[Politics] Russia invades Ukraine (24/02/2022)

[Eric the meek]

They will keep lying (I know you know). Their press will lie for them. Most Russians will probably believe the lie. Those that don't will probably pretend they believe it. The relatives of the murdered aircrew will go on TV to denounce evil Ukraine and western weapons, and beg more volunteers to join their army.

Raymondo, see my answer to Triggaaar.

I think we are a way away from that watershed moment. I predict that the lies and deceit are first going to get even worse.

 

[Triggaaar]

When people stop being politically correct in Russia, we will know the end of the war and the regime are in sight.

The war could go on for years, but it will end well before the Russian's stop lying. It's in their DNA, they don't know how else to be.

 

[essbee1]

The war could go on for years, but it will end well before the Russian's stop lying. It's in their DNA, they don't know how else to be.

And why they will always be a country that treats its citizens like shit and cares nothing for anything or anyone
but the elite. And will remain a backward country.

 

[Triggaaar]

And why they will always be a country that treats its citizens like shit and cares nothing for anything or anyone
but the elite. And will remain a backward country.

That's certainly the short and maybe medium term prospects, but always? Not necessarily.

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

That's certainly the short and maybe medium term prospects, but always? Not necessarily.

I agree.

A country can always turn it around. Mass brainwashing can be undone in actually quite a short space of time. Germany and Japan obvious examples of countries which carried out acts of mass barbarity with the consent of at least enough of it's citizens and army who very soon started to recognise that international norms were a better path than mass murder.

Though it takes cataclysms on that scale for this to happen. Russia must be defeated decisively or they will continue to be a malignant influence on the world for decades

 

[Eric the meek]

It's becoming increasingly difficult to get information out of Russia.

According to Konstantin Samoilov, a new decree is under consideration, to make it illegal for Russians to film or share information about Ukrainian drone attacks.

 

[Eric the meek]

It's looking more and more like the Russian version of the plane crash was fabricated.

A Jake Broe video features Margarita Simonyan (of Russian state TV propaganda) listing the names of the 65 Ukrainian POWs that Russia alleges were killed when the cargo plane was shot down.

Broe says that 17 of those names, are the names of Ukrainian POWs who were previously released in a POW swap with Russia. So the list is nonsense.

 

[raymondo]

It's becoming increasingly difficult to get information out of Russia.

According to Konstantin Samoilov, a new decree is under consideration, to make it illegal for Russians to film or share information about Ukrainian drone attacks.

That in itself tells us they are seriously concerned about these attacks

 

[The Clamp]

It's looking more and more like the Russian version of the plane crash was fabricated.

A Jake Broe video features Margarita Simonyan (of Russian state TV propaganda) listing the names of the 65 Ukrainian POWs that Russia alleges were killed when the cargo plane was shot down.

Broe says that 17 of those names, are the names of Ukrainian POWs who were previously released in a POW swap with Russia. So the list is nonsense.

Of course it’s fabricated. Any piece of information from Russia to the West is marinaded in propaganda and lies before being served up in a carvery of bullshit.

 

[raymondo]

I agree.

A country can always turn it around. Mass brainwashing can be undone in actually quite a short space of time. Germany and Japan obvious examples of countries which carried out acts of mass barbarity with the consent of at least enough of it's citizens and army who very soon started to recognise that international norms were a better path than mass murder.

Though it takes cataclysms on that scale for this to happen. Russia must be defeated decisively or they will continue to be a malignant influence on the world for decades

Certainly Russia will have a different shape to it after this war (if it ever ends...). I watched on one video commentator (thanks to @Eric the meek ) that he is sure the main reason for Russia's invasion timing was because of their current population structure: a rapidly declining birth rate means that this was their last chance to mobilize sufficient men of fighting age to throw into the meat grinder.
After this war they'll have killed many of those, many others have left the country (probably never to return), and I can't imagine the birth rate increasing in a hurry.

 

[Eric the meek]

Certainly Russia will have a different shape to it after this war (if it ever ends...). I watched on one video commentator (thanks to @Eric the meek ) that he is sure the main reason for Russia's invasion timing was because of their current population structure: a rapidly declining birth rate means that this was their last chance to mobilize sufficient men of fighting age to throw into the meat grinder.
After this war they'll have killed many of those, many others have left the country (probably never to return), and I can't imagine the birth rate increasing in a hurry.

