LDC at it again.

[Nemesis]

Please don't imagine that nothing has been happening over the past few days. The fact that the noise can't be heard everywhere doesn't mean that it isn't happening somewhere.

For me that has been part of our problem all along. The club has pursued planning permission in a lawful, dignified way. LDC, DEVagina, Butthole Baker and their lying NIMBY supporters have been underhanded and noisy at every single stage of the process.

We've had 2 marches and a rally that went largely un-noticed except locally. Meanwhile, those lying bastards have been getting the majority of favourable press-including the support of a Sussex newspaper that is unwilling to present both sides of the argument.

I'm with others who suggest that being 'nice' has got us absolutely nowhere and it is now time to make ourselves heard in an angry way. If it means lying through our asses in the same way those LDC/Falmer councillors and supporters have been doing all along-so be it.

I'm so angry with these people. If the club wants to carry on in the same way-let them. We can help speed this thing up by getting loud and angry.

 

[Curious Orange]

If it means lying through our asses in the same way those LDC/Falmer councillors and supporters have been doing all along-so be it.

I'm not sure of the benefits of getting donkeys to present our case for us...

 

[attila]

Totally agree.
I'm fed up with toeing the party line and being laughed at by this SCUM.
When's their next council meeting?
Let's give them what Bellotti got!

 

[Commander]

So how long does it take for the government to decide whether to give LDC more time or not?

 

[The Large One]

For me that has been part of our problem all along. The club has pursued planning permission in a lawful, dignified way. LDC, DEVagina, Butthole Baker and their lying NIMBY supporters have been underhanded and noisy at every single stage of the process.

We've had 2 marches and a rally that went largely un-noticed except locally. Meanwhile, those lying bastards have been getting the majority of favourable press-including the support of a Sussex newspaper that is unwilling to present both sides of the argument.

I'm with others who suggest that being 'nice' has got us absolutely nowhere and it is now time to make ourselves heard in an angry way. If it means lying through our asses in the same way those LDC/Falmer councillors and supporters have been doing all along-so be it.

I'm so angry with these people. If the club wants to carry on in the same way-let them. We can help speed this thing up by getting loud and angry.

I simply don't agree.

It appears that not only do you want Falmer, you want to make sure that everyone knows about it in a manner that angrily says 'f*** you, NIMBYs'. Whilst that's not a bad necessarily a bad stance to take, it's also not that important.

Falmer is NOT going to be approved or declined on headlines and PR. It's going to be approved or declined on planning and legal issues. Lewes District Council know this, and hence are pissing about. The government knows EXACTLY how we feel, and are well aware of the need and desire for the stadium.

So who are you going to mount an angry protest at? The NIMBYs? Pointless. LDC? Ditto. The government? Give over - they APPROVED it. Getting angry will NOT speed things up - except maybe a coronary for yourself.

Listen mate, we're all pissed off with them and have been for far too long, but LDC are getting nowhere, and making themselves look very stupid and incompetent in the process. It's the voters who will let them know this ultimately. This latest wheeze is on two fronts - an extra part of the ongoing delay, but also to drive the deadline until AFTER the local elections. I am certain Martin Perry would have let Ruth Kelly know all this. If we know it, Martin Perry knows it.

 

[Nemesis]

Listen mate, we're all pissed off with them and have been for far too long, but LDC are getting nowhere, and making themselves look very stupid and incompetent in the process. It's the voters who will let them know this ultimately. This latest wheeze is on two fronts - an extra part of the ongoing delay, but also to drive the deadline until AFTER the local elections. I am certain Martin Perry would have let Ruth Kelly know all this. If we know it, Martin Perry knows it.

You say LDC are getting nowhere but my eyes tell me that they have delayed this process for so long and have got exactly what they've wanted so far-and without spending the millions that the club has fighting them. The Government may have given its approval but that has been quashed by the High Court so we are essentially without planning permission again are we not?

Let's remember that LDC are the experts when it comes to delaying tactics and lies. If they weren't, we'd be in our second or third season at Falmer already-rather than still waiting for a watertight approval. Even if we got approval today we're still looking at a realistic move in date 4 years down the line.

All along we've been told by the club that everything is fine and we'll get planning permission (hell, we even celebrated it with some cheap bubbly how long ago?) but how much longer do we play this passive waiting game? I am waiting for us to move into Falmer so I can scatter my father's ashes there. He died nearly 9 years ago and the way things are going it'll be another 9 before I can do it. Sometimes I think it will never happen.......

