Is this justice?

[Falmer]

If you are going to pass on info you should make some basic enquiries to verify it?



I tried but no matter how I try I just can't see it from our house so alas no views at all of Guantanamo Bay.



That makes him innocent. Perhaps we should have a review of all the inmates currently enjoying accommodation at her majesty's pleasure and if anyone dares to claim they didn't do it then we'll be obliged to release them.



You're right of course. I stil believe 50,000,000 could have been saved had Hitler, Churchill, Roosevelt and Stalin had a knockout game of Rock Paper Scissors.





Falmer did not raise a good subject. He (or she) totally misrepresented the facts by comparing a person convicted and sentenced in relation to a heinous crime to a person who hasn't even been tried yet, including, apparently, the fact the crimes relate to different countries and their criminal justice system.


As for usual suspects, how do I apply. Everyone enjoys a good debate but this is far from it. Furthermore, if Falmer is suffering then perhaps they shouldn't be posting shite in the first place. Still, that's for moderators to decide.

What the hell? how could Hitler, W.Churchill etc have sorted the problem with the death penalty? Weird way of responding to my comments?
But if this is supposed to be humorous then I'd strongly recommend re-assessing your jokes. The Guantanamo one about not being able to see it from your window. How did you even think that was funny let alone bother to post it!?
All in all just another nasty thread attacking me, not the debate.

 

[drew]

What the hell? how could Hitler, W.Churchill etc have sorted the problem with the death penalty? Weird way of responding to my comments?
But if this is supposed to be humorous then I'd strongly recommend re-assessing your jokes. The Guantanamo one about not being able to see it from your window. How did you even think that was funny let alone bother to post it!?
All in all just another nasty thread attacking me, not the debate.

You were the one that questioned why some people could consider killing as a way of solving issues.

As for humour, I admit I can't compete with you but I'm not sure you are aware how humourous your threads are. And there is a trend, ie you end up being ridiculed. You know what they say about heat and kitchens!

 

[shellsuit]

I've actually had a decent debate .

I am going to step out of the box here and agree with you falmer on this one point.
The extradition treaty we have with the USA is totally wrong and one sided, your original post however comparing these two crimes was an error on your part they are unrelated in too many ways. I hope you realise this is why so many people jump on your back immediately.
Furthermore I also do not think it is fair that you should not be engaged on this forum as some advocate simply because you told everyone you have a mental condition. I say all are welcome on NSC and we should not discriminate, , im sure you don’t want to treated differently to any other member simply because you have a mental condition the same as you do not wish to be treated differently in day to day life because of it. to do so would be incredibly patronising, especially as you have made a conscious decision to post threads on here and from the evidence and frequency of your posts you obviously feel you are confident enough to debate the issues in your own special way. So I say keep posting falmer, bring on your wacky theories (my opinion) and carry on giving back as much as you receive and don’t listen to the patronising idiots who say you must be handled with kid gloves, not engaged in arguments and treated as some sort of social pariah simply because you are different.

 

[Uncle Spielberg]

I am going to step out of the box here and agree with you falmer on this one point.
The extradition treaty we have with the USA is totally wrong and one sided, your original post however comparing these two crimes was an error on your part they are unrelated in too many ways. I hope you realise this is why so many people jump on your back immediately.
Furthermore I also do not think it is fair that you should not be engaged on this forum as some advocate simply because you told everyone you have a mental condition. I say all are welcome on NSC and we should not discriminate, , im sure you don’t want to treated differently to any other member simply because you have a mental condition the same as you do not wish to be treated differently in day to day life because of it. to do so would be incredibly patronising, especially as you have made a conscious decision to post threads on here and from the evidence and frequency of your posts you obviously feel you are confident enough to debate the issues in your own special way. So I say keep posting falmer, bring on your wacky theories (my opinion) and carry on giving back as much as you receive and don’t listen to the patronising idiots who say you must be handled with kid gloves, not engaged in arguments and treated as some sort of social pariah simply because you are different.

