Circumcision banned in Germany

[1066familyman]

Hypocritical in what way?
I think education and treating diseases do serve pretty practical purposes really.

And many cultures also believe male circumcision serves some pretty practical purposes, not to mention the spiritual/emotional ones. Dandyman's explanation of what it means to him is a classic example. For the state to deny adults that choice for their kids whilst imposing the states views, I would say is hypocritical. Anyway, as was said earlier, no law has been passed nationally - I doubt it would ever happen on this issue.

 

[1066familyman]

A mate of mine was snipped as a baby. He never forgave his parents for having him done as he said it was his body and only he should have been able to make the decision.
He said he would not have been circumcised if he had had the choice.

How did he feel about the name he was given by his parents. Was he happy with that or did he change it by deed poll when he was old enough by law to be able to do so by himself?

I know the response is that at least he can change it, but imagine the psychological hell you could go through until you're old enough to be allowed by the state to have it changed.

Silly comparison maybe, but sometimes I think Western liberal thinking really does need to man up a bit.

 

[Silent Bob]

And many cultures also believe male circumcision serves some pretty practical purposes, not to mention the spiritual/emotional ones. Dandyman's explanation of what it means to him is a classic example. For the state to deny adults that choice for their kids whilst imposing the states views, I would say is hypocritical. Anyway, as was said earlier, no law has been passed nationally - I doubt it would ever happen on this issue.

But in reality there is no practical purpose to circumcision for non practical purposes. Whereas medical procedures and education, there patently are good reasons to do those things. I don't think parents have the right to just do anything to their kids because they want to.

I agree no law will ever be passed, and that's probably good because this runs so deep that any such law would probably just make it less safe rather than stopping anyone doing it.

 

[1066familyman]

But in reality there is no practical purpose to circumcision for non practical purposes. Whereas medical procedures and education, there patently are good reasons to do those things.

I don't think parents have the right to just do anything to their kids because they want to.

I agree no law will ever be passed, and that's probably good because this runs so deep that any such law would probably just make it less safe rather than stopping anyone doing it.

Totally agree on your last two points.

As for your first point. I think it's a western scientific mind set that tends to see things almost purely from a practical/medical point of view whilst neglecting the spiritual part of society. You could argue of course that there is an educational aspect to male circumcision in that it's passing on knowledge and a huge sense of belonging to the culture of your parents.

 

[DTES]

I've never heard of a case where a man who was circumcised as a baby had a serious complaint about it as an adult. It just seems to be other people imposing their views on an ethnic minority.

Is that honestly your argument? You are not aware of anyone who had the decision to be circumcised made for them later complain, therefore it is ok to continue making it for every newborn boy?

It's perfectly clear and perfectly consistent - nobody of any age, of any religion/culture, should ever have any permanent body modifications performed on them without their informed consent. I don't think that's unreasonable, unlike the implication that I'm aiming anything at an ethnic minority.

 

[clapham_gull]

why is it acceptable to do it to a man and not a women i dont get that

Because "female circumcision" is a very bad description. It's mutilation pure and simple.

 

[JamesAndTheGiantHead]

Has anyone made a pun on German Helmets yet?

 

[spig100963]

Shut up. I am hanging on to the end of mine at the thought of it.
I was done at birth.

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

Taboos ? A child can't in fact give consent to any medical operation but I doubt the Germans are going to ban children having their tonsils out.

lets face it what we're born with is normal unless you're de formed so lets keep the skin intact and all this simple simon says don't wash dandy.

 

[GT49er]

Circumsision is a barbaric ritual, which should be outlawed world-wide. For a few males, circumsision might become a medical necessity around puberty if the foreskin is too tight - other than that it is a violation. Male circumsision is bad enough (fortunately I wasn't) but female circumsision is a crime of such barbarity that it should be punishable by life (and life meaning life) for both the practitioners and the parents.........and the extended family, where appropriate.

 

[Spanish Seagulls]

Has anyone made a pun on German Helmets yet?

That's what I was looking for, what with the shape & it being Germany. I imagine some of the Jewish faith seeing this as an attack on their traditions as well although with a large Turkish community who carry out this practice I think it is them who represent the major hacking off of foreskins in Germany. The Germans didn't mind hacking off a lot more than just a bit of foreskin when it came to their dealings with the Jewish community.

 

[Glenn-Murray]

Kids grow up with the culture/religion of their parents, that's how it is. If the state intervenes and says they, the state, know better, then the state is just being hypocritical.

That shouldn't be just "how it is". Bringing your kids up as part of a religion shouldn't be your choice to make. The only reason religion has lasted this long is the "get 'em while they're too young to think for themselves" tactic. If everyone was educated properly and then introduced to religion when they were able to think critically as an adult, almost everyone except the painfully slow would discard it as nonsense. The world would be a better place, global intelligence would increase, and children would escape without parts of their penis/vagina chopped off.

 

[Steve Foster]

Perhaps someone should run a poll.

Are you a Roundhead or a Cavalier?

And for the ladies. Which do you prefer?

 

[Acker79]

Has anyone made a pun on German Helmets yet?

I was going to make a helmet joke but the comments I came up with weren't pithy enough.

 

[1066familyman]

That shouldn't be just "how it is". Bringing your kids up as part of a religion shouldn't be your choice to make. The only reason religion has lasted this long is the "get 'em while they're too young to think for themselves" tactic. If everyone was educated properly and then introduced to religion when they were able to think critically as an adult, almost everyone except the painfully slow would discard it as nonsense. The world would be a better place, global intelligence would increase, and children would escape without parts of their penis/vagina chopped off.

And so bringing your kids up NOT to be a part of any religion is different how exactly ? It amounts to the same thing! - the parents imposing their choice on their children. Of course, the sheer arrogance of the secular western mind set that views all people of faith as somehow illiterate fools, as so eloquently demonstrated in your post, can't seem to see this hypocrisy, but it's there alright, plain enough for anyone to see.

Children grow up in a culture and have their thoughts/opinions, dress codes, rituals and all manner of things shaped by that culture, whether they like it or not. The culture of the wider society they are growing up in, as well as the culture of their parents, should it be different to that of the wider society the child grows up in, will both be imposed on the child without the child having any choice in the matter. Since religion is an integral part of culture, it seems only natural to me that parents should pass their own faith onto their kids. There's no escaping it I'm afraid - none of us grow up in some wonderful free will bubble.

 

[Lyndhurst 14]

That shouldn't be just "how it is". Bringing your kids up as part of a religion shouldn't be your choice to make. The only reason religion has lasted this long is the "get 'em while they're too young to think for themselves" tactic. If everyone was educated properly and then introduced to religion when they were able to think critically as an adult, almost everyone except the painfully slow would discard it as nonsense. The world would be a better place, global intelligence would increase, and children would escape without parts of their penis/vagina chopped off.

Never a truer word spoken - unfortunately these religious types don't like dealing with the truth