[Politics] The General Election Thread

[Guinness Boy]

Equally accept the right of mps such as Chris Williamson to stay in the party too and not be hounded out for alleged support for anti-semitism.

Ben the Green defends racist who compares the Jews to Nazis.

https://www.thejc.com/comment/comme...now-the-truth-about-chris-williamson-1.493936

I'm working early tomorrow so there's probably 24 hours till I cast my vote. You and JRG are enough to turn anyone Tory.

 

[midnight_rendezvous]

That is a type of Corbyn incentive, as he does like to groom them early, I would NEVER vote for Corbyn.

Labour maybe, if they had a likeable cabinet and knew how to handle our cash.

Jesus wept, the Tories have literally increased the national debt from £850billion to £2.25trillion, put millions into poverty and given tax cuts worth billions to the wealthy and you think Labour can’t handle cash? My exasperation levels aren’t through the roof!

 

[Bulldog]

My biggest fear is that Labour will be out of power for 5 years and, during that time, the hard left will convince themselves that the loss was because they weren't Socialist, weren't left enough, and push ever more crazy policies through thus handing the 2024/5 election to the Tories again.
If we have to accept the dystopian prospect of 5 years of the Tories kicking the f*** out of the poor the young and the sick, at least use it to make the Labour party electable again with a moderate leader and front bench that most of middle Britain can vote for.

(This post will auto delete if Labour win)

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

Which of Labour’s policies do you actually disagree with?

https://anotherangryvoice.blogspot.com/2019/10/so-how-many-of-jeremy-corbyns-policies.html?m=1

Min wage/tutor fees/renationalisation

But - I guess you should ask the rest of the nation as well as they are rejections it as well.

 

[Is it PotG?]

Mcdonald getting battered by Neil

BBC2

 

[Guinness Boy]

Mcdonald getting battered by Neil

BBC2

Edit - never mind

 

[midnight_rendezvous]

Min wage/tutor fees/renationalisation

But - I guess you should ask the rest of the nation as well as they are rejections it as well.

Why do you oppose a living wage? The UK is the only country in the developed world where workers' wages are declining in real terms, while the economy is actually growing. A £10 minimum wage would help to reverse this scenario, and it would also significantly reduce the cost of in-work benefits like tax credits and housing benefit (most of which goes to working families these days).

As for renationalisation;

Renationalise the railways
This is a very popular policy that is supported by an overwhelming majority of the public. So in reality, by opposing this, you are one of the minority who think that the current rip-off profiteer-administered shambles is acceptable?

Renationalise the NHS
The Tory party have been carving up the English NHS and distributing the pieces to the private sector, Jeremy Corbyn has pledged to reverse this process. 84% of the public thinks the NHS should be run as a not-for-profit public service, by being against this, you are one of the 7% who agree with the ongoing Tory privatisation agenda.

 

[beorhthelm]

Again - if you haven't noticed - I have very little time for Momentum - which, in fact is full of trendy liberals

you're sooo far left even the soft sops in Momentum are trendy liberals.

 

[mikeyjh]

2010-2019, in case you missed it...

1,000 sure start centres closed.
780 libraries closed.
700 football pitches closed.
Food bank use up 2,400%.
Homelessness up 1,000%.
Rough sleeping up 1,200%
Bedroom tax caused mass evictions.
Evictions are running at record highs.
35% of U.K. kids live in poverty.
Student fees up 300%.
Student debt has risen 150%.
Eradication of EMA (education maintenance allowance).
National debt has risen from £850billion to £2.25trillion.
Emergency Brexit stimulus from BoE in June 2016 of £175b.
Brexit related fall in national revenue £500b.
GDP fallen to -0.1%.
GBP fallen by circa 15% versus EUR and USD.
Manufacturing in recession.
Construction in recession.
Services close to recession.
25-30% cuts to all govt departments.
25-30% cuts to all councils, mainly centred on Labour councils.
Half of councils facing effective bankruptcy.
185k extra deaths attached to the political ideology of austerity.
25,000 less police.
20,000 less prison officers.
10,000 less border officials.
10,000 less firefighters.
10,000 less medical professionals.
25,000 less bed spaces for mental illness.
OECD calculate 3 million hidden unemployed, rate is really 13%.
Creation of 1.3m jobs, mainly temporary, self employed, gig economy and ZHC.
Only 30k full time work positions created.
Close on 50% of workers are self employed, ZHC, or part time precariat.
80% of the 5.3 million self employed live below the poverty line.
35% of self employed only earn £100 a month.
25% cuts for our disabled community.
80% cuts to Mobility allowance.
Closing Remploy.
40% of working households have practically no savings.
70% of households have less than 10k savings.
60% of households can only survive 2 months without a wage.
Household debt reaches new peak, despite emergency base rates.
Increase of 50% in hate crimes.
Increase of knife crime by 150% to 22,000 per year.
Increase in teenage suicide by 70%.
Suicide up 12% in the year 2018.
Self harm among young women up 70%.
Life expectancy down 3 years.
NHS satisfaction level at lowest recorded rate.
Council home building down 90%.
200k social homes lost since 2010.
Zero starter homes built, despite Tory flagship programme.
Council home building down 90%.
200k social homes lost since 2010.
One million families on council home waiting list.
100,000 increase on the council home waiting list since 2010.
36,000 teachers have left teaching.