Agree with that. I don't think anyone expects anyone else to be treated differently but with some respect.

 

[BadFish]

If anyone else had started this thread I'd imagine a decent discussion kicking off. As it is, Falmer leaves himself wide open to abuse and the usual posters tear him to pieces.


Anyone else just find it... boring?

A fine example of online bullying. Some people should really grow up!

 

[Uncle Spielberg]

Bullying behavior may include name calling, verbal or written abuse, exclusion from activities, exclusion from social situations, physical abuse, or coercion.[13][18] Bullies may behave this way to be perceived as popular or tough or to get attention. They may bully out of jealousy or be acting out because they themselves are bullied.[19]

U.S. National Center for Education Statistics suggests that bullying can be classified into two categories: Direct bullying, and indirect bullying (which is also known as social aggression).[1]

Ross states that direct bullying involves a great deal of physical aggression, such as shoving and poking, throwing things, slapping, choking, punching and kicking, beating, stabbing, pulling hair, scratching, biting, scraping, and pinching.[20]

He also suggests that social aggression or indirect bullying is characterized by attempting to socially isolate the victim. This isolation is achieved through a wide variety of techniques, including spreading gossip, refusing to socialize with the victim, bullying other people who wish to socialize with the victim, and criticizing the victim's manner of dress and other socially-significant markers (including the victim's race, religion, disability, sex, or sexual preference, etc.). Ross[20] outlines other forms of indirect bullying which are more subtle and more likely to be verbal, such as name calling, the silent treatment, arguing others into submission, manipulation, gossip/false gossip, lies, rumors/false rumors, staring, giggling, laughing at the victim, saying certain words that trigger a reaction from a past event, and mocking. The UK based children's charity, Act Against Bullying, was set up in 2003 to help children who were victims of this type of bullying by researching and publishing coping skills.

It has been noted that there tend to be differences in how bullying manifests itself between the sexes. Males tend to be more likely to be physically aggressive whereas females tend to favour exclusion and mockery, though it has been noticed that females are becoming more physical in their bullying,[16] whereas conversely, males tend to opt for exclusion and mockery rather than physical aggression when the victim is perceived as too strong, or being physical would otherwise cause problems for the bullies (i.e., cowardice), and/or the bullies see physical aggression as immature (i.e., the bullying is occurring among adults).

 

[Falmer]

I am going to step out of the box here and agree with you falmer on this one point.
The extradition treaty we have with the USA is totally wrong and one sided, your original post however comparing these two crimes was an error on your part they are unrelated in too many ways. I hope you realise this is why so many people jump on your back immediately.
.

But these two crimes are the 2 crimes the whole net are comparing (check the internet). What I've read is that both men will be trailed in The US, it even mentions it on the link i post on this thread. Okay if that is incorrect it's incorrect but that's the same info going all over the web, hardly false information which requires a backlash (not that i'm saying you think it does).

Most of the comments made towards me are just exposure towards the current state of happiness some NSC users are in, I'm really not as stupid as they'll like to think. Depression is becoming a world wide issue not just on NSC, Depression is the 3rd biggest killer in the US soon to be the first, the figures in England aren't far off. The ones who admit to the depression win and finally defeat it, the ones who attack it ie bullying, name calling, ganging up etc are actually the biggest sufferers of this disease but have denial and insecurities eating away at them. It's very alarming what social issues are just around the corner and this thread indicates why.

 

[Uncle Spielberg]

I do agree that the state of Mankind is at an all time low. Many areas of society are imploding now and the day will come when something will have to give. Large parts of mankind are now socially and morally bankrupt. The fall of the capitalist model we are now going through is just one element of this but soon it could be " every man for himself ". If society cannot provide or have a system that allows people to provide for themselves and their families they will find another way. We are in the early stages of a complete change in society and how it provides for itself.

 

[Falmer]

I do agree that the state of Mankind is at an all time low. Many areas of society are imploding now and the day will come when something will have to give. Large parts of mankind are now socially and morally bankrupt. The fall of the capitalist model we are now going through is just one element of this but soon it could be " every man for himself ". If society cannot provide or have a system that allows people to provide they will find another way. We are in the early stages of a complete change in society and how it provides for itself.

