[Politics] The 2024 US Election - *MATCH DAY*

[nicko31]

Imagine being asleep for a decade and be woken to be told of who was leading in the polls in the US election, what they represent and what they've done so far.

The US has certainly put in some cranks in the past but its its still incredible how low US politics has fallen.

Here things got bad with Johnson but ultimately Tories MP's dealt with him and the public then dealt with his party.

 

[Eric the meek]

I'm watching an old version of 'Have I got news for you' on Dave, and I've learned that Joe Biden's dog Commander likes to bite secret service agents.

He's bitten 11 allegedly.

 

[Zeberdi]

I think America deserves a bit better than being run by members of the same family. It's one of the reasons Trump as a political outsider is so popular.

I was actually responding to earlier suggestions by other posters supporting MO - I was just saying she would be stronger Black female candidate than Harris if that’s what people want. I think personally, Mark Kelly could garner more support and I don’t think America is ready for a woman president let a lone a black one. However, your ‘same family‘ argument for preferring a young, white male instead is a bit thin:

• John Quincy Adams, the 6th president, was the son of John Adams, the 2nd president.
• George W. Bush, number 43 was the son of George W. H. Bush, number 41.
• Benjamin Harrison, the 23rd president, was grandson to William H. Harrison, 9th president.
• James Madison, number 4 was second cousins with Zachary Taylor, number 12.
• Teddy Roosevelt, number 26 was distantly related to Franklin D. Roosevelt, number 32.
• The Kennedys may only have produced one President but truly a political dynasty in America.

Having Michele Obama the wife of an ex-President, run, won’t buck the trend much. America deserves the best candidate for the job (whether it is her or not)

 

[US Seagull]

Will these non-woke voters know what a pencil and an X is though and, are they registered to vote ?

It varies by state, but I don't know of any state that uses a pencil and an X.

Most have you fill in bubbles on a scantron sheet.

 

[dwayne]

I can tell we’re not in full agreement on this one, but one of the reasons I’m not sure this is a done deal is the following: (short essay follows - apologies if TL and therefore DR)

The American news cycle is very tightly tailored to the attention span of the average member of the public. It seems almost daft to ask this now, but I wonder “Did Donald Trump get shot at too early in the campaign?”

*If* what follows later in the campaign is Donald Trump looking a bit old, orange and wobbly, while Kamala Harris looks confident and performs well, then we could see the Biden scenario (which the Republicans weaponised effectively) in reverse.

Suddenly America realises that there is still a doddery old candidate up there, but it isn’t the Democrat one, and the Republicans have made a REALLY big deal about linking age and fitness for high office.

I think Trump is a wily enough operator to navigate this and not just go through the remaining campaign saying “I was shot at you know” but I wouldn’t say we could call Biden dropping out a positive for Trump, a man who would hit 80 halfway through his term if he won.

Think Kamala would be a disaster..... She's a terrible politician and she just about pissed off everyone when she was DA and flip flopped all over the place. Blacks don't like her either as she was cop friendly in Cali. She's also a woeful speaker.

Even the guardian don't like her

Kamala Harris laughed about jailing parents over truancy. But it's not funny | Nathan Robinson

Recently resurfaced videos of Harris defending her decision to lock up parents over truancy are disturbing

www.google.com

 

[GT49er]

Will these non-woke voters know what a pencil and an X is though and, are they registered to vote ?

Yes, yes and probably yes - sadly. They've done it before. Some of them even went to Washington to confirm their commitment to doing it.

.......or they've learned to do this -

It varies by state, but I don't know of any state that uses a pencil and an X.
Most have you fill in bubbles on a scantron sheet.

(Thanks for the info, #US Seagull)

 

[MJsGhost]

A younger white heterosexual man would be better - anything else (woman, gay, black/brown) Trump would hoover up the votes of every non-woke American.






................and there's MILLIONS of them!

Trump might haemorrhage some BAME voters, but would also hoover up every non-woke voter. In that scenario, Trump wins hands down.

Am I reading this right and what you're saying is that (in the US) anyone who votes for a woman, a person of colour or a gay man/woman is 'woke'? "Non-wokes" will just vote for a white straight guy?

I haven't really caught up on this thread, so I hope I am being whooshed.

The obvious thing to say is that, given Obama's win, there are clearly enough 'wokes' in the US to beat Trump.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Am I reading this right and what you're saying is that (in the US) anyone who votes for a woman, a person of colour or a gay man/woman is 'woke'? "Non-wokes" will just vote for a white straight guy?