But according to some on here, it’ll be Labour that’ll bring the country to its knees

You'll find many people that claim to be sympathetic but they won't vote labour because of Kinnock/Smith/Milliband/Corbyn and so on. They don't actually care but really want to be seen to care. They'll still view Tory tomorrow, to make sure they're better off by a few quid....

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

Why do you oppose a living wage? The UK is the only country in the developed world where workers' wages are declining in real terms, while the economy is actually growing. A £10 minimum wage would help to reverse this scenario, and it would also significantly reduce the cost of in-work benefits like tax credits and housing benefit (most of which goes to working families these days).

As for renationalisation;

Renationalise the railways
This is a very popular policy that is supported by an overwhelming majority of the public. So in reality, by opposing this, you are one of the minority who think that the current rip-off profiteer-administered shambles is acceptable?

Renationalise the NHS
The Tory party have been carving up the English NHS and distributing the pieces to the private sector, Jeremy Corbyn has pledged to reverse this process. 84% of the public thinks the NHS should be run as a not-for-profit public service, by being against this, you are one of the 7% who agree with the ongoing Tory privatisation agenda.

How can you justify £10 min wage for small businesses that are currently just about breaking even?

You say I’m in the minority, if people believe this is the way to go/believe Jezza is the man to do it why are they trailing so badly in the polls against the worst government in a long while for the second election in a row.

Once again labour are miles off the mark and will continue to lose till they realise this.

 

[Hastings gull]

Why do you oppose a living wage? The UK is the only country in the developed world where workers' wages are declining in real terms, while the economy is actually growing. A £10 minimum wage would help to reverse this scenario, and it would also significantly reduce the cost of in-work benefits like tax credits and housing benefit (most of which goes to working families these days).

As for renationalisation;

Renationalise the railways
This is a very popular policy that is supported by an overwhelming majority of the public. So in reality, by opposing this, you are one of the minority who think that the current rip-off profiteer-administered shambles is acceptable?

Renationalise the NHS
The Tory party have been carving up the English NHS and distributing the pieces to the private sector, Jeremy Corbyn has pledged to reverse this process. 84% of the public thinks the NHS should be run as a not-for-profit public service, by being against this, you are one of the 7% who agree with the ongoing Tory privatisation agenda.

The first two highlighted points seem to me to be wishful thinking on your part -I imagine there is no real evidence for your assertions? As I understand it, some of the privatisation involves things like cleaning contracts, so how would that affect a not-for-profit public service? Have you ever thought that it would be better if we have a system that works best for patients, whatever that might be, instead of getting hooked up on ideology and deciding that one way must be the best irrespective. Having had extensive experience of the german system, I can assure you that the NHS isn't always that good. To improve it will take an awful lot of cash, and I doubt whether you and similar virtue-signallers would in reality want to pay for it.

 

[darkwolf666]

You'll find many people that claim to be sympathetic but they won't vote labour because of Kinnock/Smith/Milliband/Corbyn and so on. They don't actually care but really want to be seen to care. They'll still view Tory tomorrow, to make sure they're better off by a few quid....

I think you will find a lot of people don’t vote Labour, because they aren’t affected by the things that affect the poor and desperate in our midst. They tut tut and make the right noises when it comes to the terrible stories we have all heard, but just can’t drag that conscious into the ballot box for the fear it may make them a few quid poorer in the short term!

Shame on you, if that is you...!

 

[CheeseRolls]

How can you justify £10 min wage for small businesses that are currently just about breaking even?

You say I’m in the minority, if people believe this is the way to go/believe Jezza is the man to do it why are they trailing so badly in the polls against the worst government in a long while for the second election in a row.

Once again labour are miles off the mark and will continue to lose till they realise this.

A business that is just about breaking even, paying the staff minimum wage, doesn't really sound like a viable concern. There is no room for error and one setback will wipe the business out.

