[Politics] Sunak's benefits shake up

[Baldseagull]

I have the utmost respect for you but I am sorry, whilst I agree that you should not ignore a GP's diagnosis can you not accept that far too many are able to convince the doctor that they have "mental health" issues?
It has certainly become the most common phrase in the last few years.

How do you know if it is many or few that are swinging the lead? Is it not more likely that more people's mental health is suffering, or maybe that fewer people are able to afford the time off they need to get a break from work?
My own mental health has at times been poor, but as a self employed person, I just take a break from work till either I am feeling up to it, or I run out of cash and have to go back to work. These days I mostly try to just reduce my workload when I feel it building up, but not everyone is able to or can afford to.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

I have the utmost respect for you but I am sorry, whilst I agree that you should not ignore a GP's diagnosis can you not accept that far too many are able to convince the doctor that they have "mental health" issues?
It has certainly become the most common phrase in the last few years.

Mate, I agree with you. I see it on the mitigating circumstances committee I sit on at uni. Student goes to GP, says they are depressed, and the GP gives them a sick note. Two week's extension.

And yet....I am not sure how you or I are better qualified than a GP to decide if someone has a mental health issue or not. Just think about it. Unless you know the person, and the workings of their mind, how can you know?

Sometimes the person themself won't know. See a conversation that several had with @Colonel Mustard yesterday.

Yes there are stories in the Daily Mail about someone with a sick note having it large in Torremolinos. But even then, what does the Mail know, in fact?

I can't tell whether an individual has genuine mental health issues or not. I can tell, however, that Sunak plans, and indeed has successed, in weaponizing it.

Are there fakers and frauds? Yes. Could we deal with this by handing over the decision making to non-doctors? No.

End of discussion.

Sorry if I have sounded pissy on this subject but it has got right on my wick.

(Perhaps I can get signed off for a bit for wick rehabilitation? )

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Already dealt with above.

I realise that but the least we can do if we are actually quoting other people’s post is address the comments they made rather than posting non-sequitur remarks that end up totally confusing the OP as to why they were even quoted in the first place

I think I was the OP (the 'O' P) wasn't I? I was the Firestarter. Wicked thread starter.

And I'm not confused

 

[maltaseagull]

Mate, I agree with you. I see it on the mitigating circumstances committee I sit on at uni. Student goes to GP, says they are depressed, and the GP gives them a sick note. Two week's extension.

And yet....I am not sure how you or I are better qualified than a GP to decide if someone has a mental health issue or not. Just think about it. Unless you know the person, and the workings of their mind, how can you know?

Sometimes the person themself won't know. See a conversation that several had with @Colonel Mustard yesterday.

Yes there are stories in the Daily Mail about someone with a sick note having it large in Torremolinos. But even then, what does the Mail know, in fact?

I can't tell whether an individual has genuine mental health issues or not. I can tell, however, that Sunak plans, and indeed has successed, in weaponizing it.

Are their fakers and frauds? Yes. Could we deal with this by handing over the decision making to non-doctors? No.

End of discussion.

Sorry if I have sounded pissy on this subject but it has got right on my wick.

(Perhaps I can get signed off for a bit for wick rehabilitation? )

Just go to your GP (if you can) you will probably be asked how long you want.

 

[Zeberdi]

People who arrive unofficially, including those in small boats, do so illegally. Yes, plenty will later be granted the right to stay and acquire legal status.

No, not true.

people arriving in small boats (or in lorries etc) do so as asylum seekers (which does not require them to have any legal status because being an asylum seeker is a legal right and seeking asylum is a legal process to obtaining refugee status - until then, they have a right to remain unless another Country (like Rwanda) agrees to take them - but their freedoms will be severely restricted.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Just go to your GP (if you can) you will probably be asked how long you want.

