[Politics] The General Election Thread

[nicko31]

Seems the Tories have hired the same digital media guys that put Climate Change denier Scott Morrison into power in Australia. Can't say I'm surprised....

https://www.channel4.com/news/tory-...-helped-unexpected-australia-election-victory

 

[Deleted member 2719]

I am looking forward to my extra £500 a month/6k a year.

Corbyn magic money forest to the rescue.

Or is it just more FAKE news.

 

[Is it PotG?]

We then, by your own admission, it is not ****ing free. So why do you continue to pedal the right wing lie?

Peddle. On yer bike.

 

[beorhthelm]

We then, by your own admission, it is not ****ing free. So why do you continue to pedal the right wing lie?

its toospy turvey day. they are there in the Labour manifesto, free broadband, free tution etc. is that right wing lies?

 

[Bold Seagull]

its toospy turvey day. they are there in the Labour manifesto, free broadband, free tution etc. is that right wing lies?

Free healthcare, free education for kids...

 

[Bozza]

No, the right video. The Tories say 50,000 more nurses, when 19,000 of them are retained so therefore not new.
My maths says it should be 31,000 more nurses.

You posted a video seemingly to prove that "50,000 new nurses" was said. In that video, that is not said.

Instead the phrase "50,000 more nurses" is used, repeatedly, by both interviewees and Nicky Morgan.

Look I really don't give a toss on this. The Tories are clearly playing games with words to try and present a more impressive number to the electorate. But they didn't say "50,000 new nurses" which is what you were strongly implying by posting that video in direct response to:

"But they have not said that there will be 50k new nurses, have they?"

 

[Bold Seagull]

I am looking forward to my extra £500 a month/6k a year.

Corbyn magic money forest to the rescue.

Or is it just more FAKE news.

Why not read up on it somewhere other than MailOnline?

 

[Bold Seagull]

You posted a video seemingly to prove that "50,000 new nurses" was said. In that video, that is not said.

Instead the phrase "50,000 more nurses" is used, repeatedly, by both interviewees and Nicky Morgan.

Look I really don't give a toss on this. The Tories are clearly playing games with words to try and present a more impressive number to the electorate. But they didn't say "50,000 new nurses" which is what you were strongly implying by posting that video in direct response to:

"But they have not said that there will be 50k new nurses, have they?"

Still not 50,000 more nurses though is it.

 

[WATFORD zero]

You posted a video seemingly to prove that "50,000 new nurses" was said. In that video, that is not said.

Instead the phrase "50,000 more nurses" is used, repeatedly, by both interviewees and Nicky Morgan.

Look I really don't give a toss on this. The Tories are clearly playing games with words to try and present a more impressive number to the electorate. But they didn't say "50,000 new nurses" which is what you were strongly implying by posting that video in direct response to:

"But they have not said that there will be 50k new nurses, have they?"

The lady doth protest too much, methinks

 

[nicko31]

Just watched Jo Swinson being interviewed by Andrew Neal, and although no fan (understatement of the year) thought she came across well. Best performance I have seen from her.

How much of a lazy, unprepared, lying, piss poor performer do you have to be to run away from that

Just watched it, I can see why Boris is bottling it as she was put through the ringer

Easily best performance from Swinson very clear objectives, moderate Tories fed up with their narrow nationalist cult take note

 

[Bozza]

Still not 50,000 more nurses though is it.

I'm making up the total number of nurses and dates here as I don't know the real ones, and I'm politicked out so can't be bothered to look it up. My interpretation is they are saying this...

1. Today there are 200,000 nurses.
2. As things stand, by 2025, 19,000 nurses will have left, leaving the NHS with 181,000 nurses remaining.
3. We will retain those 19,000 nurses and recruit an extra 31,000 nurses.
4. Thus, by 2025, there will be 50,000 more nurses in the NHS than there would otherwise have been.

As I said - it's clearly playing word games, hoping to fool most of those who don't dig into the detail, or are happy to take what is presented to them at face value.

The current version of the Tory party are dreadful, and it doesn't need erudite folk like [MENTION=14365]Thunder Bolt[/MENTION] making stuff up to illustrate that.

 

[Bold Seagull]

I'm making up the total number of nurses and dates here as I don't know the real ones, and I'm politicked out so can't be bothered to look it up. My interpretation is they are saying this...