 

[darkwolf666]

The first two highlighted points seem to me to be wishful thinking on your part -I imagine there is no real evidence for your assertions? As I understand it, some of the privatisation involves things like cleaning contracts, so how would that affect a not-for-profit public service? Have you ever thought that it would be better if we have a system that works best for patients, whatever that might be, instead of getting hooked up on ideology and deciding that one way must be the best irrespective. Having had extensive experience of the german system, I can assure you that the NHS isn't always that good. To improve it will take an awful lot of cash, and I doubt whether you and similar virtue-signallers would in reality want to pay for it.

And there’s the rub, everyone knows things need to change, but don’t want to put their hands in their pockets.

Welcome to five years of hell if you are disabled, disadvantaged, have mental health issues, are young, or for no fault of your own, hit hard times. Welcome to broken Britain... and on top of that the lie will be exposed and Boris won’t deliver Brexit, but will get 5 years in power - well done you mugs!

 

[midnight_rendezvous]

The first two highlighted points seem to me to be wishful thinking on your part -I imagine there is no real evidence for your assertions? As I understand it, some of the privatisation involves things like cleaning contracts, so how would that affect a not-for-profit public service? Have you ever thought that it would be better if we have a system that works best for patients, whatever that might be, instead of getting hooked up on ideology and deciding that one way must be the best irrespective. Having had extensive experience of the german system, I can assure you that the NHS isn't always that good. To improve it will take an awful lot of cash, and I doubt whether you and similar virtue-signallers would in reality want to pay for it.

Not wishful thinking in the slightest.

Point number 1: https://anotherangryvoice.blogspot.com/2017/03/british-workers-are-suffering-worst.html?m=1

Point numero 2; https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/articles-reports/2017/05/19/nationalisation-vs-privatisation-public-view

Ah yes, because I oppose people being impoverished, services being cut the bone and the top earners getting massive tax breaks worth billions whilst the most vulnerable in society suffer, I’m “Virtue signalling”. Shame on me, eh?

 

[Driver8]

And there’s the rub, everyone knows things need to change, but don’t want to put their hands in their pockets.

Welcome to five years of hell if you are disabled, disadvantaged, have mental health issues, are young, or for no fault of your own, hit hard times. Welcome to broken Britain... and on top of that the lie will be exposed and Boris won’t deliver Brexit, but will get 5 years in power - well done you mugs!

You are right, it does need to change. A more centre left Labour Party would have walked this election. Unfortunately Momentum have taken over and made Labour unelectable.

 

[Weststander]

Jesus wept, the Tories have literally increased the national debt from £850billion to £2.25trillion, put millions into poverty and given tax cuts worth billions to the wealthy and you think Labour can’t handle cash? My exasperation levels aren’t through the roof!

What tax cuts have happened since 2010?

Taxes have risen, a whole load of reliefs disappeared.

 

[midnight_rendezvous]

What tax cuts have happened since 2010?

Taxes have risen, a whole load of reliefs disappeared.

How do you think the wealthy have increased their wealth by £253n over the last five years? Why, thanks to Conservative-led changes to corporation tax, inheritance tax, capital gains tax and the bank levy that’s how!

https://welfareweekly.com/tory-tax-cuts-for-the-rich-have-deprived-the-uk-public-of-almost-14bn/

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/tories-handing-100bn-tax-breaks-20910588.amp

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/politics/2019/jun/25/boris-johnsons-tax-cut-would-benefit-richest-10-most-say-experts

https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2017/11/how-tax-cuts-rich-have-cost-country-dear

 

[Is it PotG?]

Wow, looks like the Greens copped it off of Neil too tonight, as did Brexit bods.

Not as funny as Mcdonald though.

 

[Jolly Red Giant]

What tax cuts have happened since 2010?

Corporation tax - from 28% in 2010 to 19% now - and due to be 17% next year (Labour is proposing to raise it to 26% within 5 years - still below the rate in 2010).

Basic rate of capital gains tax cut in 2015 from 18% to 10% - and the higher rate from 28% to 20% (and before you get your nickers in a twist - the Tories increase the higher rate to 28% in 2010)

Top rate of income tax - cut from 50% to 45% - the net gain for those earning more than £1million per year is an average of £554,000 each (almost 10 years salary for those earning the average industrial wage in Britain)

The Tories cut £70billion in public spending since 2010 - now they are proposing further tax cuts for the rich of £100billion over the next five years.

There is one other cut the Tories have implemented - a working class woman now dies (on average) 7 years earlier than a women who is wealthy (i.e. a millionaire).