solid recruitment and a very decent PL level squad… he’s underperforming, not catastrophically (7-zip aside) but it’s not great… if he lacked PL experience, well the club knew this and the associated risks and STILL appointed him… clearly a very good talker with suits, not so (perchance) with the blokes wearing the boots…

For me, and I think we all know/recognise this, Fabian was about third choice and he’s performing at about the level I’d expect from third pick of our favoured options… C-.

Fabian is not coaching Ipswich, he’s coaching an established PL team with solid recruitment and a very decent PL level squad…

And rich.
Lots of people on here refuse to accept that.
We didn’t need to take such a risk.

 

[Hiheidi]

But however long he remains as manager, I don't EVER want to see those snippets of Fab's pre or post-match team talks again. They do the guy no favours, whatever the players might think of them.

I know a few people have mentioned Liam Rosenior. I saw this doing the rounds online, if you want to see one of his dressing room team talks.

 

[mejonaNO12 aka riskit]

So on average we concede 4 goals every 100 corners taken....with the most teams being around 3.

And on average we score 2 goals per 100 corners taken, with the average being about 3 or 4

Considering some teams haven't even taken 100 corners over 24 PL games yet, this isn't exactly going to stop me sleeping at night. We are basically saying so far this season we have conceded 1 more goal than most in 24 league games and scored 1 less than most In 24 league games?

We are scoring at a higher ratio than Liverpool and Bournemouth, you know, those two teams with tactically inept managers....

But some use corner stats to point to poor management.....

Of the many tools available to use in criticism of FH, I wouldn't run with this one.

Seven factors that explain Brighton’s humiliating 7-0 defeat to Nottingham Forest

Saturday's loss at the City Ground was Brighton's heaviest in a league game since the opening day of the 1958-59 season

www.nytimes.com

View attachment 196177

 

[jackalbion]

So on average we concede 4 goals every 100 corners taken....with the most teams being around 3.

And on average we score 2 goals per 100 corners taken, with the average being about 3 or 4

Considering some teams haven't even taken 100 corners over 24 PL games yet, this isn't exactly going to stop me sleeping at night. We are basically saying so far this season we have conceded 1 more goal than most in 24 league games and scored 1 less than most In 24 league games?

We are scoring at a higher ratio than Liverpool and Bournemouth, you know, those two teams with tactically inept managers....

But some use corner stats to point to poor management.....

Of the many tools available to use in criticism of FH, I wouldn't run with this one.

I don't think we need to focus on scoring from corners, but the set up for the corner we conceded from (Gibbs White) was APPALLING. The set up was complete mess.

 

[Justice]

I agree the tactics and player roles need working on. For example Mitoma has often been doubled up on as Pervis is making less overlapping runs to give him more space as he is coming into CM more. i dont think you can say a particular formation isnt working as we have played several and it will change according to the opposition and available players. With the high line a point in another article it talks about how we have caught teams offside on average 4.8 times per game. The highest is the league. So in many ways it is working. I guess it is because people remember the close calls or when it doesn’t work.

There are quite a few good points in the article so I recommend you have a read if able. Personally i think it shows FH is trying different things but he is still learning and is very new to the l

I know a few people have mentioned Liam Rosenior. I saw this doing the rounds online, if you want to see one of his dressing room team talks.

Wasn’t quite live changing in the end although he gave it a good go.

 

[UnhingedSeagull94]

Gone well so far, from 2-1 win against Bournemouth to 7-0 loss against Forest, fantastic progress.

Personally I’d give it to Anthony Storey for the rest of the season