Steven Gerrard

[Rusthall Seagull]

Weren't Pirlo and Kaka on the pitch when Liverpool won the Champions League??

come one! dont start pointing out facts on this thread....whatever next!

 

[Rusthall Seagull]

Bulldog, Keaton, Badger and Edna all have valuable points. Basically Gerrard plays like a thicko for England.

no....he plays out of position for England - totally different!

 

[Les Biehn]

no....he plays out of position for England - totally different!

Managers play him out of position because they see him as a liability in the middle.

 

[Mellotron]

Because up against the most technically gifted players he's totally exposed for what he really is?

Like AC Milan, Manchester United, those sort of players?

It's because (as he pointed out in his recent interview) the England team is not built around him. Nor should it be, he needs to learn to become a team player, as Lampard proved he can be in the Croatia game.

 

[Rusthall Seagull]

Managers play him out of position because they see him as a liability in the middle.[/QUOTE

Yep, correct....known as a midfield liability.....taken Liverpool to 2 Champ League finals playing in that position, but hey, what a liability! Benitez must be mad to play him there

 

[Les Biehn]

Managers play him out of position because they see him as a liability in the middle.[/QUOTE

Yep, correct....known as a midfield liability.....taken Liverpool to 2 Champ League finals playing in that position, but hey, what a liability! Benitez must be mad to play him there

Jesus, are you his Dad or something? You seem to be taking it a bit personally.

Benitez often plays him out of position, Houllier often played him out of position, Mourinho said he would make him more effective if he came to Chelsea, successive England managers have played him out of position. If he was the god like central figure you suggest why would so many top managers play him out of position or think he needs to refine his game?

 

[Barrel of Fun]

The only player I would have built a team around was Le Tissier. Gerrard can take a running jump. If he is as good as he thinks he is, then surely he should be able to adapt?

 

[Mellotron]

It's silly. I still think we have a problem in England....this mindset of HAVING to have a Best 11 for the National Team (ie it's Gerrard & Barry OR Lampard & Hargreaves, and then that's it, no changes).

But that's very narrow minded. You pick the team to suit the game. I can see certain games suiting Lampard & Barry in the middle, then the next game suited to Hargreaves & Gerrard.

I'm not talking about Rafa-style rotation for the sake of rotation, but look at Fabregas's use in the Euros. In England we would be bemoaning the manager for not starting him every game, but Aragones used him tactically, bringing him in and out of games at the right times, allowing the less spectacular Senna to have a stormer of a tournament.

We still need to learn the mindset that there isn't a perfect 11. A best team. It changes game to game.

 

[Les Biehn]

The only player I would have built a team around was Le Tissier. Gerrard can take a running jump. If he is as good as he thinks he is, then surely he should be able to adapt?

I read an interview with him last week where he was basically saying he likes to tell the manager where he wants to play and is unhappy if he plays out of position but pokes up with it. Well Steven if you did your job in the first place you would get to play in the position you want.

 

[Rusthall Seagull]

Jesus, are you his Dad or something? You seem to be taking it a bit personally.

Benitez often plays him out of position, Houllier often played him out of position, Mourinho said he would make him more effective if he came to Chelsea, successive England managers have played him out of position. If he was the god like central figure you suggest why would so many top managers play him out of position or think he needs to refine his game?

Am I Steven Gerrards Dad? Why? because you are talking utter nonsense and I happen to disagree?

Mourinho said he would make him more effective if he came to Chelsea

so? In what way? by playing him where? What does that statement actually mean?


btw, top managers such as Steve Mclaren?

 

[Mellotron]

I read an interview with him last week where he was basically saying he likes to tell the manager where he wants to play and is unhappy if he plays out of position but pokes up with it. Well Steven if you did your job in the first place you would get to play in the position you want.

I quite like that he came out with that interview when he did, I imagine Capello will take a rather dim view of Gerrard's resistance to being tactically disciplined and a team player. Lampard's definitely got one up on him at the moment.

Again, it works at Liverpool because they are willing to have TWO holding midfielders so Gerrard can do what he wants when he wants. At England we have Joe Cole, Wayne Rooney, Frank Lampard & Theo Walcott. I'm not willing to sacrifice all these players freedom just so Stevie G can go charging around.

 

[Les Biehn]

Am I Steven Gerrards Dad? Why? because you are talking utter nonsense and I happen to disagree?

