[Politics] The 2024 US Election - *MATCH DAY*

[Shaktarman]

Mate that just sounds like some drivel you’ve read on Twitter from either a Russian bot or a spotty incel. Can you provide any examples of the ‘mental woke nonsense’ that they (whoever ‘they’ are) are pushing and how they are pushing it?

We only ever seem to hear these petrifying tales of ‘the left’ ‘pushing a woke agenda’, but rarely does anyone explain what that actually means.

You like the ‘Republican ideas’. Do you believe we should be drilling for oil in the attic to reduce gasoline costs?

Point 1 - hundreds of examples online - just watch Matt Walsh documentary ‘what is a women’. Or watch Candice Owen or Riley Gaines bits. It’s very obvious what it is.

Point 2 - No I don’t agree with that, but do feel the ‘climate crisis’ is very much hyped up by a lot of activists who know very little. Just look at ‘insulate Britain’ and watch some of their interviews. I think there’s a happy medium in there somewhere but don’t like Trumps policies on energy.

I also didn’t say what you quoted ‘like the republican ideas’. I said I prefer some of them. That’s a classic tactic of the woke and arrogant left I’m afraid - to mis quote. I also don’t read Twitter for facts. I just hold a different opinion to you on a number of things and also many on this board. It doesn’t give you the right to sneer / belittle my opinions or assume I don’t understand things - another left tactic for anyone who holds a different opinion to them.

 

[FatSuperman]

They already have a massive prison estate, with compulsory, low paid labour...

Did you see that California had a ballot on removing slavery in prisons? Literally there was no organised campaign to keep it, and American's STILL VOTED TO KEEP IT.

They are utterly insane

 

[A1X]

It’s an adult human female - most people learn this at 2/3 years old

 

[Shaktarman]

Ah the patronising left if anyone disagrees with their opinion or dismantles it with facts. I understood it perfectly thanks.

So what’s your definition of a women then?

 

[FatSuperman]

Point 1 - hundreds of examples online - just watch Matt Walsh documentary ‘what is a women’. Or watch Candice Owen or Riley Gaines bits. It’s very obvious what it is.

Point 2 - No I don’t agree with that, but do feel the ‘climate crisis’ is very much hyped up by a lot of activists who know very little. Just look at ‘insulate Britain’ and watch some of their interviews. I think there’s a happy medium in there somewhere but don’t like Trumps policies on energy.

Shak, your reply is classic conspiracy theorist nonsense.

You said that there is some sort of 'woke agenda' being pushed. I'd love to know who is pushing it, how they are organised and why they are doing it. You've just effectively said 'research it online' and cited three individual people and then said "it's very obvious". It's not obvious mate, you just sound slightly deluded. You probably aren't far off thinking tiny microchips were inserted into us with the covid vaccine.

I am utterly unsurprised that you, a total layman, believes the climate crisis is hyped up. Is it really? Not doing a very good job of hyping it given barely anyone in power gives a nanoshit about it. The climate issue is what is known as a 'wicked problem' - these are really quite hard to understand, to define, to identify the causes and come up with solutions. But when literal experts are largely all saying the same thing, with nothing particular to gain - in fact they have a lot to lose given the response of most people in power - then why the hell wouldn't you at least listen in good faith? No, no, instead you read some tripe on Twitter, then read a post on some right-wing conspiracy nut website and call it evidence.

 

[FatSuperman]

Ah the patronising left if anyone disagrees with their opinion or dismantles it with facts. I understood it perfectly thanks.

So what’s your definition of a women then?

Why is the definition of a women remotely important?

 

[nicko31]

Really? What makes you think that?
All the Americans I saw on TV clearly value it highly. Turnout approx 65%, i.e. higher than our election in July.

If you vote for Trump the preservation of democracy isn’t a priority, this is the guy who only accepts elections when the result goes his way. It’s a vote for an autocrat, not a democratic.

 

[nicko31]

Point 1 - hundreds of examples online - just watch Matt Walsh documentary ‘what is a women’. Or watch Candice Owen or Riley Gaines bits. It’s very obvious what it is.

Point 2 - No I don’t agree with that, but do feel the ‘climate crisis’ is very much hyped up by a lot of activists who know very little. Just look at ‘insulate Britain’ and watch some of their interviews. I think there’s a happy medium in there somewhere but don’t like Trumps policies on energy.

