Dicker or Navarro?

[Hungry Joe]

Well it's not a stupid thing to say, it's FACTUAL. Gillingham, a team in league 2 last season, couldn't wait to get rid of him. He was playing for bloody Wrexham on loan - my case is closed! And Navarro was deemed not good enough for a team that finished in the play-offs of our league last season. Funnily enough, isn't that meant to be our aim?

You say Dicker is a good defensive midfielder, which I totally agree with, but that surely means we need an attacking one alongside him. And you think CROFTS is that man? Really? Name me one moment of attacking play from him in the 6 games so far.....

Mate, you think there's no chance for midfielders to improve past 25 and that it's not a stupid thing to say that some of our players can 'do one' just because they came from Gillingham (and don't pretend to know why Gillingham didn't want them anymore) so there's not much point trying to have a sensible debate with you.

 

[Smythe]

If Dicker is the defensive midfielder we need then surely Thornhill is the player to partner him, was expecting good things from him, hoping he gets fit and gets a run in the team with Dicker........im sure if those 2 play well and click we'll fly up the table!!!!

 

[The Large One]

We've got Dicker and Thornhill, so there are options.

Thornhill's crocked isn't he?

Also, instead of wasting a season because we've bought duds in midfield, we will hopefully get someone else in (even if it's on loan). There really is no need for this "he's all we've got attitude." If he's not good enough then replace him.

Is that the answer? We've got X player, he's not playing well, get so-and-so in, get more people in, he's available, get him in etc... and before you know it, it's the same scenario as last season. You bed down with what you've got, and improve with a long-term strategy - a strategy which you won't necessarily see the benefits of right away. Constantly chopping just because someone had a bad game isn't going to help anyone.

Crofts won't improve - he's 25. And Navarro is 28 (going on 48) so again he won't be getting any better.

Players don't improve beyond the age of 25? Rubbish. Absolute drivel. Any player can improve at any time.

 

[BensGrandad]

Gillingham, a team in league 2 last season, couldn't wait to get rid of him. He was playing for bloody Wrexham on loan - my case is closed!

That statement is correct but misleading I think that you will find he fell out with Stimson the Gillingham manager and as Dean Saunders is both manager of Wrexham and Ast Manager of Wales he went there just to play some games and keep match fit to keep in the eyes of the Welsh Squad and management not because that was his standard. Having said that he like most that Slade has bought would be squad players to come in as an emergency for injuries etc but none are good enough except Dickenson to command a first team place automatically, possibly Dicker on last seasons form and the short time he has played this. The rest are in my opinion generally poor buys in the main, Tunicliffe it remains to be seen if he is any better than Elphick or Virgo and the same with Graeme Smith.

 

[Simster]

All this kerfuffle about Crofts - I'm fairly sure when we signed him (and after reading reviews of his form at previous clubs) that the general concensus on here was that he was an excellent signing as a squad player. I can't help thinking that a match fit Navarro sounds like he would be the sort of asset that Slade is hoping for, and the same goes for Dicker when Slade deems him ready to play regularly.

 

[8ace]

I would agree with you, except you wonder why Dicker was brought in if he is that difficult to manage.

Perhaps there was an agreement that we would buy Dicker in the close season as part of the deal to bring him here on loan initially (pure speculation on my part).

 

[Brighton Breezy]

Crofts is average at very best. He has done nothing so far this season that Fraser, Loft et al couldn't have managed, i.e. run around bit, win the odd tackle and pass the ball - occasionally to someone on the same team.

Navarro looks stupidly unfit. Ok, he missed a chunk of pre-season but shouldn't he have been keeping himself fit? Waste of time.

Dicker is a huge puzzle. Slade got him in so there is no reason why he shouldn't be playing him. If it IS some sort of statement to the player from Slade then Slade is more of an idiot than I thought. Six games in and no wins is NOT the time to be keeping someone on the bench to prove a point.

We have quite simply NEVER replaced Dean Hammond and the club has been going backwards pretty much ever since we let him go.

 

[Silent Bob]

If Navarro starts on Saturday I'm walking out.

 

[Hungry Joe]

If Navarro starts on Saturday I'm walking out.

I bet you don't.

 

[Billy the Fish]

Well it's not a stupid thing to say, it's FACTUAL. Gillingham, a team in league 2 last season, couldn't wait to get rid of him. He was playing for bloody Wrexham on loan - my case is closed!

Not quite. Crofts fell out with the management at the pikeys, I think because he refused to sign a contract. That's why they farmed him out on loan.

That said, I haven't been to a game yet this season so I can't comment on how good he is, I'll let you all know on saturday night

 

[Tony Meolas Loan Spell]

If Navarro starts on Saturday I'm walking out.

If that happens please can you take Slade with you. I bet he wont be far behind especially if we lose.

You know it saddens me coz if a new manager came in they WILL pick Dicker ahead of Crofts or Navorro or Thornhill and he will be hailed as a messaiah and why didnt Slade do this before etc etc.

It IS within Slades hands to turn it round. But I really do believe he has Adams syndrome (cant see the bleedin obvious)

 

[Brighton Breezy]

And that is the most important point in the whole debate. I thought, sorry KNEW, Fraser was shit from the moment I saw him. Clearing out deadwood like that was absolutely critical in us progressing. However, all we've done (in central midfield at least) is replace them with exactly the same players. You can't tell me that Crofts or Navarro are any better than Fraser or Loft. Anonymous during games? Check. Runs around a bit? Check. Relies on 'passion' over skill? Check. Incapable of passing the ball more than 10 yards? Check. It's just the same player back under a different name! We had a glorious chance to get a quality player in that position who could be a lynchpin for years to come, a Richard Carpenter type signing, and we f***ed it up.

Exactly. We had a chance to really move the club on after clearing out everyone. With Dicker already signed we could have gone after one CLASS creative player and not wasted wages on dross which was no better than Fraser.

 

[Hungry Joe]

You can't tell me that Crofts or Navarro are any better than Fraser or Loft.

Yes I can and they are. Posting loads of LARGE TYPE and saying 'shit' a lot doesn't make your arguments any more convincing.

 

[Brighton M]

I forgot about thornhill. Why is he out of favour?

 

[Couldn't Be Hyypia]

Is it possible, just a faint possibility, that Slade and Dicker have had some kind of issue but that Slade does not want to manage the situation in public. He wants to deal with the player face to face and get the situation resolved. So he puts a perhaps partially complete story out about pre-season because he doesn't feel it is appropriate or constructive to share everything with the general public?

I think that would be fair enough to be honest. Sometimes you have to manage people that way and it's not appropriate to make the management an open process.

Of course Dicker is the better player based on what we have seen so far - and I suspect RS knows that. I do think Navarro has potential to be our enforcer however. Hopefully RS and Dicker can resolve things very very soon.

 

[Silent Bob]

I bet you don't.

How much?

 

[Hungry Joe]

Fraser is 21, Crofts is 25. When Fraser is 25 he will be a better player than Crofts is now.

And that's coming from the most anti-Fraser person on this board.

I admire your ability to see into the future. So midfielders improve between 21-25 and then its all downhill or tiny increments of progress. Hmm.