Couldn't be more correct.

 

[Uncle Spielberg]

I think something like 10 000 000 adults in the UK are on, or have been on anti depressants. There are very deep seated dissatisfactions in our society with the state of this country and the world in general and it is only just under the surface.

 

[Falmer]

I think something like 10 000 000 adults in the UK are on, or have been on anti depressants. There are very deep seated dissatisfactions in our society with the state of this country and the world in general and it is only just under the surface.

This is why I'm a believer that 2012 december 21st will be the world ending as we know it, surely things will only get better. The age of Aquarius is coming! the flip between poor and rich will have a change, mentally.

 

[sten_super]

But these two crimes are the 2 crimes the whole net are comparing (check the internet). What I've read is that both men will be trailed in The US, it even mentions it on the link i post on this thread. Okay if that is incorrect it's incorrect but that's the same info going all over the web, hardly false information which requires a backlash (not that i'm saying you think it does).

One of the problems with the internet is that nothing has to be corroborated or checked. My genuine advice to you would be not to take anything at face value, check everything yourself. You've made the same mistake that 'the whole net' has also made, of believing straightforwardly what you are told and not confirming the facts. A quick google search has thrown up many references (none of which I recognise, so which I wouldn't trust independently, but as a collective seem to suggest truth) to Miguel Carcano being jailed in Spain for 20 years for the murder (he was found not guilty of rape) and disposal of the body of a 17 year old girl near Seville. The maximum sentence available was 52 years.

I think your certainty, allied with often flimsy evidence, rubs a lot of people up the wrong way. While I don't condone the behaviour of some on here towards you, you don't help yourself with your subsequent conduct. My general advice, beyond what I've written above, is to treat others as you would like to be treated; if you want people to take you and your arguments seriously, take criticism or counter-arguments seriously and attempt to address them in a sensible fashion.

 

[Falmer]

One of the problems with the internet is that nothing has to be corroborated or checked. My genuine advice to you would be not to take anything at face value, check everything yourself. You've made the same mistake that 'the whole net' has also made, of believing straightforwardly what you are told and not confirming the facts. A quick google search has thrown up many references (none of which I recognise, so which I wouldn't trust independently, but as a collective seem to suggest truth) to Miguel Carcano being jailed in Spain for 20 years for the murder (he was found not guilty of rape) and disposal of the body of a 17 year old girl near Seville. The maximum sentence available was 52 years.

I think your certainty, allied with often flimsy evidence, rubs a lot of people up the wrong way. While I don't condone the behaviour of some on here towards you, you don't help yourself with your subsequent conduct. My general advice, beyond what I've written above, is to treat others as you would like to be treated; if you want people to take you and your arguments seriously, take criticism or counter-arguments seriously and attempt to address them in a sensible fashion.

Sorry, I didn't realise this was court.

 

[Uncle Spielberg]

I respect your beliefs Falmer. This is not what I am saying but that the UK and the World will have to find a way to provide for its people in the future as the Capitalist model is on the very brink of collapse. If the Euro goes down , that will be the final straw. Already many countries in Europe, Greece and others cannot provide anymore. Thats why people are on the streets as the model and their government has let them down. If a Man in Greece with a wife and 3 kids to support cannot provide what is he expected to do ? 2012 will be a pivotal year for mankind as we are in the most challenging times known to man exceeding the 2 wars and great depression of the late 20's. The Wars had a collective spirit coursing through the country now it is and gets more and more everyday " every man for himself " and society is fragmenting with the have nots getting more and more pissed off at the haves. A banker being awarded £ 1m bonuses on top of his £ 1.2m salary from a bank bailed out by the UK taxpayer is hardly going to help that feeling of injustice that is on the brink of being a catalyst for disharmony.

