[Misc] Sewage in the sea

[Cheeky Monkey]

My advice is you’d need your head testing to go in the sea. Go to a pool if you want a swim.

“ Sussex has been particularly badly hit by sewage pollution, with new figures showing that every single beach between Brighton and Hastings has been marred by waste. Bexhill and Normans Bay beaches remain closed after raw sewage was pumped into the sea. A spokesperson for Southern Water said the firm was “deeply sorry” and understood “the distress this causes”.
However, the situation could be worse than the figures show: at Seaford, in Sussex, the sewage monitor was only working a third of the time.”

There’s a massive difference between those who choose to sea swim and those who prefer the pool. I have no interest in pool swimming, sea swimming is liberating and freedom in the way that pool swimming isn’t. As I said above, I have swum off Seaford, one of the polluted beaches, four times this week and last, each time swimming some distance out, and with no issues whatsoever, that said, I accept I have been lucky, having swallowed water in doing so. It doesn’t seem to have deterred the anglers either, plenty fishing off Seaford today.

 

[BHAboi]

Went for a swim off Hove Lawns this morning and agree is much better then the pool. Lots of white bait and mackerel this morning a couple of foot off the beach which was cool.... don't get that in the pool!

I have wondered why the overflows discharge in storms as only foul pipes should be connected into the sewer, unless everyone suddenly decides to go for a dump when it's stormy lol.

 

[DavidinSouthampton]

It’s almost like flogging vital national infrastructure to private companies more focused on profit margins than ensuring the infrastructure is maintained to a good standard was a bad idea.

Who could have seen this coming apart from everyone who’s ever heard of Railtrack?

When I left uni, my first job was with Southern Gas (British Gas) from 1976 to 1983. I always felt instinctively that privatisation of nationalised industries was morally and economically wrong, and I would in no way consider myself to be a loony leftie - more Centre-left. I have never seen any reason to change my mind, though.

Privatisation has clearly not brought the finance in to fund the necessary investment…… and that’s an understatement!

 

[A1X]

When I left uni, my first job was with Southern Gas (British Gas) from 1976 to 1983. I always felt instinctively that privatisation of nationalised industries was morally and economically wrong, and I would in no way consider myself to be a loony leftie - more Centre-left. I have never seen any reason to change my mind, though.

Privatisation has clearly not brought the finance in to fund the necessary investment…… and that’s an understatement!

For so many reasons, the state retaining ownership of it’s key infrastructure (water, gas, electric, sewage, roads, railways, phone lines, internet, airports) makes sense. The Governments which had just fought a war 80 years ago realised exactly that. These days we’d flog them to the Russians if we could.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

There’s a massive difference between those who choose to sea swim and those who prefer the pool. I have no interest in pool swimming, sea swimming is liberating and freedom in the way that pool swimming isn’t. As I said above, I have swum off Seaford, one of the polluted beaches, four times this week and last, each time swimming some distance out, and with no issues whatsoever, that said, I accept I have been lucky, having swallowed water in doing so. It doesn’t seem to have deterred the anglers either, plenty fishing off Seaford today.

Typhoid, cholera, polio, hepatitis A and that one which makes your eyes go sticky can take up to 30 days for symptoms to occur. Please log (pun intended) in after the Liverpool game otherwise I’ll worry for you.

Stay safe my friend.

 

[Questions]

So if you go swimming at the moment … are you just going through the motions ?

 

[BHAboi]

Typhoid, cholera, polio, hepatitis A and that one which makes your eyes go sticky can take up to 30 days for symptoms to occur. Please log (pun intended) in after the Liverpool game otherwise I’ll worry for you.

Stay safe my friend.

Very unlikely to catch any of these in reality.

 

[Questions]

Anyway pool swimmers even Adam Peatie admitted to peeing in the pool

 

[BrightonCottager]

As others have said, most of our sewers are 'combined' meaning rainwater gets mixed in with sewage. The Stormwater Tunnel under the prom was supposed to solve this but as I said in my OP, raw sewage was still discharged 64 times last year from the old outfall, sometimes after very little rain. I normally wait 24 hours after heavy rain before going swimming or surfing ant where near an outfall or the Adur. There's a map of local outfalls on the Facebook page of the local SAS group @sasinbrighton.