I haven't really caught up on this thread, so I hope I am being whooshed.

The obvious thing to say is that, given Obama's win, there are clearly enough 'wokes' in the US to beat Trump.

Non woken will vote for an orange straight guy.

 

[chickens]

Think Kamala would be a disaster..... She's a terrible politician and she just about pissed off everyone when she was DA and flip flopped all over the place. Blacks don't like her either as she was cop friendly in Cali. She's also a woeful speaker.

Even the guardian don't like her

Kamala Harris laughed about jailing parents over truancy. But it's not funny | Nathan Robinson

Recently resurfaced videos of Harris defending her decision to lock up parents over truancy are disturbing

www.google.com

Well, here’s a WAY too long vid of her speeches in 2023. Feel free to skim. Like a lot of public speakers she starts shakily and builds confidence as she goes. She’s not an inspiring orator, but she’s not dreadful either. She can deliver a point reasonably straightforwardly, which may play well against Trump’s more rambling style.



As for being hated by the Guardian, that’s almost a badge of honour these days. J K Rowling is hated by the Guardian for believing in the existence of biological women, it’s not a difficult thing to achieve.

 

[GT49er]

Am I reading this right and what you're saying is that (in the US) anyone who votes for a woman, a person of colour or a gay man/woman is 'woke'? "Non-wokes" will just vote for a white straight guy?

I haven't really caught up on this thread, so I hope I am being whooshed.

The obvious thing to say is that, given Obama's win, there are clearly enough 'wokes' in the US to beat Trump.

Oh FFS sake!

Don't be so precious on your lefty high horse! Trump will/would pump up every single prejudice against women, blacks, homosexuals, black women - probably Jews, Mexicans as well if he thought it would benefit him - and it would! Get real! America has swung to the right in the last 15 years since Obama was elected, and besides, Obama wasn't up against Trump and his MAGA trope.
Was the White House attacked by armed thugs when Obama was elected?
No.
Was that even thinkable then?
No.
Did it happen when Trump orchestrated it?
Yes
Brighton (or at least NSC) might be the home of progressive liberalism; the USA is not!

 

[StonehamPark]

I can tell we’re not in full agreement on this one, but one of the reasons I’m not sure this is a done deal is the following: (short essay follows - apologies if TL and therefore DR)

Good post, totally fine if we're not in agreement, I genuinely am interested in all perspectives in what is essentially (or for me is) one of the most drama-filled, free-to-air television event of our lifetimes. - Short essay TL;DR following here too, I feel exposed now so soon after the 'Post Length' thread apeared.

I feel I may have a possibly unique (not to say correct or incorrect in anyway whatsoever) perspective, growing up in Brighton, living and working in the States for a bit, and then settling in Canada and dealing with the (also highly frictional) political system here, with still much of my work and clients US-based. Again, that is not at all me trying to say I'm in any way more or less versed to give an opinion, just that I have a relatively unique one.

The American news cycle is very tightly tailored to the attention span of the average member of the public. It seems almost daft to ask this now, but I wonder “Did Donald Trump get shot at too early in the campaign?”

It's definitely a theory-craftable question. Without putting too much time into thinking about it, off the cuff, I'd say had it not happened until later down the line (say mid-Autumn), Biden would have stayed in the race (imo), and then I guess it's a toss-up as to how Biden performed over next new few weeks, and during a possible second debate. I guess this is the long way around me saying that I would probably wager that the event having happened now, in such close proximity to the first debate, gave the Republicans the (slight) advantage.

*If* what follows later in the campaign is Donald Trump looking a bit old, orange and wobbly, while Kamala Harris looks confident and performs well, then we could see the Biden scenario (which the Republicans weaponised effectively) in reverse.
Suddenly America realises that there is still a doddery old candidate up there, but it isn’t the Democrat one, and the Republicans have made a REALLY big deal about linking age and fitness for high office.

Personally, I can't see (m)any Trumpers or Red voters switching last minute due to Trump appearing/acting older. I feel like most voters are pretty entrenched right now - unless the Blues pull out a Joker card in form of a superstar nominee. As I said a couple of weeks back, I think it'll be a pretty tight race, with likely the largest turnout in American voting history. Though, if Harris is put out as the Dem nominee, a larger win margin for Trump imo.