 

[drew]

But these two crimes are the 2 crimes the whole net are comparing (check the internet). What I've read is that both men will be trailed in The US, it even mentions it on the link i post on this thread. Okay if that is incorrect it's incorrect but that's the same info going all over the web, hardly false information which requires a backlash (not that i'm saying you think it does).

Most of the comments made towards me are just exposure towards the current state of happiness some NSC users are in, I'm really not as stupid as they'll like to think. Depression is becoming a world wide issue not just on NSC, Depression is the 3rd biggest killer in the US soon to be the first, the figures in England aren't far off. The ones who admit to the depression win and finally defeat it, the ones who attack it ie bullying, name calling, ganging up etc are actually the biggest sufferers of this disease but have denial and insecurities eating away at them. It's very alarming what social issues are just around the corner and this thread indicates why.

You say trialed in the US (I assume mean they both will go to trial in the US). Where do you find this. As far as I can see from the internet, Carano has already been tried in Spain and is serving his sentence there? That makes them two entirely separate cases. As others have said, assuming the guy gets extradicted to the US and assuming he gets convicted of everything he is charged with and assuming he gets the maximum possible, which I think has been quoted as 50 yrs, and assuming that the sentencing will be on a consecutive basis rather than concurrent, the case will still remain totally different.

 

[beorhthelm]

I am going to step out of the box here and agree with you falmer on this one point.
The extradition treaty we have with the USA is totally wrong and one sided, your original post however comparing these two crimes was an error on your part they are unrelated in too many ways. I hope you realise this is why so many people jump on your back immediately.

that wasnt falmers point, he'd didnt even realise there was extradition involved. on this point though, we might want to explore the subject more. i thougt as you that its one sided, but they had a peice on Newsnight last week that said we have made a similar number of extradition requests to them as they have to us, and all our requests have been accepted. the agreement may not be as one sided as some perceive it to be (i confess i have not looked any further).

 

[Falmer]

I respect your beliefs Falmer. This is not what I am saying but that the UK and the World will have to find a way to provide for its people in the future as the Capitalist model is on the very brink of collapse. If the Euro goes down , that will be the final straw. Already many countries in Europe, Greece and others cannot provide anymore. Thats why people are on the streets as the model and their government has let them down. If a Man in Greece with a wife and 3 kids to support cannot provide what is he expected to do ? 2012 will be a pivotal year for mankind as we are in the most challenging times known to man exceeding the 2 wars and great dperession of the late 20's. The Wars had a collective spirit coursing through the country now it is and get more and more everyday " every man for himself " and society is fragmenting with the have nots getting more and more pissed off at the haves. A banker being awarded £ 1m bonuses on top of his £ 1.2m salary from a bank bailed out by the UK taxpayer is hardly going to help that feeling of injustice that is on the brink of being a catalyst for disharmony.

Yes I agree, but I think the collapse of the euro was pre-emped so we would all eventually call for the one currency linked to new world order (not that'll happen). I think people will come to a realisation of how bad the rulers of this world really are, that includes people right down to management positions. It's as you say 'every man for himself' which gets you anywhere in this current world, it's that mentally which currently so wrongly gains respect. Soon it'll be the curse and disease of humans, a lack of trying to become one.
I think the riots of last summer were a very good clue as to what will be the eventual out come for all this social unrest.

 

[sten_super]

Sorry, I didn't realise this was court.

Do you really wonder why people get annoyed with you?

I'm trying to be helpful, but let me put this in a more straightforward way for you;
If you post poorly-researched bullshit, expect abuse. Does that help?

 

[Falmer]

that wasnt falmers point, he'd didnt even realise there was extradition involved. on this point though, we might want to explore the subject more. i thougt as you that its one sided, but they had a peice on Newsnight last week that said we have made a similar number of extradition requests to them as they have to us, and all our requests have been accepted. the agreement may not be as one sided as some perceive it to be (i confess i have not looked any further).

I did know about the extradition for both suspects as I've said.

 

[Falmer]

If you post poorly-researched bullshit, expect abuse. Does that help?

why? abusers tend to have been abused themselves you know?