[Politics] Brexit

[Thunder Bolt]

Labour supporters have been banging that one out for decades to get votes and guess what they have not privatised it.

Richard Branson bid for a service within the NHS and lost the bid. He sued the NHS.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...l-settlement-tendering-contract-a8080961.html

It is being done by stealth, bit by bit.

It's gradualism. Put a frog in boiling water and it will hop out immediately, but put a frog in cold water and gradually increase the heat and it will die.

 

[The Clamp]

Nothing like a sweeping generalisation is there?

My mother in law is 82 - voted to remain.
My son is 20 something - voted to leave.

Strange. It’s usually the older generation that lose their marbles first.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

I am sure you have all the data to support this.
Perhaps you could share it ?

Nothing like a sweeping generalisation is there?

My mother in law is 82 - voted to remain.
My son is 20 something - voted to leave.

Likewise you could say 25 and 35 yr olds are Brexiteers or you could say 70 and 80 yr olds are Remainers.

I am 70 year old who voted Remain but these are the official figures

https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/articles-reports/2016/06/27/how-britain-voted

Second world war veterans
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...eterans-come-out-against-brexit-a7019646.html

 

[The Clamp]

Richard Branson bid for a service within the NHS and lost the bid. He sued the NHS.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...l-settlement-tendering-contract-a8080961.html

It is being done by stealth, bit by bit.

It's gradualism. Put a frog in boiling water and it will hop out immediately, but put a frog in cold water and gradually increase the heat and it will die.

My Stepbrother , a paramedic, told me how at the end of your shift in the ambulance the crew would stocktake, clean an replenish their ambulance. This task then got sold off to the lowest bidder. So they now had to leave the ambulance for a team of privately employed contractors to perform this task.
Who ****ed up almost immediately resulting in my Stepbrother having to turn up for shifts early, unpaid to do all that before they went out.

The NHS is being privatised by stealth by the Conservatives. And it’ll get worse once the U.S gets its claws into it.

 

[A1X]

In terms of the war and Brexit, generally those who lived in the war voted Remain, those who learned about it in the aftermath as a glorious victory, boy's own adventure stuff based on the likes of the 1950s war films and so on voted Leave

 

[Baldseagull]

I think the horse has bolted on that one, as I could never be happy with an EU that is essentially another layer of Government that has the level of authority and influence it has and which all has to be paid for. None of this was explained to the U.K. electorate in 74, but has happened treaty by treaty over the decades since with U.K. politicians of all flavours telling us it would not affect us.

One idea I liked many years ago was from Jack Straw who advocated a process where the HoC (along with other countries Parliaments) sent a team of MPs (based on the results of the election) to deal with the business that is now dealt with by the Commission and European Parliament. This was a way to democratise the decisions made.

I would expect these policy decisions to be limited, the EU is involved in way too much now, it’s not the trading block we joined in 74. There’s the problem, too many people are now employed and make great money via the EU (look at the warnings on corruption given to Romania about their presidency). If this day to day shit was known as clearly as we know how U.K. politicians operate we wouldn’t touch the EU with a barge pole.

Thanks for your response.
If you look at the EU and the numbers of people it employs, and the cost of that, you have to consider that without the EU, 28 different countries would be employing people in similar roles in their civil service. There is a huge saving to every member, in the EU having taken on some of these areas of bureaucracy, and benefits not easily achievable as individual nations have been gained.
The UK is going to try and retain access to some of the institutions and will contribute to funding, so we probably won't lose all, but there are some things that by refusal to accept EU courts having jurisdiction, we just won't be able to.

For me, the benefits vastly outweigh the negatives, and there is always the possibility of resolving some the negatives.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

My Stepbrother , a paramedic, told me how at the end of your shift in the ambulance the crew would stocktake, clean an replenish their ambulance. This task then got sold off to the lowest bidder. So they now had to leave the ambulance for a team of privately employed contractors to perform this task.
Who ****ed up almost immediately resulting in my Stepbrother having to turn up for shifts early, unpaid to do all that before they went out.

The NHS is being privatised by stealth by the Conservatives. And it’ll get worse once the U.S gets its claws into it.

Coperforma took over the hospital transport patient service.
https://www.eastbournehailshamandse...atient-transport-service-update/#.XD3Gblz7QdU

And was then wound up as it was useless

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-sussex-42399635


Wake up [MENTION=2719]Mouldy Boots[/MENTION].

