Second test match - England vs South Africa @ Headingly Carnegie

[BensGrandad]

Cannot see many changes for the next test as in agreement with most on here Prior is not good enough behind the stumps and I do not think that he is good enough to get in as a batsman, well he is no better than the batsmen that we have available, many of whom are potentially better than him but just need to apply themselves.

 

[Papa Lazarou]

Selfishly, I'd prefer the selectors to leave Prior at Sussex, as our line up has been mucked around too much already this season; but he is sooo much better as a batsman than any of the other keepers. The problem is, as with Geriant Jones, people will be waiting for him to make a mistake, and analysing everything he does.

Jones (S) is worth a go - he's bowling quick, getting swing both ways and is currently fit. What else do you want from him?

 

[Scoffers]

Prior is the leading first class run scorer (source: me scouring Cricinfo) and his batting average of a shade under 50 is vastly superior to Foster.

So replace Pattinson with Siders and Ambrose with Prior and win the third test.

 

[hans kraay fan club]

Cannot see many changes for the next test as in agreement with most on here Prior is not good enough behind the stumps and I do not think that he is good enough to get in as a batsman, well he is no better than the batsmen that we have available, many of whom are potentially better than him but just need to apply themselves.

Fair enough. If its all about talent, and there's no need to consider application, lets go the whole hog and recall Hick and Ramps...

 

[Silent Bob]

Simon Jones is doing great, but he's bowled less overs than many of the other possible bowlers. He's been treated carefully and rightly so. But if you recall him now then you would have two short spell bowlers in him and Flintoff. I'm not sure now is the right time to bring back Jones.

 

[CHAPPERS]

Whatever.

You say that, but he should be well ahead of Pattinson or Tremlett in the pecking order. Or Harmison for that matter.

On current form I'd still play Harmison over Jones, what are you basing that on?

(Whilst remembering that Jones is playing Div 2 cricket...)

 

[Uncle Buck]

I do think Broad has caused an issue. For all his good work with the bat, with the ball he looks short of test standard at present. At the end of the day, what is the point of playing him over say Collingwood?

Ideally England need a 5 man attack, but they also need to avoid having a long tail, which is where you come back to Broad.

Also it is a shame Trescothick is no longer available. Watching him on Sunday reminded me how much England miss him, an attacking opener.

 

[Silent Bob]

I do think Broad has caused an issue. For all his good work with the bat, with the ball he looks short of test standard at present. At the end of the day, what is the point of playing him over say Collingwood?

Ideally England need a 5 man attack, but they also need to avoid having a long tail, which is where you come back to Broad.

It's not really Broad that has caused this though, it is the fact none of the other bowlers can bat (and the top order are unreliable). I thought he just looked tired in this test, I'm sure his bowling will improve over the next couple of years and I think he is definitely worth persisting with in the test side for a while yet.

 

[keaton]

While i don't think Broad's done brilliantly with the ball his record is apparently very similiar to Glenn McGrath after the same amount of matches. He's tired but he has a slight rest now and i think if you're going to have a five man attack with one of them Flintoff then another needs to bat.
He's also averaging 80 this series with the bat so i think it's worth keeping him in for that alone, if we're gonna persist with Ambrose and Vaughan

 

[Uncle Buck]

It's not really Broad that has caused this though, it is the fact none of the other bowlers can bat (and the top order are unreliable). I thought he just looked tired in this test, I'm sure his bowling will improve over the next couple of years and I think he is definitely worth persisting with in the test side for a while yet.

I think he is a prospect, but like Anderson before him, he has almost been rushed in. The fact he fills the Giles slot at 8 means the selectors will persist with him, but his bowling is not there at present.

 

[hans kraay fan club]

I think he is a prospect, but like Anderson before him, he has almost been rushed in. The fact he fills the Giles slot at 8 means the selectors will persist with him, but his bowling is not there at present.

I understand exactly what you are saying, but interestingly, if he had been batting at 7, and theoretically included as a batting all-rounder, everyone would be very pleased with his contribution! He has made good runs, and he would be a more than useful FIFTH bowler....

 

[Uncle Buck]

I understand exactly what you are saying, but interestingly, if he had been batting at 7, and theoretically included as a batting all-rounder, everyone would be very pleased with his contribution! He has made good runs, and he would be a more than useful FIFTH bowler....

Which is fine if you get the other quickies correct.

They were saying on TMS last night that the bowlers South Africa fear most are the 3 that we did not pick for the first test. Hoggard took them apart in South Africa.

 

[CHAPPERS]

Which is fine if you get the other quickies correct.

They were saying on TMS last night that the bowlers South Africa fear most are the 3 that we did not pick for the first test. Hoggard took them apart in South Africa.

Yup, they showed that on Sky the other day, took a load of wickets in the deciding test (final one was a draw), 12 it was actually, with 7/61 in the second innings.

 

[simmo]

Which is fine if you get the other quickies correct.

They were saying on TMS last night that the bowlers South Africa fear most are the 3 that we did not pick for the first test. Hoggard took them apart in South Africa.

