Derek Chapman has a swipe at DK

[London Irish]

Not in the slightest, no.

Chapman getting his company to carry out the essential works, at COST or just above, BECAUSE we didn't have a pot to piss in, and thus couldn't get the work done otherwise, is extremely relevant.

You're completely dodging the issue of double standards - of course the Albion benefited from Adenstar, but Adenstar and Chapman still got PAID for the work. Just as the Albion benefited for all the financial input from Dick Knight and shouldn't be criticised for wanting SOME of that back, especially by Chapman who did get something back.

Further, if you read Chapman's piece, you wouldn't know that Adenstar has continued to benefit from Albion construction work. Maybe not Chapman personally but certainly the company he founded. Take a look at the front of their website where it promotes their Amex contracts.
http://www.adenstar-group.co.uk/

Again, in that light, how can Chapman criticise Dick Knight?

 

[Titanic]

You're completely dodging the issue of double standards - of course the Albion benefited from Adenstar, but Adenstar and Chapman still got PAID for the work. Just as the Albion benefited for all the financial input from Dick Knight and shouldn't be criticised for wanting SOME of that back, especially by Chapman who did get something back.

Further, if you read Chapman's piece, you wouldn't know that Adenstar has continued to benefit from Albion construction work. Maybe not Chapman personally but certainly the company he founded. Take a look at the front of their website where it promotes their Amex contracts.
http://www.adenstar-group.co.uk/

Again, in that light, how can Chapman criticise Dick Knight?

You seem to have a relentless and tiresome axe to grind. And be missing the point. Is it deliberate?

 

[rool]

I haven't had to use the ignore function for over six years, well done you.

 

[Black Rod]

You seem to have a relentless and tiresome axe to grind. And be missing the point. Is it deliberate?

Of course it is. The guy is an absolute basketcase.

 

[Stat Brother]

the way i read the first post is that the club did pay for the work.

eventually.

 

[El Presidente]

You're completely dodging the issue of double standards - of course the Albion benefited from Adenstar, but Adenstar and Chapman still got PAID for the work. Just as the Albion benefited for all the financial input from Dick Knight and shouldn't be criticised for wanting SOME of that back, especially by Chapman who did get something back.

Further, if you read Chapman's piece, you wouldn't know that Adenstar has continued to benefit from Albion construction work. Maybe not Chapman personally but certainly the company he founded. Take a look at the front of their website where it promotes their Amex contracts.
http://www.adenstar-group.co.uk/

Again, in that light, how can Chapman criticise Dick Knight?

Where does it say that Chapman was personally paid?

 

[Buzzer]

You seem to have a relentless and tiresome axe to grind. And be missing the point. Is it deliberate?

It's deliberate.

 

[Buzzer]

Yes I am arguing that - if Chapman wants to hold Dick Knight to a standard that argues you should ONLY CONTRIBUTE to the Albion and get NOTHING back.

If Chapman wants to get off his inconsistent high horse, then the payments that Adenstar got were perfectly reasonable.

And your assertion that DC is saying you should only contribute and not get back anything is incorrect, I believe. The debt was converted into equity by DK and DC. DK demanded for it effectively to be converted back into debt seeing as the market value of the shares was and remains worthless. The way I read it is that DC believed DK knew the return was likely to be zero when doing the original conversion into shares and remains the only shareholder to have demanded any of his money back.

If that's correct then, as I've said previously, I understand why DC feels as he does and has said as much but also I do understand DK's reasons also.

 

[London Irish]

You seem to have a relentless and tiresome axe to grind. And be missing the point. Is it deliberate?

Yes it's deliberate, don't like double-standards nonsense being thrown at Dick Knight. Suck up that point.

 

[London Irish]

Where does it say that Chapman was personally paid?

Are you really going to argue that if the company he owned and ran got paid by the Albion, that isn't a benefit to him?

 

[Buzzer]

Are you really going to argue that if the company he owned and ran got paid by the Albion, that isn't a benefit to him?

Not necessarily at all. Labour that he could have used elsewhere and charged at market rate was directed towards the Albion. It's called opportunity costs, a basic cost-accounting principle.

 

[El Presidente]

Are you really going to argue that if the company he owned and ran got paid by the Albion, that isn't a benefit to him?

That's not what you earlier said though, which was

Chapman still got PAID

He wasn't, Adenstar was, and there is a difference.

DK was paid too, £400,000 for his shares from TB. The Albion could have alternatively had a share issue and received all the money.

I love what DK has done for the Albion, and I feel the same towards TB (and DC), because they all had the opportunity in the past to walk away and have a much easier life, and be wealthier into the bargain too. The choices they made have benefited us all as fans, but that does mean that they are above scrutiny.

We are very, very fortunate that each of them ave done so much for the Albion over the years.

However, in this instance, neither Bloom nor Chapman lit the fire, it was Dick. I have no problem that he chose to do so, but equally Derek Chapman has in most people's (but not yours) a right of reply.