I think Trump is a wily enough operator to navigate this and not just go through the remaining campaign saying “I was shot at you know” but I wouldn’t say we could call Biden dropping out a positive for Trump, a man who would hit 80 halfway through his term if he won.

As things stand now, with it looking like Harris being the candidate, I'd wager Biden dropping out a positive for Trump, only imo.
But I'm super fascinated to watch over this coming week to see how the Dems pull themselves back together and who they officially put out there, and I'll be very happy to be surpised if they can pull something off.

 

[Eric the meek]

BBC have just reported that senior Democrats are supporting Kamala Harris for the nomination.

No other candidate is in the frame at the moment.

 

[Zeberdi]

I think Trump is a wily enough operator to navigate this and not just go through the remaining campaign saying “I was shot at you know” but I wouldn’t say we could call Biden dropping out a positive for Trump, a man who would hit 80 halfway through his term if he won.

Quite.

And Biden withdrawing has robbed Trump of one of his strongest and most effective campaign tools to date - to show himself as the younger, fitter candidate and Biden as the ‘sleepy Joe’ who is not fit to run. The Republicans very much wanted Biden to stay in the race.

Hopefully the Trump campaign has been derailed by this. Republicans will continue to conduct negative campaigning against Biden at their peril, Biden is a well respected grandee of American politics, attacking him or his Presidency now he has withdrawn just looks like meanness and bullying and will win them no votes.

It will also serve to detract negative attention away from Harris.

Leader of the House tonight questioning Biden’s fitness for continuing in his Presidency (which was to be expected)

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

BBC have just reported that senior Democrats are supporting Kamala Harris for the nomination.

No other candidate is in the frame at the moment.

I assume they are weighing up if its worth using their one shot now on what looks like a loss.

Quite.

And Biden withdrawing has robbed Trump of one of his strongest and most effective campaign tools to date - to show himself as the younger, fitter candidate and Biden as the ‘sleepy Joe’ who is not fit to run. The Republicans very much wanted Biden to stay in the race.

Hopefully the Trump campaign has been derailed by this. Republicans will continue to conduct negative campaigning against Biden at their peril, Biden is a well respected grandee of American politics, attacking him or his Presidency now he has withdrawn just looks like meanness and bullying and will win them no votes.

It will also serve to detract negative attention away from Harris.

Leader of the House tonight questioning Biden’s fitness for continuing in his Presidency (which was to be expected)

I think it is a fair question if he is fit to stay in office, realistically its only 4 months till the election so nothing will happen.

On the republican campaign, they would have expected this at some point, Trump was gloating about it happening a couple of weeks ago after the debate.

I don't think much will change in how they will go about it, maybe more aimed at how Harris let Biden go on so long.

 

[lasvegan]

Quite.

And Biden withdrawing has robbed Trump of one of his strongest and most effective campaign tools to date - to show himself as the younger, fitter candidate and Biden as the ‘sleepy Joe’ who is not fit to run. The Republicans very much wanted Biden to stay in the race.

Hopefully the Trump campaign has been derailed by this. Republicans will continue to conduct negative campaigning against Biden at their peril, Biden is a well respected grandee of American politics, attacking him or his Presidency now he has withdrawn just looks like meanness and bullying and will win them no votes.

It will also serve to detract negative attention away from Harris.

Leader of the House tonight questioning Biden’s fitness for continuing in his Presidency (which was to be expected)

Mike Johnson absolutely spot on there…

 

[US Seagull]

Mike Johnson absolutely spot on there…

Bullshit. They can't call Biden "the worst president ever" and then cry when he withdraws.

 

[lasvegan]

Bullshit. They can't call Biden "the worst president ever" and then cry when he withdraws.

You obviously didn’t read the tweet. I have no idea what you are responding to.

 

[GT49er]

Mike Johnson absolutely spot on there…

What a load of politically biassed (and inaccurate) bullshit! I assume Johnson is one of the bigots, MAGA, mysoginists and xenophobes for Trump brigade?

 

[Triggaaar]

Bullshit. They can't call Biden "the worst president ever" and then cry when he withdraws.

It's pretty funny when the worst US president ever, calls CNN to claim that it's actually the current president who's the worst.

 

[Stato]

Mike Johnson absolutely spot on there…

Mike Johnson of course knows all about invalidating the votes of millions of Americans, given that he took the lead in filing a case to attempt to overturn the result of the last Presidential election: https://apnews.com/article/congress...ertification-8cd7c5a9e6ae69635bbb4624cc78e5c5