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

How about we re-run the last General Election? At the very least it would kick the neanderthals of the DUP back into the long grass where they belong.

 

[CHAPPERS]

Defeat by 200+ votes seems to be the consensus. You would think this means May has to resign.

 

[Pavilionaire]

Indeed there are obviously quite a few Lib Dem's on this thread who have yet to come to terms with the fact their particular world view (Europhile) has been rejected numerous times through the ballot box (see 2015, 2016, 2017).

Having been accepted through the ballot box for the preceding 40 years.

The key point being in those 40 years outcomes were known and quantifiable, not 'unicorns and rainbows' promises made on the back of 10 years of cuts and austerity.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

David Davis and the DUP giving a speech on what they would do.

Hahaaaaaaaa

Waiting for the punch line.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

David Davis and the DUP giving a speech on what they would do.

Hahaaaaaaaa

Waiting for the punch line.

Talking of punchlines, the best one I read about yesterday was the Defence Secretary Williamson, advocating defending Gibraltar against the Spanish ships with 'paintballs'.
Yes, I kid you not, paintballs.

Lord Nelson will be turning in his grave in Westminster Abbey.

https://inews.co.uk/news/politics/g...ing-paintballs-at-spanish-ships-in-gibraltar/

 

[The Clamp]

Coperforma took over the hospital transport patient service.
https://www.eastbournehailshamandse...atient-transport-service-update/#.XD3Gblz7QdU

And was then wound up as it was useless

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-sussex-42399635


Wake up [MENTION=2719]Mouldy Boots[/MENTION].

Examples everywhere. As my own example, I do protection and safeguarding work in Safehouses and refuges. Government funded with some charity backing. As part of my role I am first responder in suicide attempts and any other medical emergency. I have just this morning spent £40 of my own money on a first responder medical kit as the ones provided are wholly inadequate and rarely replenished.
I don’t mind doing this in one respect as I’d rather be prepared for any eventuality but should we really be providing this equipment ourselves?

 

[Baldseagull]

Defeat by 200+ votes seems to be the consensus. You would think this means May has to resign.

In normal times maybe, but convention is out of the window, I don't think she will walk and leave the job with a ticking time bomb to No Deal.

 

[A1X]

Defeat by 200+ votes seems to be the consensus. You would think this means May has to resign.

I wouldn't bet on it. There are two things to remember about the current upper echelons of politics;

1. Nobody has any shame anymore
2. The one consistent thing about Theresa May's entire career is she will do literally anything to save her own skin at any cost

 

[Thunder Bolt]

I wouldn't bet on it. There are two things to remember about the current upper echelons of politics;

1. Nobody has any shame anymore
2. The one consistent thing about Theresa May's entire career is she will do literally anything to save her own skin at any cost

Unfortunately, I think you're right.

 

[dingodan]

I'd find it very odd if the EU became anti workers and consumer rights and against what is ethicly correct. You should remember how various Tory governments have sought, and obtained, opt outs for various workers rights that they thought were bad for business.

Not bad for workers, but bad for business you notice?
The whole Brexit ethos is that we leave and " cut the shackles " that are allegedly holding us back, you know, fair treatment for workers, food and products grown and made to high standards that consumers can trust?
So, by leaving, workers rights, such as they are, will further be eroded by Tory governments at every at every
opportunity in order to be competitive.

Or, as a big player,by size in Europe, we lead by being constructive by having MEP's who actually turn up and contribute to debate.

You can vote out a Conservative government if they have policies you don't like.

But you won't have a Conservative government forever.

& You might not have a "friendly" EU Commission forever either.

 

[The Clamp]

You can vote out a Conservative government if they have policies you don't like.

But you won't have a Conservative government forever.

& You might not have a "friendly" EU Commission forever either.

On the contrary. All solid evidence indicates that the EU want us to stay and will be welcoming if we do. They even went as far as ruling in December that we can reverse Brexit.
All indications are we would be welcomed back and the silly nonsense forgotten with no punitive conditions.

 

[Baldseagull]

David Davis advocating No Deal, because under Mays deal the EU are the outright winners. He isn't saying it will be a win for us, he seems to be saying we can't win, but we can make the EU lose too.

Sunlit Uplands. Exact same benefits out as in. Easiest deal in History. No Downside, only a very considerable upside.

 

[CHAPPERS]

Why would anyone listen to a former Brexit secretary who now pushes no deal? It's clear that's what he wanted all along and took the job trying (or not) to negotiate a deal.

****ing Tories.