 

[Half Time Pies]

Anyway pool swimmers even Adam Peatie admitted to peeing in the pool

Up to 75 litres of Urine in public pools apparently! https://www.theguardian.com/science...imming-pools-new-urine-test-reveals-the-truth

Apparently the strong chlorine smell you get in some pools is caused when the chemicals in the urine mixes with the chlorine, creating a strong smelling by-product. Essentially the more urine the stronger the smell of chlorine! This by-product is also responsible for making your eyes sting!

 

[Guy Fawkes]

In 2020 265 Tory MPs voted down an amendment to the environment bill that would have legally obliged water companies not to pump sewage into waterways. Perhaps, we could vote out these shysters that care more about shareholder profits than the society they are supposed to govern.

Failing that, maybe we could join a pan-European group of countries and could set out clear rules on the treatment of waste water, That way, we wouldn't be completely beholden to the self-serving politicians that the great British public vote for. We could call it the Union of European countries or something.

So where would that sewage go? there suddenly wouldn't be enough capacity to cope if it isn't already there now, what do you expect to happen? someone clicks their fingers and it all magically appears?

I'm sure all the water companies know it's now a major issue, and are working at solutions to limit and eventually stop these sorts of spills, but like anything, it will take time to get there (nationalised services are always crying out for funding and seen as underfunded, so not sure if it was that it would be any better than it is now)

But in the court of public opinion with what becomes the next hot topic, all the unrealistic expectations come flooding out and demands to stop something without an reasonable thought given to practicalities and how exactly it can be achieved, no thought to time scale,

It took 10 years to get our stadium, how long do you think it would take to identify and secure enough sites, creating enough capacity within them to cope with the very worst flooding, and battle against the nimby's who will oppose any new site they may try to build?

Or what's the alternative? sewage flooded homes, businesses etc? when the system can't cope?

You never hear then and now comparisons for before and after privatisation, have the water companies closed sites and got less capacity, or has it increased but a lot of new builds in the area meant there is now less capacity per house than before? were they spilling before it was privatised, but it wasn't a hot topic so no one really noticed?

What should they be investing in to deal with the problems that they supposedly aren't at the moment?

How much is being paid to shareholders as dividends in recent years and how much (say in terms of a comparable figure, like GDP) is spent now on the water networks compared to when it was last in public ownership? Was it state of the art back then, with more than enough capacity to always be able to cope? or was it like a lot of things? running at a loss with a lack of investment like a lot of public services suffer from?

Were rivers like the Thames heavily polluted before privatisation, with little wildlife there (seeing as there have been stories in more recent years about fish, etc returning to the waters) or only after it was?

It would be nice to hear more detail rather than everyone just jumping on the latest band waggon

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

So where would that sewage go? there suddenly wouldn't be enough capacity to cope if it isn't already there now, what do you expect to happen? someone clicks their fingers and it all magically appears?

I'm sure all the water companies know it's now a major issue, and are working at solutions to limit and eventually stop these sorts of spills, but like anything, it will take time to get there (nationalised services are always crying out for funding and seen as underfunded, so not sure if it was that it would be any better than it is now)

But in the court of public opinion with what becomes the next hot topic, all the unrealistic expectations come flooding out and demands to stop something without an reasonable thought given to practicalities and how exactly it can be achieved, no thought to time scale,

It took 10 years to get our stadium, how long do you think it would take to identify and secure enough sites, creating enough capacity within them to cope with the very worst flooding, and battle against the nimby's who will oppose any new site they may try to build?

Or what's the alternative? sewage flooded homes, businesses etc? when the system can't cope?

You never hear then and now comparisons for before and after privatisation, have the water companies closed sites and got less capacity, or has it increased but a lot of new builds in the area meant there is now less capacity per house than before? were they spilling before it was privatised, but it wasn't a hot topic so no one really noticed?

What should they be investing in to deal with the problems that they supposedly aren't at the moment?