But it will take me 3 months to get an appointment, and I will have grown a new one by then.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

You didn't a

I am sorry but that is a pathetic response.
You don't need to ask those questions.
You appear to know the answer to everything.
I usually enjoy reading your posts but am beginning to think you are a little bit arrogant.
BTW it's Capital punishment.

Sorry, I seem to have fallen into a time warp.

'Capitol' was a joke. Hence the follow on about London. The capitol. I can't resist that sort of thing.

And so, that post....I was just having a bit of fun. I felt like I needed some.

 

[Sid and the Sharknados]

Sorry, I seem to have fallen into a time warp.

'Capitol' was a joke. Hence the follow on about London. The capitol. I can't resist that sort of thing.

And so, that post....I was just having a bit of fun. I felt like I needed some.

Capital in the sense of capital city would be spelt with two "a"s. As in capital.

Sadly my particular brand of pedantic humour is rather more common.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

No, not true.

people arriving in small boats (or in lorries etc) do so as asylum seekers (which does not require them to have any legal status because being an asylum seeker is a legal right and seeking asylum is a legal process to obtaining refugee status - until then, they have a right to remain unless another Country (like Rwanda) agrees to take them - but their freedoms will be severely restricted.

Precisely, which is why I have been mentioning the minister for 'Illegal Immigration' which I have sometimes put into quotes, and have been asking who is minister for legal immigration.

Some of this goes right over some people's heads. And instead some people jump to the hilarious conclusion that I'm in favour of illegal immigration. FFS.

Oh, and in case any of my protagonists genuinely care, I'm not arrogant (well, I can be, but not about this). I am exasperated. Completely f***ing exasperated.

I half expect someone to pop on in a minute and tell me off for being nasty to Sunak, as Sunak is doing the best he can, and has given up so much on behalf of his country.

 

[maltaseagull]

But it will take me 3 months to get an appointment, and I will have grown a new one by then.

Never mind. Your lot will sort it all out.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Capital in the sense of capital city would be spelt with two "a"s. As in capital.

Sadly my particular brand of pedantic humour is rather more common.

I actually thought you'd caught me out and I'd cocked up one of my jokes again, you northern barsterd.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Never mind. Your lot will sort it all out.

You think Labour will win? I wish I shared your optimism

 

[Sid and the Sharknados]

I actually thought you'd caught me out and I'd cocked up one of my jokes again, you northern barsterd.

"Somebody's questioned my spelling. I must retire for 6months to reconsider my life choices."

 

[maltaseagull]

Precisely, which is why I have been mentioning the minister for 'Illegal Immigration' which I have sometimes put into quotes, and have been asking who is minister for legal immigration.

Some of this goes right over some people's heads. And instead some people jump to the hilarious conclusion that I'm in favour of illegal immigration. FFS.

Oh, and in case any of my protagonists genuinely care, I'm not arrogant (well, I can be, but not about this). I am exasperated. Completely f***ing exasperated.

I half expect someone to pop on in a minute and tell me off for being nasty to Sunak, as Sunak is doing the best he can, and has given up so much on behalf of his country.

Not doing that. But what if he goes to his Harley street Doctor and gets signed off for weeks due to stress?

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Not doing that. But what if he goes to his Harley street Doctor and gets signed off for weeks due to stress?

Sunak?

Well, if a doctor makes a clinical decision about him, who am I to argue?

But stress, though? There is more chance he'd see his health care specialist about the chafing caused by his rubbing the nation up the wrong way

 

[Cotton Socks]

Here's my opinion for what it's worth:

Most people off work in the long-term (“‘off sick”) are never going to get back to work. How much of the reason is genuine depression, anxiety, back pain etc and how much of it is an attitude/behavioural issue is hard to say, and probably impossible to prove one way or the other in a lot of cases. Once someone reaches their 40s and they haven’t worked for years, it’s too late. Most of them won’t become “economically active”.

