[News] We want our Marbles back, we want our Marbles back...

[WATFORD zero]

This was Elgin's justification, that he was forced to take the marbles to stop the Greeks from destroying their most iconic monument. You have to ask why the part of the frieze left behind by Elgin has remained largely intact, if they were hell bent on destroying it? Elgin's claims are highly dubious, and not helped by him using the marbles to decorate his own private stately home in Scotland. It was only after he got into severe money trouble that he offered them to the British Museum at a knockdown price.

Elgin's cultural vandalism caused outrage in Britain in the early 1800s, even before he’d managed to transport the treasures back to his property in Scotland
I wonder if it's yet another situation where if you think it's simple then you don't really understand the facts and history.

I wonder if it's yet another situation where if you think it's simple then you don't really understand the facts and history

Yes indeed. Think about your own words.

I did 'think about my own words', hence the part of my post you somehow managed to edit out before quoting it

I wonder if it's yet another situation where if you think it's simple then you don't really understand the facts and history

(And I certainly don't, just giving the other side as I heard it )

 

[Rodney Thomas]

To be fair most of the western museums would be emptied. Certainly the Berlin and Louvre have more Greek artefacts than we have.

this is a fundamental question about property rights


btw. Pausanias visiting Athens didnt even mention the frieze( the marbles) It was so insignificant

Anatolian philistine

 

[wellquickwoody]

As a Brit, I was embarrassed in the museum, seeing the big gaps in the frieze. Elgin took about half of it. What I’m embarrassed about is our continuing refusal to return them, not so much by Elgin's initial action, which may or may not have been legitimate. It’s not hard to feel embarrassed by what your countrymen do. It’s something most of us feel during international football tournaments, particularly in Europe. We have a long history of behaving badly overseas.

The Germans and Romans are right up there too.

 

[WATFORD zero]

The Germans and Romans are right up there too.

Well I hope if we ever draw the Romans in Europe, we ban them from the Amex. Look at what they did last time they were here .... Oh

 

[Nobby]

What’s embarrassing is the fact that the Tories see this as part of the culture war. Sunak has now snubbed the Greek PM who is in the country and was about to meet him.

The Greeks think we’ve gone mad.

We have gone mad.
We voted these bastds in
Well I did’t at least

 

[Giraffe]

No 10 saying that the Greeks promised not to mention the Marbles. But they did. Shocking. I am writing to my MP and screaming for a policeman all in one go.

 

[Flounce]

This sets up an episode of the Grand Tour in Greece nicely. Clarkson and co to film there using a car with the registration ELG 1 N

 

[Coldeanseagull]

This argument has been going on for bloody years....not just with the tories.
We as a nation of hoarders must stop holding on to all this old shit, I mean, when was the last time anybody played marbles?
Give all the plunder back to whoever wants it and lets sort out the worlds problems from this century

 

[clapham_gull]

Perhaps it would be better if the British Museum just displayed British stuff!

I'm not sure the mud and 1970s crisp packets hall will get many visitors.

 

[DavidinSouthampton]

And yet strangely Greece still has some of them unburned. I call that story as BS.

I’d not heard the “they were burning them” bit before either.

but even if Elgin did rescue them, I would agree they should go back to where they belong.

The same for the Benin bronzes. We were at the British Museum at one point earlier in the year and sought the Benin bronzes out - much more interesting and attractive (glorious) than the Elgin Marbles, certainly giving the lie to anybody who thought Africans were savages before we (and others) started exporting them to the Americas.

 

[Questions]

I’ve still got the kids marbles in the loft.
They can have them if it’ll stop the Greeks bleating on.

 

[Questions]

I’ve still got the kids marbles in the loft.
They can have them if it’ll stop the Greeks bleating on.

Marbles was big when I was a nipper. At primary school we had a kid who sat on a manhole cover and charged two small marbles to take it off him. It was annoying as he didn’t even play. I bet he became an entrepreneur or a loan shark.

 

[ConfusedGloryHunter]

Marbles was big when I was a nipper. At primary school we had a kid who sat on a manhole cover and charged two small marbles to take it off him. It was annoying as he didn’t even play. I bet he became an entrepreneur or a loan shark.

Huh?

 

[PeterT]

I wonder if the reason why the British Museum isn't keen on the idea is to do with the slew of claims, from similarly pillaged nations which is follow if a precedent is set.

Exactly that.

Then the Falklands, GIbraltar ….

In isolation of course the Elgin Marbles should be returned, but he doesn’t want to be the one kick starting a firestorm on everything else.

I found it interesting that when Napoleon was born in Corsica, it was part of Italy. I have never heard great claims on returning Corsica to Italy, the French seem to get away with such things in a way we do not! But I admit I don’t know the full story here.

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

Exactly that.

Then the Falklands, GIbraltar ….

In isolation of course the Elgin Marbles should be returned, but he doesn’t want to be the one kick starting a firestorm on everything else.

I found it interesting that when Napoleon was born in Corsica, it was part of Italy. I have never heard great claims on returning Corsica to Italy, the French seem to get away with such things in a way we do not! But I admit I don’t know the full story here.

Ha agree. We probably should be giving York back to the Danes and Norwegians sometime soon as well

 

[Eric the meek]

I remember I was on a cruise in 1971, and the then Greek actress Melina Mercouri was giving a talk about Athens. Even as a 12 year old, I remember her extraordinary passion about the Elgin marbles being returned to their home.

She later became Minister for Culture and died in 1994, never achieving their return to Athens.

 

[ConfusedGloryHunter]

Exactly that.

Then the Falklands, GIbraltar ….

In isolation of course the Elgin Marbles should be returned, but he doesn’t want to be the one kick starting a firestorm on everything else.

I found it interesting that when Napoleon was born in Corsica, it was part of Italy. I have never heard great claims on returning Corsica to Italy, the French seem to get away with such things in a way we do not! But I admit I don’t know the full story here.

Italy did not exist as a political entity back then and Corsica is a territory rather than shit that was nicked way back when. For proper French bashing maybe talk about all the loot they took from Italy under Napoleon and in the centuries before then.

 

[Lyndhurst 14]

Just the Tories trying to stir up nationalistic nonsense to try to keep themselves in a job. Boring

Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel

 

[marcos3263]

simple solution:
We make plaster casts of the bits we have and send them the originals with a fanfare and hoo-hah. They make plaster casts of the bits they have and send them to us. We both then have wonderful exhibits, a great story, redemption and this chapter is closed.
Would I care if the bit in London is fake? I seem to remember the dinosaur skeleton in the Natural history museum was fake - plaster cast - but everyone loved Dippy.

 

[sparkie]

I'd just give them back tbh.