 

[BensGrandad]

We have all done it before so would it help if we all wrote to to Ruth Kelly asking that she refuses LDC the extra time that they have requested. As has been said everything that they want to say has either been said or should be ready to be said now. The problem is would they then use that as ammunition for another appeal.

 

[Curious Orange]

We have all done it before so would it help if we all wrote to to Ruth Kelly asking that she refuses LDC the extra time that they have requested. As has been said everything that they want to say has either been said or should be ready to be said now. The problem is would they then use that as ammunition for another appeal.

To be honest I think that the pressure from the interested parties is all that is required. The general public (us) aren't involved in this process so our frustrated opinions aren't really relevant.

 

[BensGrandad]

To be honest I think that the pressure from the interested parties is all that is required. The general public (us) aren't involved in this process so our frustrated opinions aren't really relevant.

Unfortunately we are like King Canute trying to push the waves back. Completly helpless.

 

[Caveman]

Unfortunately we are like King Canute trying to push the waves back. Completly helpless.

Would a mass leaflet drop in Lewes and the surrounding areas, by us, the general public showing disgust and urging people not to vote LDC be a way of getting our point across?

We're not helpless!

 

[Brovion]

I simply don't agree.

It appears that not only do you want Falmer, you want to make sure that everyone knows about it in a manner that angrily says 'f*** you, NIMBYs'. Whilst that's not a bad necessarily a bad stance to take, it's also not that important.

Falmer is NOT going to be approved or declined on headlines and PR. It's going to be approved or declined on planning and legal issues. Lewes District Council know this, and hence are pissing about. The government knows EXACTLY how we feel, and are well aware of the need and desire for the stadium.

So who are you going to mount an angry protest at? The NIMBYs? Pointless. LDC? Ditto. The government? Give over - they APPROVED it. Getting angry will NOT speed things up - except maybe a coronary for yourself.

Listen mate, we're all pissed off with them and have been for far too long, but LDC are getting nowhere, and making themselves look very stupid and incompetent in the process. It's the voters who will let them know this ultimately. This latest wheeze is on two fronts - an extra part of the ongoing delay, but also to drive the deadline until AFTER the local elections. I am certain Martin Perry would have let Ruth Kelly know all this. If we know it, Martin Perry knows it.

That all SOUNDS very good but the reality is different - it's a war and LDC are winning. Every event since 'Falmer Friday' has gone according to LDC's plan and we are further away than ever. So what shall we do? Quick, let's organise a protest march, that'll show them! Bollocks it will. I didn't go on that stupid and pathetic march when the LibDem conference was in town (I went to West Ham v Newcastle instead) as I knew it would be a complete and utter waste of time - and so it has proved. It made ZERO impression on the LibDem hirearchy and it has had ZERO effect. If it had been of any use we'd have seen a practical demonstration before now - like the LibDem hirearchy putting pressure on their LDC colleagues to, if not drop the case then at least stop all the delaying tactics and let events take their course. They haven't of course and they won't, the demo's all been forgotten about now and all it took to dissipate any threat were a few faux-sincere words from some politicians to some of our more gullible fans.

LDC need to know that if our club dies it won't be the only death in the area* - what's wrong with firing a warning shot across their bows? We need to adopt a 'armalite and ballot box' approach.

*I'm an obviously not condoning the use of violence against LDC members. That would be wrong.

 

[Seagull73]

That all SOUNDS very good but the reality is different - it's a war and LDC are winning. Every event since 'Falmer Friday' has gone according to LDC's plan and we are further away than ever. So what shall we do? Quick, let's organise a protest march, that'll show them! Bollocks it will. I didn't go on that stupid and pathetic march when the LibDem conference was in town (I went to West Ham v Newcastle instead) as I knew it would be a complete and utter waste of time - and so it has proved. It made ZERO impression on the LibDem hirearchy and it has had ZERO effect. If it had been of any use we'd have seen a practical demonstration before now - like the LibDem hirearchy putting pressure on their LDC colleagues to, if not drop the case then at least stop all the delaying tactics and let events take their course. They haven't of course and they won't, the demo's all been forgotten about now and all it took to dissipate any threat were a few faux-sincere words from some politicians to some of our more gullible fans.

LDC need to know that if our club dies it won't be the only death in the area* - what's wrong with firing a warning shot across their bows? We need to adopt a 'armalite and ballot box' approach.

*I'm an obviously not condoning the use of violence against LDC members. That would be wrong.

