[Politics] The General Election Thread

[Papa Lazarou]

Page 6:

"The National Transformation Fund is Labour’s programme of capital expenditure to tackle the climate emergency and urgent need for investment in repairing the physical infrastructure of the UK. It comprises £250bn over ten years for our Green Transformation Fund and £150bn over five years for our Social Transformation Fund. Taking companies into public ownership is fiscally neutral by international accounting standards when bonds are exchanged for shares (as in previous nationalisations): for British Broadband, which will be provided free, the ongoing costs are included from ‘Grey Book’ expenditure."

Page 26:

"In 2018 the FCO spent £421m of Overseas Development Assistance through the Conflict, Stability and Security Fund (Table 4 of DfID’s ‘Statistics of International Development: Final UK Aid Spend 2018’). We will resource the FCO with more than an extra £400million to rebuild its capacity and expertise on human rights, climate diplomacy and conflict prevention. This additional funding will pay for the department’s negotiating and analytical expertise on mediation and peace processes as well as funding for new human rights advisors and climate change experts. The additional money will go into the new human rights based peace fund, which will replace the CSSF."

I assume they will publish a little more details at some stage, or is this 'National Transformation Fund' already a defined thing, with objectives and targets?

 

[beorhthelm]

I don’t usually indulge in ‘whataboutery’ but, tell me, how much larger is the National debt after 9 years of Tory austerity?
They are really not the party of fiscal responsibility any longer.

agree they have also tossed out fiscal responsibility, promising far too much uncosted borrowing. more fiscally cautious are the Liberal's with "only" £100bn promised

 

[KZNSeagull]

This document relates specifically to raising money.

As a one off or every year? It needs to be costed for every year.

 

[Papa Lazarou]

Found it https://labour.org.uk/manifesto/a-green-industrial-revolution/

 

[JC Footy Genius]

Both

No surprises there then. But at least you're focusing your efforts in the right place as there are hardly any left wingers peddling Corbynista nonsense on here and the amount of swing voters on a forum must run into the thousands

 

[Weststander]

I’m really gonna miss UKIP when they inevitably implode completely.
They are far funnier than any comedies on the telly. Nearest every announcement about them/ by them is comedy gold.

Hopefully the Brexit Party with them.

Farage is an incredibly arrogant prick. Every time he speaks, you can tell he believes he has the air of a great British statesman. The turning point was referendum night. At 10pm on a high with the exit polls, at 11.30 crestfallen, then at 1am as smug/conceited as could be .... and he hasn’t stopped since. Soon after spending time with racist and criminal Trump.

The 52% wasn’t even his doing. He/UKIP accounted for part of it, but the main Leave campaign of Labour and Tory MP’s and grandees, unions was the key.

Yet he’s dreamt up an image that he’s THE MAN:

 

[beorhthelm]

I don't see anything in there regarding Climate Change / renewables etc. Is there a separate document, as this is just the costings?

thats all in the "borrowings" that dont apparently need to be accounted for.

 

[WATFORD zero]

No surprises there then. But at least you're focusing your efforts in the right place as there are hardly any left wingers peddling Corbynista nonsense on here and the amount of swing voters on a forum must run into the thousands

Well obviously he won't convince a principled Conservative and Unionist party supporter like yourself, would he ?

It's not as if you would sell off your principles and accept a border down the middle of the Irish sea in a desperate attempt to justify Brexit ....................Oh

 

[theonlymikey]

No surprises there then. But at least you're focusing your efforts in the right place as there are hardly any left wingers peddling Corbynista nonsense on here and the amount of swing voters on a forum must run into the thousands

Someone who wants a certain outcome, can either try and get the message out there, or they don't.

 

[A1X]

I remember being down Worthing Pier about a month before the referendum and being approached by an old lady handing out pamphlets for Farage's Business at the time. She said that " Leaving Europe will guarantee our fish stocks for our fishermen " then pointed at the two pair trawlers working about a mile off Lancing " They are stealing our Cod Stocks right from under our noses ! " ….. I gently pointed out that a, there were no Cod off Lancing in May, and b, those two trawlers are Scottish registered vessels ! She looked blankly at me then mumbled something to herself and scuttled off sharpish. The ignorance and stupidity of some people is quite astonishing .

It's not the ignorance that grates I find, anyone can be ignorant about anything, but it's (a) the confidence which they speak with despite their ignorance and (b) their refusal when their ignorance is pointed out to do something about it which I find incredible.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

On a serious note, it will be interesting to see if this manifesto, with even more promises/bribes than the last one has the same supposed positive electoral effect as the 2017 manifesto (still lost though). Labour/Corbyn betting everything on the public believing we can have everything we ever wanted paid for by borrowing and taxing the very wealthy.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

Those pesky Tories at it again, they really are raising (?) their online game this election ...

https://www.labourmanifesto.co.uk/

 

[Ernest]

Those pesky Tories at it again, they really are raising (?) their online game this election ...

https://www.labourmanifesto.co.uk/

Shows how scared they are , pitiful stuff to attract the morons of this country

 

[Weststander]

On a serious note, it will be interesting to see if this manifesto, with even more promises/bribes than the last one has the same supposed positive electoral effect as the 2017 manifesto (still lost though). Labour/Corbyn betting everything on the public believing we can have everything we ever wanted paid for by borrowing and taxing the very wealthy.

Truth in that last bit - Sweden, Denmark and Finland get there (but some people are still unhappy), by the modest and average paid suffering c.45% in taxes from their modest pay. No UK party has the guts to suggest anything like that. Even the LibDems are saying just a 1% income tax rise. Not sure about the Greens.

Definitely positives about those societies.

But the peoples of the rest of Europe and also North America simply won’t stomach such a taxation system.

 

[KZNSeagull]

IFS Spokesman on Politics Live: Raising 40bn from companies will make the UK one of the most punitive business tax regimes in the world.

 

[Grombleton]

Those pesky Tories at it again, they really are raising (?) their online game this election ...

https://www.labourmanifesto.co.uk/

As someone who works in digital marketing, I'm strongly wondering if the Tories are trying to commit political suicide or not.

 

[beorhthelm]

if i read it correctly, the personal capital gains tax allowance goes. shame for anyone ever had the good fortune to invest and save.

 

[A1X]

Those pesky Tories at it again, they really are raising (?) their online game this election ...

https://www.labourmanifesto.co.uk/

It's quite something when "the natural party of Government" has to basically lower itself to a fake news factory to stay relevant.

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

The Labour manifesto could have a couple of nasty financial hits in it for me. Bit of a gamble that these could be reversed by a resurgent 1 nation Tory Party in 2024.

Still worth it though to get Mendacious Johnson and his rabble of dirty tricksters out of Downing Street.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

Truth in that last bit - Sweden, Denmark and Finland get there (but some people are still unhappy), by the modest and average paid suffering c.45% in taxes from their modest pay. No UK party has the guts to suggest anything like that. Even the LibDems are saying just a 1% income tax rise. Not sure about the Greens.

Definitely positives about those societies.

But the peoples of the rest of Europe and also North America simply won’t stomach such a taxation system.

Yep, people often say they would be happy to pay more tax for better services but when it comes to the crunch most don't vote for higher taxes which is why Labour are pretending their vast spending pledges can be financed through borrowing and only taxing big business/the wealthy. As most people fully understand nothing is really for free and you don't get something for nothing I think Labour might be in danger of over-promising.

I also note the Tories are leaving their manifesto launch quite late in the campaign (next week?) which gives them time to see if the Labour manifesto has a significant impact on the polls. Expect them to add a few late/increased tax cut bribes if the polls are closing.