The solution to reduce the number people in this situation is to help children gain confidence, self esteem and general life skills so that they develop into adults with a healthy, positive attitude towards life and social interaction with others, and find work to be a positive, fulfilling experience. (Having jobs where you don’t work an extremely pressurised 12-13 hour day non-stop without any breaks might help as well but that’s another story). This requires investment in education and sports, outdoor activities, arts, music etc to help them develop skills and be happy. It also requires investment in children’s mental health services so that if they do have problems (a lot of children and parents are coming forward now believing they may autism or ADHD for example) these can be treated and that person can get close to fulfilling their potential. Instead as a country we do the opposite. Teachers are not valued, schools are swamped with inspections, and children's mental health “services” are pretty much non-existent, so the problem of economically inactive adults will probably get worse in the next 10-15 years in my opinion as these untreated, neglected children reach working age.

So as usual this is problem of the government’s own making and they are making it worse. It is difficult because it requires a long-term vision over 10-20 years which of course is longer than the time-frame which governments work to. I wish someone in politics would come up with decent long-term policies looking way beyond their elected five year term - they’d get my vote if they did.

There’s another group of people who are economically inactive who want to get back to work but can’t work due to a fixable condition (eg hip osteoarthritis) and are waiting for treatment. Once they get treated they’ll be fit to return to work but of course the waiting lists are massive and so they’re off work for months to years waiting. Again a problem which the government have created themselves.

You're next expecting the government to use joined up thinking are you? Invest in kids to give them a good start.... Nah no point in that.
Most of the Sure Start centres were closed due to austerity, so the next place any problems are likely to picked up is school. No point giving extra money to schools either, they just waste it on things like pens and books for the kids to write in. No point helping them learn resilience, I mean Covid should've made them all resilient, all that time not socialising and chatting to their mates, should have had them all getting grade A's in every subject. Lessons by Zoom and no distractions from them all talking, perfect.
As for those feckless parents that didn't have laptops or pc's for their kids to use & only mobile data that was eaten up in a couple of lessons, they're to blame for the drop in grades for not ensuring that the internet was there as well as something suitable to use.

As for considering that a way to help sick people back to work would be to get them treatment is laughable. That would just cause another group of people to demonise and blame for things going wrong in this country, to be removed. They will run out of people to blame!

I think people who grow their own vegetables are a big problem. They're causing supermarkets to have massive drops in profit which then makes them have to increase prices which drives up inflation. F**king gardeners, I'll get onto Rishi about it. Your ideas are just far to sensible to be considered.

 

[WATFORD zero]

Who in most cases have WORKED for 50+ years and contributed towards their pension with NI contributions. Whereas the millions on benefits contribute nothing.
There are genuine cases I am sure, but also many scroungers.
But it's not trendy to say that.

I really can't be arsed with all this, but do you really think your NI contributions were 'invested to pay your pension ?'

What do you think paid for the NHS, Police, emergency services, public services, benefits, education and every other aspect of living in the UK when you were growing up ?

The very simple fact is that even though you've now buggered off to Malta, your living costs are being paid by teenagers, all those various Gen whatever their names are these days (I can't keep up), and young families trying to make ends meet in Britain. Unless you're going to claim that you don't take a state pension paid for by all those people on a weekly basis.

The simple fact is that if you do, you are on benefits

So I am guessing it's only fair that you should have a detailed check to see if you're a valid benefitee or a scrounger

 

[Cotton Socks]

I think I was the OP (the 'O' P) wasn't I? I was the Firestarter. Wicked thread starter.

And I'm not confused

If you're going to try and quote song lyrics get it right!!!
*Twisted* thread/fire starter!
Just saying, no song lyric pedantry here at all.

 

[Cotton Socks]

Not doing that. But what if he goes to his Harley street Doctor and gets signed off for weeks due to stress?

I'd start a crowd funder to make sure he can continue to pay his Dr and stay signed off!

 

[maltaseagull]

I'd start a crowd funder to make sure he can continue to pay his Dr and stay signed off!

And you take over his job?