LDC are winning are they? Mmm, well that's news to me, I could've sworn they are running scared, and backing out of court cases right now because they simply didn't have the money to fight this in the legitimate way. How absent minded of me to think that equated to LDC winning their case.

Why do you think the government only gave 35 days to get responses in as opposed to usual 6 weeks? I'll tell you shall I, because the government is well aware how much pissing around LDC are doing, but are humouring them to thinking they do have a chance. Yes it's frustrating, yes it's down right dirty what LDC are doing, but it's desperation time from them, because they know the evidence they put together last time was not worth the paper it was written on, hence why they want more time to come up with new bullshit.

Patience my friend, we shall prevail.

 

[Tom Bombadil]

.

Falmer is NOT going to be approved or declined on headlines and PR. It's going to be approved or declined on planning and legal issues.

I think that's incredibly naive

 

[Barrel of Fun]

I think that's incredibly naive

Yes, if the decision hinges on the benefits and in national interest, to overrule current planning guidelines.

 

[Simster]

I think that's incredibly naive

I totally agree.

If the LDC are allowed an extension, I think we're buggered. As LB said on that other thread, they are abusing the planning process and getting away with it. It is a DISGRACE and if they ask for an extension, they should be told by the government to f*** off.

 

[Tooting Gull]

The only slight concern I have on the 'Lewes aren't winning' view is what exactly is winning for them? To start with it was rejection of the stadium, but that hasn't happened. Then it evolved into 'keep it going as long as possible, they haven't got the funds to hang in there'.

Well, until we know exactly the state of our finances, we don't know whether they are winning or not. Can anyone on here in the know say categorically that we can go on for another three/four years at Withdean?

 

[Pavilionaire]

Ruth Kelly will be aware of the accusation of timewasting levelled at LDC by the Albion and their representatives.

The timeframe that Kelly's office has specified seems reasonable given the length of the enquiry and I expect her to tell them to f*** off because they don't appear to have any clear grounds for an extension.

Her reaction will probably give a damn good indication of which way the case will go.

 

[West Hoathly Seagull]

My only slight worry is that Ruth Kelly seems to be rather more sympathetic to NIMBYs than Prescott was, as these two decisions show:

http://www.skyscrapernews.com/news.php?ref=789

http://www.skyscrapernews.com/news.php?ref=781

In the second one, she has rejected the advice of her own inspectors.

If you are going to write to Ruth Kelly, please do it via your MPs. If you write directly to her, you will only receive an official's reply. If you write to your MP, he/she will write to the Minister (I'm not sure who now is in charge of planning; it used to be Yvette Cooper) and, though an official will draft the reply to your MP it will be signed by the Minister, who will read the reply before signing it. The Minister will be well aware that this is a controversial issue and will not simply sign the reply.

 

[Brovion]

LDC are winning are they? Mmm, well that's news to me, I could've sworn they are running scared, and backing out of court cases right now because they simply didn't have the money to fight this in the legitimate way. How absent minded of me to think that equated to LDC winning their case.

Why do you think the government only gave 35 days to get responses in as opposed to usual 6 weeks? I'll tell you shall I, because the government is well aware how much pissing around LDC are doing, but are humouring them to thinking they do have a chance. Yes it's frustrating, yes it's down right dirty what LDC are doing, but it's desperation time from them, because they know the evidence they put together last time was not worth the paper it was written on, hence why they want more time to come up with new bullshit.

Patience my friend, we shall prevail.

I obviously hope you're right but I'm not 100% convinced. Also I don' t think they're 'running scared', they're concentrating on getting the most 'bang for their buck' and making the most of their resources. A classic example was apparently 'capitulating' at the 11th hour and not going to Court when in fact all they did was agree basically to what had been offered six months previously. By stringing it out they were able to delay the project by another six months for zero cost and at the same time increase the Albion's 'Withdean Losses'. Think of them as an skilfully-led army slowly retreating: they're giving up ground but only when they absolutely have to and only after making us pay heavily for it.

Oh and Tooting they have three possible victory scenarios:

1 - They actually DO win the planning battle.

2 - The club run out of money and go bust.

3 - Before point 2 is reached there is a 'regime change' at the club (perhaps led by all those 'where's the money gone?' morons who post on here). The new regime then say something like 'Perhaps we ought to look at the possibilty of staying at Withdean'.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

Just a point of information - After consulting a member of the Falmer4All 'faction' the emphathis seemed to be on holding back on our writing for the time being. We must not put any unreasonable pressure on Ruth Kelly to make a decision.