I also didn’t say what you quoted ‘like the republican ideas’. I said I prefer some of them. That’s a classic tactic of the woke and arrogant left I’m afraid - to mis quote. I also don’t read Twitter for facts. I just hold a different opinion to you on a number of things and also many on this board. It doesn’t give you the right to sneer / belittle my opinions or assume I don’t understand things - another left tactic for anyone who holds a different opinion to them.

Hyped up, yeah…

2024 'virtually certain' to be world's warmest year on record - BBC News

It is also set to be the world's first breach of 1.5C of warming across an entire calendar year.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[jcdenton08]

Just while we’re on the subject of “agendas”, they absolutely, totally 100% exist. The problem is, people don’t understand the mechanics or scale and think it’s the same as a conspiracy at state level.

Within most communities of a subject, group or fandom, there are those who wish to put forward their own issues which are important to them - or agendas - and use the subject/group/fandom to advance visibility and improve perception of their cause.

One such specific example would be transgender activists, who actively targeted using video games to promote transgender awareness. A group of transgender activist writers specifically set up companies to consult with video game developers on how to integrate pro-transgender philosophies (or “agendas”) into games.

Consulting and Training – GaymerX: Everyone Games

gaymerx.org

Her Game Too PRIDE | Her Game Too

www.hergametoo.co.uk

And dozens more.

Due to negative backlash from consumers, many of whom found the messaging heavy handed and inappropriate for the settings the games take place in, these groups involvement is usually not advertised (or even outright hushed up), making it technically a conspiracy to promote a cause.

One such very recent example of this is the new game, Dragon Age: The Veilguard. In this game, there are plenty of options to create a LGTBQ+ character. Not unusual. However, there is also a scene inserted by one “transgender advancement” group. In this scene, a character is punished in-game with having to do ten push-ups for misgendering another character by calling them him or her, instead of them/they.

This is the epitome of an “agenda” in the modern colloquial sense. A targeted attempt to advance a cause through media, regardless of the appropriateness of the content, setting and relevance.

Now, consider that there are such advocates within practically every sector of media, each with their own agenda. The popular ones, that is the ones the companies think their audience wants, are pushed forward regardless of context or appropriateness for the material.

 

[pigmanovich]

Just while we’re on the subject of “agendas”, they absolutely, totally 100% exist. The problem is, people don’t understand the mechanics or scale and think it’s the same as a conspiracy at state level.

Within most communities of a subject, group or fandom, there are those who wish to put forward their own issues which are important to them - or agendas - and use the subject/group/fandom to advance visibility and improve perception of their cause.

One such specific example would be transgender activists, who actively targeted using video games to promote transgender awareness. A group of transgender activist writers specifically set up companies to consult with video game developers on how to integrate pro-transgender philosophies (or “agendas”) into games.

Consulting and Training – GaymerX: Everyone Games

gaymerx.org

Her Game Too PRIDE | Her Game Too

www.hergametoo.co.uk

And dozens more.

Due to negative backlash from consumers, many of whom found the messaging heavy handed and inappropriate for the settings the games take place in, these groups involvement is usually not advertised (or even outright hushed up), making it technically a conspiracy to promote a cause.

One such very recent example of this is the new game, Dragon Age: The Veilguard. In this game, there are plenty of options to create a LGTBQ+ character. Not unusual. However, there is also a scene inserted by one “transgender advancement” group. In this scene, a character is punished in-game with having to do ten push-ups for misgendering another character by calling them him or her, instead of them/they.

This is the epitome of an “agenda” in the modern colloquial sense. A targeted attempt to advance a cause through media, regardless of the appropriateness of the content, setting and relevance.

Now, consider that there are such advocates within practically every sector of media, each with their own agenda. The popular ones, that is the ones the companies think their audience wants, are pushed forward regardless of context or appropriateness for the material.

Beside the point but there’s a lot more to DATV’s handling of trans identity than that one scene - which I either haven’t gotten to yet or missed in my playthrough - and I’ve found it moving rather than heavy handed FWIW.

Worth noting as well that DATV is a BioWare title and BioWare have a history of striving for LGBT+ representation in their games so it’s not exactly out of left field.