Mourinho said he would make him more effective if he came to Chelsea

so? In what way? by playing him where? What does that statement actually mean?


btw, top managers such as Steve Mclaren?

Well you do seem to be getting a bit of a knock on about it.

So Benitez, Houllier, Sven and Capello aren't top, well respected managers?

I guess it means that Mourinho feels he is not as effective in the middle. When taken in respect of other factors I think it's fairly obvious. Maybe I'm wrong.

 

[Les Biehn]

I quite like that he came out with that interview when he did, I imagine Capello will take a rather dim view of Gerrard's resistance to being tactically disciplined and a team player. Lampard's definitely got one up on him at the moment.

Again, it works at Liverpool because they are willing to have TWO holding midfielders so Gerrard can do what he wants when he wants. At England we have Joe Cole, Wayne Rooney, Frank Lampard & Theo Walcott. I'm not willing to sacrifice all these players freedom just so Stevie G can go charging around.

But why not? He is the worlds best central midfielder. Well one that sometimes struggles to get a game in that position but certainly not because of any negative reasons.

 

[Mellotron]

Well you do seem to be getting a bit of a knock on about it.

So Benitez, Houllier, Sven and Capello aren't top, well respected managers?

I guess it means that Mourinho feels he is not as effective in the middle.

All of this suggests that Gerrard is unwilling or unable to play in a system unless it suits him down to a T.

I expect him to continue being brilliant for Liverpool and average for England unless Capello knocks it into him that he can't just do what he wants when he wants.

 

[Rusthall Seagull]

I quite like that he came out with that interview when he did, I imagine Capello will take a rather dim view of Gerrard's resistance to being tactically disciplined and a team player. Lampard's definitely got one up on him at the moment.

Again, it works at Liverpool because they are willing to have TWO holding midfielders so Gerrard can do what he wants when he wants. At England we have Joe Cole, Wayne Rooney, Frank Lampard & Theo Walcott. I'm not willing to sacrifice all these players freedom just so Stevie G can go charging around.

why would you have to sacrifice Cole, Rooney or Walcott? Look at the players on the pitch for Liverpool last night...probably their best player was a winger (babel)...who was involved for their first goal ? Torres....

the amazing thing is, England have done precisely f*** ALL in major competitions for many years - the teams that tend do do well, play TWO holding midfielders.

 

[Mellotron]

But why not? He is the worlds best central midfielder. Well one that sometimes struggles to get a game in that position but certainly not because of any negative reasons.

My sarcasm detector just exploded.

 

[Les Biehn]

All of this suggests that Gerrard is unwilling or unable to play in a system unless it suits him down to a T.

I expect him to continue being brilliant for Liverpool and average for England unless Capello knocks it into him that he can't just do what he wants when he wants.

The problem is I'm not sure Capello has enough time with him to do this. Also I think he still does a fair bit of what he wants for Liverpool.

 

[Les Biehn]

why would you have to sacrifice Cole, Rooney or Walcott? Look at the players on the pitch for Liverpool last night...probably their best player was a winger (babel)...who was involved for their first goal ? Torres....

the amazing thing is, England have done precisely f*** ALL in major competitions for many years - the teams that tend do do well, play TWO holding midfielders.

United and Chelsea don't and they both got to the Champions league final last year.

 

[Mellotron]

The problem is I'm not sure Capello has enough time with him to do this. Also I think he still does a fair bit of what he wants for Liverpool.

Yeah that's exactly what I'm saying. He's brilliant at Liverpool because he has players like Kuyt who worked their arse off for him. And TWO holding midfielders to pick up anything Gerrard lets get past him.

Also, was speaking to Chesney Christ recently and he noted that Gerrard did infact start as a holding midfielder, a very good one at that. Anyone remember that?

I don't know how long Capello would put up with Gerrard as well if his recent interview is indicative of his attidue.

 

[Rusthall Seagull]

Well you do seem to be getting a bit of a knock on about it.

So Benitez, Houllier, Sven and Capello aren't top, well respected managers?

I guess it means that Mourinho feels he is not as effective in the middle. When taken in respect of other factors I think it's fairly obvious. Maybe I'm wrong.

But to fair, you are second guessing what Mourinho means...he could have meant anything by that comment - so I don't think it is 'fairly obvious' to anyone.

but if you could tell me 'what other factors' - then I will think again....you never know, maybe I'm wrong.