How much is being paid to shareholders as dividends in recent years and how much (say in terms of a comparable figure, like GDP) is spent now on the water networks compared to when it was last in public ownership? Was it state of the art back then, with more than enough capacity to always be able to cope? or was it like a lot of things? running at a loss with a lack of investment like a lot of public services suffer from?

Were rivers like the Thames heavily polluted before privatisation, with little wildlife there (seeing as there have been stories in more recent years about fish, etc returning to the waters) or only after it was?

It would be nice to hear more detail rather than everyone just jumping on the latest band waggon

Crikey. With this lilly-livered defeatist attitude maybe you should get a job with Southern Water….or do you already work for them?

 

[The Clamp]

Another wonderful benefit of Brexit. A few years back, the EU took several U.K. water companies to trial over their practice of dumping raw sewage into our waterways and oceans. Now there are no checks or balances. Tory = Profit over everything.

 

[Dick Knights Mumm]

If they were seriously working on a solution I’m sure we’d have heard all about it. We’ve just about the dirtiest water in Europe. Maybe we have unique problems. If so, I’m sure we’d have heard about it. This ain’t no bandwagon. The week before last the beaches were busy. People just enjoying themselves doing one of the few free things available to everyone. A bit of rain and that pleasure has been taken away. In the summer holidays. And we all knew it was coming. When it was forecast rain for the Monday my swimming friends were discussing there would be no swimming that following week. Southern Water must have it in their business plan to pay fines rather than fix the problem. That’s the disgrace.

You may throw your hands up and wonder what can be done. But the water companies will just laugh at your hand wringing and carry on. There is a long standing problem that has had plenty of time to be resolved. Here’s an idea. Resolve it.

 

[The Clamp]

So where would that sewage go? there suddenly wouldn't be enough capacity to cope if it isn't already there now, what do you expect to happen? someone clicks their fingers and it all magically appears?

I'm sure all the water companies know it's now a major issue, and are working at solutions to limit and eventually stop these sorts of spills, but like anything, it will take time to get there (nationalised services are always crying out for funding and seen as underfunded, so not sure if it was that it would be any better than it is now)

But in the court of public opinion with what becomes the next hot topic, all the unrealistic expectations come flooding out and demands to stop something without an reasonable thought given to practicalities and how exactly it can be achieved, no thought to time scale,

It took 10 years to get our stadium, how long do you think it would take to identify and secure enough sites, creating enough capacity within them to cope with the very worst flooding, and battle against the nimby's who will oppose any new site they may try to build?

Or what's the alternative? sewage flooded homes, businesses etc? when the system can't cope?

You never hear then and now comparisons for before and after privatisation, have the water companies closed sites and got less capacity, or has it increased but a lot of new builds in the area meant there is now less capacity per house than before? were they spilling before it was privatised, but it wasn't a hot topic so no one really noticed?

What should they be investing in to deal with the problems that they supposedly aren't at the moment?

How much is being paid to shareholders as dividends in recent years and how much (say in terms of a comparable figure, like GDP) is spent now on the water networks compared to when it was last in public ownership? Was it state of the art back then, with more than enough capacity to always be able to cope? or was it like a lot of things? running at a loss with a lack of investment like a lot of public services suffer from?

Were rivers like the Thames heavily polluted before privatisation, with little wildlife there (seeing as there have been stories in more recent years about fish, etc returning to the waters) or only after it was?

It would be nice to hear more detail rather than everyone just jumping on the latest band waggon

It’s not unreasonable to expect a company who’s purpose is to keep our water healthy, not to pump raw shit into our waterways and seas.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

Another wonderful benefit of Brexit. A few years back, the EU took several U.K. water companies to trial over their practice of dumping raw sewage into our waterways and oceans. Now there are no checks or balances. Tory = Profit over everything.

Re the checks and balances bit. The Environmemt Agency a few years ago had their budget cut for the checks and balances by £24m by the minister in charge. The minister ? Step forward the one and only Liz Truss !

 

[The Clamp]

Re the checks and balances bit. The Environmemt Agency a few years ago had their budget cut for the checks and balances by £24m by the minister in charge. The minister ? Step forward the one and only Liz Truss !