 

[jcdenton08]

Beside the point but there’s a lot more to DATV’s handling of trans identity than that one scene - which I either haven’t gotten to yet or missed in my playthrough - and I’ve found it moving rather than heavy handed FWIW.

Worth noting as well that DATV is a BioWare title and BioWare have a history of striving for LGBT+ representation in their games so it’s not exactly out of left field.

Also worth noting that the game has been a big flop, and was trending at #27 on Steam, with 70,000 concurrent players. For reference, top new games stream 700,000+. While I’m not attributing this solely to “go woke, go broke”, producers can’t expect to force-feed issues like gender politics to people with no interest in them and expect everyone to like it.

This is the classic liberal issue of “we think this is right, if you don’t think this, you’re racist/sexist/homophobic/another ‘ist’”.

Here is the scene in question; I’m not offended by anything other than the shockingly bad writing though.

 

[ClemFandango]

Why is the definition of a women remotely important?

To preserve women’s rights for starters. You know, the sort of thing that lots of women think is kind of important

 

[pigmanovich]

Also worth noting that the game has been a big flop, and was trending at #27 on Steam, with 70,000 concurrent players. For reference, top new games stream 700,000+. While I’m not attributing this solely to “go woke, go broke”, producers can’t expect to force-feed issues like gender politics to people with no interest in them and expect everyone to like it.

This is the classic liberal issue of “we think this is right, if you don’t think this, you’re racist/sexist/homophobic/another ‘ist’”.

Here is the scene in question; I’m not offended by anything other than the shockingly bad writing though.

Err, not sure what that figure has to do with anything I said, at least not meaningfully. As you admit, it’s not a given that commercial underperformance is down to the game giving visibility to trans issues.

I’ve really enjoyed the game so far, but I’ve also been a fan of the series since the first installment. Its Metascore is decent at 83, but I accept professional reviewers don’t speak for everyone. I certainly would never claim anyone who isn’t into the game is a bigot.

Edit: Conveniently, if the trans companion’s plotline bothers anyone, they can simply not complete their personal quests and it never really comes up as far as I know.

 

[pigmanovich]

Err, not sure what that figure has to do with anything I said, at least not meaningfully. As you admit, it’s not a given that commercial underperformance is down to the game giving visibility to trans issues.

I’ve really enjoyed the game so far, but I’ve also been a fan of the series since the first installment. Its Metascore is decent at 83, but I accept professional reviewers don’t speak for everyone. I certainly would never claim anyone who isn’t into the game is a bigot.

Edit: Conveniently, if the trans companion’s plotline bothers anyone, they can simply not complete their personal quests and it never really comes up as far as I know.

On concurrent player numbers: This says DATV peaked at about 89k, and reporting suggests that’s an all time high for BioWare and respectable by the standards of EA published single player titles. So perhaps it’s not so dire commercially after all.

 

[jcdenton08]

On concurrent player numbers: This says DATV peaked at about 89k, and reporting suggests that’s an all time high for BioWare and respectable by the standards of EA published single player titles. So perhaps it’s not so dire commercially after all.

The game was in production for ten years, with estimated minimum production and marketing costs of $300m+. The truth of the matter will be known in a month or two, when the DLC roadmap is announced (or not), or reports surface of BioWare devs being redeployed to other studios, which is EA’s usual MO. It’s fair to say that short of exceptional sales - far better than those evidenced by SteamDB - would be required to break even, let alone make a profit.

Also, you mentioned the 83 Metacritic score, but not the 3.8/10 user score. There seems to be a real divide in opinion.

 

[pigmanovich]

The game was in production for ten years, with estimated minimum production and marketing costs of $300m+. The truth of the matter will be known in a month or two, when the DLC roadmap is announced (or not), or reports surface of BioWare devs being redeployed to other studios, which is EA’s usual MO. It’s fair to say that short of exceptional sales - far better than those evidenced by SteamDB - would be required to break even, let alone make a profit.

If anything, development hell and the associated costs better explain why DATV might turn out to be a commercial failure — because it was so expensive to make that it was never likely to be profitable, not with the sales BioWare games have historically recorded — than a backlash to a plotline that’s minor to the overall story and possible to avoid entirely.