1. Today there are 200,000 nurses.
2. As things stand, by 2025, 19,000 nurses will have left, leaving the NHS with 181,000 nurses remaining.
3. We will retain those 19,000 nurses and recruit an extra 31,000 nurses.
4. Thus, by 2025, there will be 50,000 more nurses in the NHS than there would otherwise have been.

As I said - it's clearly playing word games, hoping to fool most of those who don't dig into the detail, or are happy to take what is presented to them at face value.

The current version of the Tory party are dreadful, and it doesn't need erudite folk like [MENTION=14365]Thunder Bolt[/MENTION] making stuff up to illustrate that.

I understand the sums.

 

[Jolly Red Giant]

I'm making up the total number of nurses and dates here as I don't know the real ones, and I'm politicked out so can't be bothered to look it up. My interpretation is they are saying this...

1. Today there are 200,000 nurses.
2. As things stand, by 2025, 19,000 nurses will have left, leaving the NHS with 181,000 nurses remaining.
3. We will retain those 19,000 nurses and recruit an extra 31,000 nurses.
4. Thus, by 2025, there will be 50,000 more nurses in the NHS than there would otherwise have been.

As I said - it's clearly playing word games, hoping to fool most of those who don't dig into the detail, or are happy to take what is presented to them at face value.

The current version of the Tory party are dreadful, and it doesn't need erudite folk like [MENTION=14365]Thunder Bolt[/MENTION] making stuff up to illustrate that.

Except that it came out today that the 50,000 with 19,000 retained - is actually worse - they plan on only recruiting 1,040 per year and 5,000 nursing apprentices over 10 years - and - a quarter of the recruits are planned to be nursing assistants

 

[Bozza]

Except that it came out today that the 50,000 with 19,000 retained - is actually worse - they plan on only recruiting 1,040 per year and 5,000 nursing apprentices over 10 years - and - a quarter of the recruits are planned to be nursing assistants

It's actually worse because c12,000 of the 19,000 retentions have already been factored into plans and costed:

"The NHS’s Long Term Plan, released in January this year, already contains a commitment to improve “staff retention by at least 2 per cent by 2025, the equivalent of 12,400 additional nurses”.

So a campaign to improve nursing numbers through better retention has already been announced and funded. A drive to get 12,400 additional nurses over the next parliament was happening already, before the Conservative manifesto.

A Conservative source told FactCheck that the figure of 50,000 more nurses includes those already targeted in the Long Term Plan.

Clearly, the Conservatives have gone further in their manifesto promise – eyeing an extra 18,500 nurses through the retention route, rather than the 12,400 previously envisaged.

But about a quarter of the 50,000 extra nurses the Conservatives say they want to retain or recruit were already predicted to stay in the NHS anyway under a previous announcement."​

https://www.channel4.com/news/factcheck/factcheck-new-twist-in-conservatives-50000-nurses-promise

 

[Bold Seagull]

It's actually worse because c12,000 of the 19,000 retentions have already been factored into plans and costed:

"The NHS’s Long Term Plan, released in January this year, already contains a commitment to improve “staff retention by at least 2 per cent by 2025, the equivalent of 12,400 additional nurses”.

So a campaign to improve nursing numbers through better retention has already been announced and funded. A drive to get 12,400 additional nurses over the next parliament was happening already, before the Conservative manifesto.

A Conservative source told FactCheck that the figure of 50,000 more nurses includes those already targeted in the Long Term Plan.

Clearly, the Conservatives have gone further in their manifesto promise – eyeing an extra 18,500 nurses through the retention route, rather than the 12,400 previously envisaged.

But about a quarter of the 50,000 extra nurses the Conservatives say they want to retain or recruit were already predicted to stay in the NHS anyway under a previous announcement."​

https://www.channel4.com/news/factcheck/factcheck-new-twist-in-conservatives-50000-nurses-promise

It’s pretty much how Enron did their accounting.

 

[beorhthelm]

if you go digging in to it, most the Conservative manifesto has been previously announced and planned.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Just watched it, I can see why Boris is bottling it as she was put through the ringer

Easily best performance from Swinson very clear objectives, moderate Tories fed up with their narrow nationalist cult take note

Don't forget Johnson has worked for Andrew Neil as a journalist. He sacked him for lying.

 

[Is it PotG?]

Don't forget Johnson has worked for Andrew Neil as a journalist. He sacked him for lying.

But Neil survived the sacking, hasn't done too bad.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

But Neil survived the sacking, hasn't done too bad.

Mouldy Boots does it so much better.

 

[Is it PotG?]

Mouldy Boots does it so much better.

I bow to your superior knowledge.