I think sadly for Hoggard his test career is over. Vaughan will have seen what he is like at county level and Vaughan will have had a say on the Pattinson selection. If Hoggard can't get in on his home ground above Pattinson when is he going to play? I hope not, he is/was a great bowler.

I wonder if that is the same with Harmison, basically because of his home sickness he is almost unpickable for overseas tours, so just how useful is he. Considering the Ashes are at home next time though the selectors in my opinion should only really rule him out after the summer of 2009 for good.

A fit Simon Jones is a shoe in, because after 40 overs he is the main man in any seam attack because of his reverse swing. He has had over 2.5 years out though and we don't want to rush him back only for him to break down for good.

As for the keeper, I hope for Sussex sake they don't pick Prior, but I think they might, because we look very short of runs at the moment as a team.

 

[Uncle Buck]

I think sadly for Hoggard his test career is over. Vaughan will have seen what he is like at county level and Vaughan will have had a say on the Pattinson selection. If Hoggard can't get in on his home ground above Pattinson when is he going to play? I hope not, he is/was a great bowler.

I wonder if that is the same with Harmison, basically because of his home sickness he is almost unpickable for overseas tours, so just how useful is he. Considering the Ashes are at home next time though the selectors in my opinion should only really rule him out after the summer of 2009 for good.

A fit Simon Jones is a shoe in, because after 40 overs he is the main man in any seam attack because of his reverse swing. He has had over 2.5 years out though and we don't want to rush him back only for him to break down for good.

As for the keeper, I hope for Sussex sake they don't pick Prior, but I think they might, because we look very short of runs at the moment as a team.

Hoggard I sort of agree with you. I think they can only pick one of him or Sidebottom, but at present Sidebottom (when fit in the main in possession). Regarding Harmison, I think he will be back. At present it seems that Moores has the hump with him, as he was so out of sorts in New Zealand, but he is in form now, we have a Windies series (his bunnies) for him to get his eye in and then it is the Ashes (nice if it works!!!).

Jones, well if he can stay fit is an option, but at present he should play for Worcs this summer and if he lasts the season, then take him to India and the Windies.

Wicket keeper wise, I expect Prior to be back, simply as he could bat at 6, so the side looks a tad more balanced. Read is still the best keeper and it would amuse me if we picked him for the India tour, simply because he played in the ICL and it would really piss the India Cricket Board off.

One positive since Gibson has become bowling coach has been the improvement in Anderson.

 

[simmo]

Hoggard I sort of agree with you. I think they can only pick one of him or Sidebottom, but at present Sidebottom (when fit in the main in possession). Regarding Harmison, I think he will be back. At present it seems that Moores has the hump with him, as he was so out of sorts in New Zealand, but he is in form now, we have a Windies series (his bunnies) for him to get his eye in and then it is the Ashes (nice if it works!!!).

Jones, well if he can stay fit is an option, but at present he should play for Worcs this summer and if he lasts the season, then take him to India and the Windies.

Wicket keeper wise, I expect Prior to be back, simply as he could bat at 6, so the side looks a tad more balanced. Read is still the best keeper and it would amuse me if we picked him for the India tour, simply because he played in the ICL and it would really piss the India Cricket Board off.

One positive since Gibson has become bowling coach has been the improvement in Anderson.

That Ashes 2005 bowling line up was awesome Hoggard, Jones, Flintoff and Harmison (swap Monty for Giles and you have all bases covered). I can remember seeing their stats at the time and all of them in 2005 were between 26 to 28, while McGrath, Warne and Gillespie were around 35+. I thought we were going to dominate cricket and become as commanding as the Aussies. Yet the Aussies minus these still thrash all before them and we do not, Where did it all go wrong?

 

[Uncle Buck]

That Ashes 2005 bowling line up was awesome Hoggard, Jones, Flintoff and Harmison (swap Monty for Giles and you have all bases covered). I can remember seeing their stats at the time and all of them in 2005 were between 26 to 28, while McGrath, Warne and Gillespie were around 35+. I thought we were going to dominate cricket and become as commanding as the Aussies. Yet the Aussies minus these still thrash all before them and we do not, Where did it all go wrong?

I think it went wrong on the one hand that none of the bowlers are ever fit together, too many of the players lived off the success of that series and we lost Vaughan to injury and Trescothick has had his problems.

I would say now, that if England can select a balance team, with the correct fast bowlers, next summer will be closer than some of the doom merchants are predicting. I think we will see the weakest Aussie side in years to come over here, but England are not picking their strongest side.

 

[CHAPPERS]

Why is Simon Jones not playing for Worcestershire today?

 

[Seagull over NZ]

Why is Simon Jones not playing for Worcestershire today?

I noticed that - Worcs website says he was in the 12 but no mention of why he isn't playing.

 

[Seagull over NZ]

Just found this - rested apparently. AT least someone is looking after him, whether thats the county or the ECB I'm not sure.

http://www.worcesternews.co.uk/sport/wccc/3222679.Jones_rested_as_Worcs_eye_follow_up_win/