Yep. Saw that in the news today. Since her meddling, sewage dumps have doubled in the U.K. as a lot of that money was supposed to be used to monitor how companies dealt with such issues.

Nobody watching, nobody to make you spend money treating sewage safely, more money for shareholders.

An absolute classic case of turning a blind eye.

She is a disaster. Someone should flush her out to sea with all the other effluent.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

If they were seriously working on a solution I’m sure we’d have heard all about it. We’ve just about the dirtiest water in Europe. Maybe we have unique problems. If so, I’m sure we’d have heard about it. This ain’t no bandwagon. The week before last the beaches were busy. People just enjoying themselves doing one of the few free things available to everyone. A bit of rain and that pleasure has been taken away. In the summer holidays. And we all knew it was coming. When it was forecast rain for the Monday my swimming friends were discussing there would be no swimming that following week. Southern Water must have it in their business plan to pay fines rather than fix the problem. That’s the disgrace.

You may throw your hands up and wonder what can be done. But the water companies will just laugh at your hand wringing and carry on. There is a long standing problem that has had plenty of time to be resolved. Here’s an idea. Resolve it.

This seems to be an issue unique to the UK. Certain types blather on about how little can be done but other countries don’t seem to be going medieval when it comes to sewage; how do other countries deal with it especially land locked ones?

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

So where would that sewage go? there suddenly wouldn't be enough capacity to cope if it isn't already there now, what do you expect to happen? someone clicks their fingers and it all magically appears?

I'm sure all the water companies know it's now a major issue, and are working at solutions to limit and eventually stop these sorts of spills, but like anything, it will take time to get there (nationalised services are always crying out for funding and seen as underfunded, so not sure if it was that it would be any better than it is now)

But in the court of public opinion with what becomes the next hot topic, all the unrealistic expectations come flooding out and demands to stop something without an reasonable thought given to practicalities and how exactly it can be achieved, no thought to time scale,

It took 10 years to get our stadium, how long do you think it would take to identify and secure enough sites, creating enough capacity within them to cope with the very worst flooding, and battle against the nimby's who will oppose any new site they may try to build?

Or what's the alternative? sewage flooded homes, businesses etc? when the system can't cope?

You never hear then and now comparisons for before and after privatisation, have the water companies closed sites and got less capacity, or has it increased but a lot of new builds in the area meant there is now less capacity per house than before? were they spilling before it was privatised, but it wasn't a hot topic so no one really noticed?

What should they be investing in to deal with the problems that they supposedly aren't at the moment?

How much is being paid to shareholders as dividends in recent years and how much (say in terms of a comparable figure, like GDP) is spent now on the water networks compared to when it was last in public ownership? Was it state of the art back then, with more than enough capacity to always be able to cope? or was it like a lot of things? running at a loss with a lack of investment like a lot of public services suffer from?

Were rivers like the Thames heavily polluted before privatisation, with little wildlife there (seeing as there have been stories in more recent years about fish, etc returning to the waters) or only after it was?

It would be nice to hear more detail rather than everyone just jumping on the latest band waggon

On reflection, you are as much part of the problem as the water companies. Sorry to say this.

 

[BrightonCottager]

This seems to be an issue unique to the UK. Certain types blather on about how little can be done but other countries don’t seem to be going medieval when it comes to sewage; how do other countries deal with it especially land locked ones?

No other country in Europe has privatised its water industry in the same way as we have and general taxation is used to spread the cost along with wider water metering. Per capita water use is also often lower. Prof Dieter Helm was on BBC R4's The Briefing Room last week talking about the drought and skewered the English and Welsh privatisation model.

The answer won't be easy, involving more investment and a lot of retrofit to reduce the amount of rain going into the sewers but people have known this for decades and water companies have done nothing except maximise profits, the regulators have been cut and told to do light touch regulation (EA) or concentrate on cutting bills (OFWAT, until a couple of years ago when it woke up).

By the way, the public can play their part by not tarmacing front gardens that increases the amount of run off.