Tommy Fraser - What's the Point?

[Brighton Breezy]

It never ceases to amaze me how people literally LOVE the likes of Carole who does a trick with no end product but just because someone's work is of the type which goes unnoticed, they must be crap.

Plenty of people said Hammond was no good and went missing during games. Look how much we have missed him since he left?

Im not saying Fraser is as good or as influential yet BUT it does show just how many fans completely overlook a lot of important work in the midfield.

 

[HP Seagull]

Not really. In recent weeks he's the ONLY albion player I've heard get stick from the fans AT games. And on here more people are waking up to the fact he does nothing whatsoever (unless, of course, there is a scrap to be run towards in order to make it seem he "cares"). This thread is proof of that. There are still a few who 'stubbornly' refuse to write him off, mainly because they're the ones who would rather be in the conference with a team of local youngsters than in the championship with some talented players. Maybe you're one?

That, as with all your other posts regarding Fraser, is absolute Rubbish.

He's by no means the only player to get stick from fans AT games, maybe you're just listening out for abuse aimed at him because you dislike him so much?

As for those who 'stubbornly refuse to write him off'. Maybe that they're the ones who realise that the reason we are above the dotted line is that the players are now playing with determination and pride, and that Fraser plays with a combination of pride and skill, and has also scored what could turn out to be one of the more important goals of the season.

You're belief that some would rather see the Albion playing in the Conference with a home-grown team is as innacurate as your views on Fraser. Yes we take pride in players that come from the local area; but only if they are good enough. Fraser quite clearly is.

 

[mona]

i truly don't take pleasure lambasting our own players

end of thread please

 

[HP Seagull]

He can go literally 15 minutes in games without touching the ball. Whatever he's doing off the ball cannot possibly make up for the fact we're basically playing with 10 men.

So when a player isn't touching a ball they're basically not playing? Does that mean there's only one person playing at any one time then?

 

[Brighton Breezy]

His game is not just limited to hard work though.

Take someone like El Abd. When he plays midfield he works his socks off and tackles anything that moves. BUT he is limited to sitting in front of the back four. Fraser often makes funs forward - something only he and Loft seem to do from midfield of late - which occupies defenders, creating more space for the forwards. Now, that is just one example of how someone can improve performances even when not in possession.

 

[Brighton Breezy]

He is good enough at this stage.

One fact which might support that is since he started playing regularly and for more of the 90 minutes we have got better and started winning games.

Just a thought like...

 

[Brighton Breezy]

We're winning in spite of him, not because of him.

Now if you were describing Kuipers there I would be inclined to agree with you...

 

[HP Seagull]

Jesus. Are you the man himself? Even his biggest supporters seem to use words like "potential" and "he will only get better." For you to say he is quite clearly good enough at this stage is madness. He's done nothing to prove that.

I do agree with the opening bit of your post though. Yes, the reason we're above the line is because a) Russell is f***ing brilliant, and b) the players have responded to him by working hard and putting effort in that wasn't seen in the first 30 odd games. But of the team that has started the last few matches there are ten players who've contributed more than Fraser. We're winning in spite of him, not because of him. The proof? Well he was total shite at Bristol and Huddersfield and we still managed 4 points. That, to me, says we've got some other players to be VERY grateful for - namely Owusu, Elphick, Virgo, Dicker, and Hart who have kept this team alive over recent matches.

But he quite clearly IS good enough to be playing at this stage though, otherwise he would not be playing would he?

I'm glad we agree on the fact that we are out of the relegation zone due to a renewed determination and commitment, but that is quite clearly as far as our agreeing on this subject goes.

For me he is a good player who does everything required of a midfield player at this level, even if he is no Roy Keane. Yes he no world-beater, and he is not the best player in our team but he does a steady job and will get better.

You are obviously entitled to disagree with me, but it just frustrates me when you seem to put all your efforts into making Fraser seem crap, and take joy from seeing others doing the same. Also posts saying it is good when fans get on his back are going to get us nowhere.

 

[Brighton Breezy]

Firstly, even I'll admit that Fraser is 10 times the footballer El Abd is. That's not in any doubt. But it's not down to Fraser being good, it's the result of El Abd being possibly the most limited player I've seen in my 15 years as a Brighton fan. So comparisons with him are pointless in my opinion.

Secondly, "often makes runs forward"? Does he? How many goals has he scored? How many assists? When was the last time he was an instrumental part in us scoring a goal or even producing some great attacking play? There were a couple of occasions on Saturday when he had the ball 30/40 yards out with noone near him yet a Huddersfield player approached him and took the ball away like a paedophile taking sweets from a baby. He's so often the boy in a "men against boys" situation. I don't think that's a player defenders need to "occupy" really.

Ermmm, overhead kick at Hereford? A point which could be seen by many as the TURNING POINT in our season.

 

[SirDouglasLoft]

Apart from Swindon I think the great man has been playing a pivotal role in our recovery. You just can't buy the experience and match-winning moments god brings:yahoo:

You really do need to get your tongue out of his arse.

 

[HP Seagull]

Clearly not. You're just making up what I've said now. All I expect is that someone playing in the busiest area of the pitch gets involved a hell of a lot more than Fraser does.

How have I in any way made that up?

 

[Brighton Breezy]

Apart from Swindon I think the great man has been playing a pivotal role in our recovery. You just can't buy the experience and match-winning moments god brings:yahoo:

OK, so apart from costing us a JPT Final and three points against Swindon which would have made us safe.

Oh, and throwing away a win at Northampton earlier in the season which again, would have made us safe.

And not seeming able to come anything more than a yard off his line to get a cross. At Huddersfied he SHOULD have come out for Booth's opener. Also, his palming over the bar in the second half from a long-thrown LUZZED straight at him was terrible.

I am not enjoying picking holes in Kuipers - merely doing it to illustrate how ANY player can be criticised in the way you are doing to Fraser.

His second goal in, count them, 76 first team matches.

Remind me how many Whing has scored? Remind me how many assists he has this season? Does that suddenly make him crap? No.

 

[HP Seagull]

OK, so apart from costing us a JPT Final and three points against Swindon which would have made us safe.

Oh, and throwing away a win at Northampton earlier in the season which again, would have made us safe.

And not seeming able to come anything more than a yard off his line to get a cross. At Huddersfied he SHOULD have come out for Booth's opener. Also, his palming over the bar in the second half from a long-thrown LUZZED straight at him was terrible.

I am not enjoying picking holes in Kuipers - merely doing it to illustrate how ANY player can be criticised in the way you are doing to Fraser.

Well said.