[News] Middle East conflict

[beorhthelm]

I am asking in which circumstances is this tactic acceptable. I didn't say which ones are definitively acceptable or not.

my answer is simple, they are all unacceptable. now you give it a go.

 

[de la zouch]

Root and cause.

Causing young children to see family being wounded or killed by Israel (often innocent people along with terrorists) is going to create a whole new generation of Hamas/Hezbollah.

There is no simple answer, but committing terrorist attacks themselves and constant war crimes isn't the answer.

Preventing attacks through infiltration and secret services should be goal number one. Then they would need to look at the best way to stop the next generation from becoming terrorists too.

What have do we hope when they teach 5yo to kill Jews?

 

[de la zouch]

Now no walkie no talk

 

[trueblue]

Plainly it is true that these pagers were distributed by Hezbollah leadership to Hezbollah operatives so it wasn't an indiscriminate attack. Sabotaging mobile phones distributed amongst the civilian population would be an indiscriminate attack.

I’m not sure if you’re being deliberately obtuse. Let’s make it easy for you. Israel gives a bad person an explosive device. Bad person is in a public place or driving when it explodes. Innocent people get hurt.

 

[Zeberdi]

I said Hamas were elected.

"In 2006 Palestinian legislative election, Hamas secured a majority in the Palestinian Legislative Council by campaigning on promises of a corruption-free government and advocating for resistance as a means to liberate Palestine from Israeli occupation."

I didn't say all Palestinians are terrorists.

You are quoting selective (wiki?) paragraphs out of context though - Hamas were not elected to rule Gaza per se, they beat Fatah in elections for the assembly of the Oslo Accords’ Palestinian Administrative Assembly in 2006 - which had authority over Gaza and the West Bank/East Jerusalem and was pro-West .

However, Hamas then took over the rule of Gaza by violent force overcoming Fatah in Gaza in 2007 and booting out the PA from Gaza. More than half of Gazans are under 18 - one year old at the last election - only a fraction of Palestinians today voted for Hamas in the 2006 Palestinian Assembly elections.

I know you didn’t actually ‘say’ Palestinians were terrorists btw but you did say Palestinians want ‘“Palestine’ which is known as ‘Israel’ back” which implies they want rid of Israel which is a terrorist ideology.

‘Israel’ does NOT include the Occupied Palestinian Territories ( Gaza, West Bank, East Jeruselem’ ) - yet it is these territories specifically which Palestinians civilians want back /freed from occupation ie back to pre-1967 6 Day War borders - it is only Hamas and Hezbollah that want the land back ‘known as Israel’ - ie prior to 1947 borders.


There is a crucial difference in each agenda - one is an extremist fundamentalist Jihadist agenda and one is a civil rights/two state solution agenda.

the Palestinian people who apparently prefer terrorism to a negotiated settlement.

I’m assuming (hoping) you were being ironic.


Anyway - I’m out - I stopped getting involved with discussions on Israel/Gaza on the Hamas thread as it became so polarised, overly biased and at times simply pedalling false information and becoming abusive toward people with differing views on both sides.

Some good background reading here

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/10/24/gaza-election-hamas-2006-palestine-israel/

 

[Crawley Dingo]

So the invasion of Lebanon looks imminent.

 

[Jackthelad]

Israel blows up Hezbollah pagers/phones/walkie talkies. Acceptable or not?
Hezbollah blows up Israel government pagers/phones/walkie talkies. Acceptable or not?
Russia blows up Ukrainian pagers/phones/walkie talkies. Acceptable or not?
Ukraine blows up Russian pagers/phones/walkie talkies. Acceptable or not?
The ANC blows up South African apartheid government pagers/phones/walkie talkies. Acceptable or not?
South African apartheid givernment blows up ANC pagers/phones/walkie talkies. Acceptable or not?
UK government blows up IRA pagers/phones/walkie talkies. Acceptable or not?
IRA blows up UK government pagers/phones/walkie talkies. Acceptable or not?

It's often based off who the TV tells us is evil or who politically do we agree with, who is left who is right. Sadly most people when it comes down to it believe in collective punishment.

 

[Guinness Boy]

Yup. And they could have been on buses, in shops, etc....

Indeed. Although it’s unlikely they’d have been targeted unless they were members of an Iran backed terror organisation. An organisation that was launching rockets at buses and shops in Israel. Will you condemn that?

 

[Ike and Tina Burner]

The next time a Hezbollah leader does a press conference will they use a microphone I wonder? Better not risk it if I was them.

 

[Seagull58]

I’m not sure if you’re being deliberately obtuse. Let’s make it easy for you. Israel gives a bad person an explosive device. Bad person is in a public place or driving when it explodes. Innocent people get hurt.

Some civilians got hurt. That doesn't mean it was an indiscriminate attack. It obviously wasn't.
Edit: here's a video of one exploding in the pager user's pocket with nobody else injured

Video appears to show pager explosion at Lebanon supermarket

Thousands of people were injured when pagers belonging to Hezbollah exploded almost simultaneously.

www.bbc.com

 

[Seagull58]

my answer is simple, they are all unacceptable. now you give it a go.

So if Ukraine managed to sabotage and detonate the mobile phones of 3000 of Putin's chain of command to disrupt his ability to wage war in Ukraine that would be unacceptable to you? Is that what you're saying?

 

[wellquickwoody]

To those defending Israeli actions above, take a look at the link below. Imagine if it were your loved ones sat next to these people……

 

[Seagull58]

To those defending Israeli actions above, take a look at the link below. Imagine if it were your loved ones sat next to these people……

It didn't happen.

 

[London Irish]

Now no walkie no talk

Still making little jokes about kids being killed and nurses being maimed. Everyone can see what a sick, radicalised extremist you are

 

[wellquickwoody]

It didn't happen.

10/10 Sherlock. Did you get a Masters in Stating the f***ing Obvious?

Maybe next time huh?

Know which mast your colours are pinned to.

 

[Psychobilly freakout]

10/10 Sherlock. Did you get a Masters in Stating the f***ing Obvious?

Maybe next time huh?

Know which mast your colours are pinned to.

Pretty Fkn obvious, blinded by faith.

 

[ElectricNaz]

Indeed. Although it’s unlikely they’d have been targeted unless they were members of an Iran backed terror organisation. An organisation that was launching rockets at buses and shops in Israel. Will you condemn that?

I would condemn it but it's genuinely hard to condemn something that hasn't happened. How do you know they've targetted these btw?

Also, does "Iran backed" make something worse than "it's Israel doing Israel things"?

 

[Seagull58]

10/10 Sherlock. Did you get a Masters in Stating the f***ing Obvious?

Maybe next time huh?

Know which mast your colours are pinned to.

I am ambivalent about the event. My colours are not pinned to a mast. Neither of us have any idea whether a pager would have been triggered if someone was up in a plane. It may be that someone in a plane would be out of signal range and so it couldnt have been detonated, or it may not. In any case, it's hypothetical.

 

[Seagull58]

Pretty Fkn obvious, blinded by faith.

Not the case but welcome back.

 

[wellquickwoody]

I am ambivalent about the event. My colours are not pinned to a mast. Neither of us have any idea whether a pager would have been triggered if someone was up in a plane. It may be that someone in a plane would be out of signal range and so it couldnt have been detonated, or it may not. In any case, it's hypothetical.

Take off and landing, most vulnerable time for an aircraft, DEFINITELY in range around those periods.