 

[London Irish]

Not necessarily at all. Labour that he could have used elsewhere and charged at market rate was directed towards the Albion. It's called opportunity costs, a basic cost-accounting principle.

Come on now. Adenstar's Albion work, which commendably benefited the club, also contributed to the turnover of Chapman's business that allowed it to retain its skilled workforce, which put it in a much better position to compete for other contracts. And no one is objecting to Adenstar benefiting in this way, people are allowed some benefit from their hard work in supporting the club over the years. As is Dick Knight. Anyone disagree?

 

[The Large One]

The Adenstar website refers to him as 'the former chairman' of the company, and doesn't list him as a director. I was led to believe that Derek Chapman stood down from Adenstar in order to concentrate on working full-time on the stadium project.

If that's the case, he wouldn't be paid, surely?

 

[rool]

Can we see if this works again (from 20/01/2007)

'Sitting here as, generally, a rare reader of NSC I wonder why so many people lose it with you. After these last 30 minutes or so I fully understand why.

It seems that many of those don't want you on NSC. I've just joined the club. And can make it happen.'

 

[London Irish]

That's not what you earlier said though, which was



He wasn't, Adenstar was, and there is a difference.

DK was paid too, £400,000 for his shares from TB. The Albion could have alternatively had a share issue and received all the money.

I love what DK has done for the Albion, and I feel the same towards TB (and DC), because they all had the opportunity in the past to walk away and have a much easier life, and be wealthier into the bargain too. The choices they made have benefited us all as fans, but that does mean that they are above scrutiny.

We are very, very fortunate that each of them ave done so much for the Albion over the years.

However, in this instance, neither Bloom nor Chapman lit the fire, it was Dick. I have no problem that he chose to do so, but equally Derek Chapman has in most people's (but not yours) a right of reply.

I'm not going to go down the utterly tedious road of dissecting the difference between someone's bank account getting paid and someone's company in which they are a major shareholder getting paid, you're much more interesting when talking about your porn habits than your forensic accounting ones. "The someone" benefits in both cases.

Who lit the fire? Dick Knight put out the biggest bloody fire in the history of the club in his time as chairman - and DOESN'T deserve criticism for selling his shares from someone who also got some financial benefit from his Albion connections.

 

[drew]

Chapman's company making money out of the Withdean contracts when we didn't have a financial pot to piss in is irrelevant then? You've boxed yourself into a bit of a corner, haven't you?

Think it has already been stated that the contracts were done at, or near, cost price. Adenstar have employees that have mortgages to pay, plus other shareholders who may not have an interest in the Albion.

The way I read the first post is that the club did pay for the work.

How did the club pay then? Ah yes, the directors put the funds in, one of which was DC who may well have been using money

You're completely dodging the issue of double standards - of course the Albion benefited from Adenstar, but Adenstar and Chapman still got PAID for the work. Just as the Albion benefited for all the financial input from Dick Knight and shouldn't be criticised for wanting SOME of that back, especially by Chapman who did get something back.

Further, if you read Chapman's piece, you wouldn't know that Adenstar has continued to benefit from Albion construction work. Maybe not Chapman personally but certainly the company he founded. Take a look at the front of their website where it promotes their Amex contracts.
http://www.adenstar-group.co.uk/

Again, in that light, how can Chapman criticise Dick Knight?

You need to be able to separate DC from the legal entity that is Adenstar.

Yes it's deliberate, don't like double-standards nonsense being thrown at Dick Knight. Suck up that point.

No one needs to suck up on that point. We are all waiting for reality to click for you!!!

 

[Buzzer]

Anyone disagree?

Yes. Without access to Adenstar's historical order books and tenders you are making an awful lot of assumptions with no foundation other than your clear grudge against DC. Apparently you are a financial journalist (is that right?) and therefore well aware of the concept of opportunity costs.

 

[Hungry Joe]

That's not what you earlier said though, which was



He wasn't, Adenstar was, and there is a difference.

DK was paid too, £400,000 for his shares from TB. The Albion could have alternatively had a share issue and received all the money.

I love what DK has done for the Albion, and I feel the same towards TB (and DC), because they all had the opportunity in the past to walk away and have a much easier life, and be wealthier into the bargain too. The choices they made have benefited us all as fans, but that does mean that they are above scrutiny.

We are very, very fortunate that each of them ave done so much for the Albion over the years.

However, in this instance, neither Bloom nor Chapman lit the fire, it was Dick. I have no problem that he chose to do so, but equally Derek Chapman has in most people's (but not yours) a right of reply.

That precisely sums up how I feel. I can't see how any sane Albion fan could argue with that summary.

 

[El Presidente]

Who lit the fire? Dick Knight put out the biggest bloody fire in the history of the club in his time as chairman - and DOESN'T deserve criticism for selling his shares from someone who also got some financial benefit from his Albion connections.

This is just wriggling. Do you think Martin Perry deserved the criticism that came his way in DK's book?