Also, you mentioned the 83 Metacritic score, but not the 3.8/10 user score. There seems to be a real divide in opinion.

I didn’t, I said professional reviewers don’t speak for everyone, though their opinion certainly counts for something unless you believe that they’re all or mostly in EA’s pocket.

 

[Curious Orange]

This is another example of the stuff 'The Right' say. "remove their right to female-only space and sports by the extreme left"! Yes, lots of people are trying to come to terms with the weird conundrum of what to do about people who want to play women's sport, but were once men and now see themselves as women. This problem is tiny in the grand scheme of the world isn't it? It's not like that are 2 million trans people smashing female Rugby players into the ground. It's an infintesimal problem that nobody needs to be freaking out about. The media and right wing twats just make it out to be some earth-shattering problem.

And yes, there is also the problem of some men out there saying they are now women, but turning out to in fact be rapey men. That's not some woke left new world order bullshit. That's a sex offender using a cover to prey on people. The dickheads on the right actually make this worse by making it all about some existential fight to survive as a given gender.

Ironically, these "real, red blooded men" on the right need to stop being such utter melts.

I am genuinely disappointed by the tone of the first part of your response, as to me it came across as a bit dismissive of women's hard won rights, but at least you see that there is actually a problem to be addressed in those areas.

The rest of your post I actually mostly agree with. The middle paragraph perfectly illustrates why we didn't and shouldn't allow any males in female spaces. Most males are not rapists, but we are happy to not be allowed in female only spaces as it is a matter of their safety - their right to not be raped is more important than a male's right to present as a woman.

 

[FatSuperman]

To preserve women’s rights for starters. You know, the sort of thing that lots of women think is kind of important

You don't need to have some global agreement on the definition of a woman to be able to preserve women's rights for f*** sake.

 

[FatSuperman]

I am genuinely disappointed by the tone of the first part of your response, as to me it came across as a bit dismissive of women's hard won rights, but at least you see that there is actually a problem to be addressed in those areas.

The rest of your post I actually mostly agree with. The middle paragraph perfectly illustrates why we didn't and shouldn't allow any males in female spaces. Most males are not rapists, but we are happy to not be allowed in female only spaces as it is a matter of their safety - their right to not be raped is more important than a male's right to present as a woman.

How wonderfully ironic that you read it like that Orange. I would say that if somebody genuinely cared about women's safety and women's rights, they wouldn't be pointing at the tiny problems caused by these trans debates that we haven't worked through yet, they'd be focussing on the fact that the biggest threat to women is men. And the biggest threat to their rights is facism and the far right.

I'm sure you already know the numbers, but 1 in 30 women are raped every year in this country. ONE IN THIRTY. How many do you think are raped by trans people? No idea either, but I reckon it's something like one in a million, and yet that is the thing some people concerned about to 'make female spaces safe'. It is an absolute certainty that women get attacked in female only spaces by men far, far more often than they will by trans people.

So if you cared about women Orange, genuinely cared, then you'd want to be solving the men problem before you worry about the trans problem.

I have spent my adult life championing women, I grew up in a house with five sisters and have watched them have half the opportunities I have had, simply by nature of their gender. But at no point in their combined 208 years have they had any issue with their rights or safety being infringed on due to trans people. There amount of total arsehole men that have f***ed them about, including beating them is almost uncountable. Women are twice as likely as men to have an adverse drug reaction - why? Because even in 2024, drug dosage is based on the average man, and does not take into account differences in the female phsyiology. Women are 50% more likely to be seriously injured in a car accident - why? Because crash test standards in most places still only use crash test dummies based on men. That's because it's more expensive to do all those tests again and change stuff so it's safer for women. Even the furniture in the street - the step depth, the door handles, all of it - is designed for a six-foot, right-handed male. The world doesn't give a shit about women.

Sorry for the arsey post, I'm sure you're a good guy all told. I just think it's pathetic people are focussing on the trans debate like it's an issue. In my opinion it's not even worth talking about (in the scheme of problems faced by women)

 

[lasvegan]

Jimmy Kimmel visibly trying to hold back the tears as he lists all the people and groups that this election result is bad for which included, of course, "all the people who voted for him who don't realise it yet".

Jimmy Kimmel is a certifiable idiot. Not someone you’d want to hang your hat on…