I think it was Peter Zeihan who first alerted me to the demographic nightmare engulfing Russia. I recall Putin recently calling for Russian women to have 8 children or more.

Things are clearly happening rapidly in Russia, with some desperate measures (decrees banning the filming of drone strikes, potentially false accounts of Ukraine shooting down plane loads of POWs, the utilities industry collapsing, incl. Vladivostok in the far east, Putin secretly asking US for talks on ending war) etc. And I haven't even mentioned the Russian economy. Interesting times.

 

[raymondo]

I think it was Peter Zeihan who first alerted me to the demographic nightmare engulfing Russia. I recall Putin recently calling for Russian women to have 8 children or more.

Things are clearly happening rapidly in Russia, with some desperate measures (decrees banning the filming of drone strikes, potentially false accounts of Ukraine shooting down plane loads of POWs, the utilities industry collapsing, incl. Vladivostok in the far east, Putin secretly asking US for talks on ending war) etc. And I haven't even mentioned the Russian economy. Interesting times.

Yes, it was the Zeihan video...and very interesting it was too, thanks!
Thousands of Russian citizens are having just as hard a winter as Ukrainians, thanks to their own infrastructure problems

 

[Eric the meek]

A couple of articles about drones:

First, a round-up of recent history - drone attacks by Ukraine inside Russia.

Ukraine levels up the fight with drone strikes deep into Russia

Unable to match Putin’s military might, Ukraine is engaging in ‘smart warfare’ to attack the enemy’s oil and gas supply lines

www.theguardian.com

Next, a glimpse into the future - a Russian soldier recounts FPV assault with 'flock of drones' led by 'queen'.

Russian soldier recounts FPV assault with "flock of drones" led by "queen"

The "queen" drone stayed at a high altitude and brought a flock of drones to Russian positions, a soldier recounted.

www.newsweek.com

 

[raymondo]

A couple of articles about drones:

First, a round-up of recent history - drone attacks by Ukraine inside Russia.

Ukraine levels up the fight with drone strikes deep into Russia

Unable to match Putin’s military might, Ukraine is engaging in ‘smart warfare’ to attack the enemy’s oil and gas supply lines

www.theguardian.com

Next, a glimpse into the future - a Russian soldier recounts FPV assault with 'flock of drones' led by 'queen'.

Russian soldier recounts FPV assault with "flock of drones" led by "queen"

The "queen" drone stayed at a high altitude and brought a flock of drones to Russian positions, a soldier recounted.

www.newsweek.com

Yes, interesting stuff, and Ukraine took out a number of Russian drone pilots at a training location

 

[Eric the meek]

Heads up on a documentary series beginning on BBC2 tonight at 9pm - Putin vs the west.

First episode - the annexation of Crimea in 2014.

 

[Eric the meek]

Heads up on a documentary series beginning on BBC2 tonight at 9pm - Putin vs the west.

First episode - the annexation of Crimea in 2014.

Ignore the bit about annexation of Crimea - it wasn't about that. Instead, it was about the first few weeks of the war, and the political background.

 

[timbha]

Ignore the bit about annexation of Crimea - it wasn't about that. Instead, it was about the first few weeks of the war, and the political background.

A timely reminder

 

[seagullwedgee]

A superb one hour summary. Zelensky is an incredible human being. The West has dithered. Needs to pile in right now.

 

[Albion in the north]

Got back from our trip to the orphanage in the early hours of sunday morning. Pretty intense week, a bit of an emotional rollercoaster with some incredibly lovely and appreciative people. Flew to Rzeszow in Poland then a 9 hour overland trip, crossing the border at around 3 in the morning. Great welcome and a concert held in our "honour". Lots of donations for the children for which they were all grateful, especially the powerbanks and toiletries, partly funded by the wonderful people of NSC. 5 air alarms which meant a few hours spent with the kids underground, singing and playing Uno. Did a quiz on English football and the Ukrainians that have played or are stil playing in England. Played Volleyball with some of them, my 58yo knees didnt thank me for that. Taught them to cook apple crumble and was then treated to an amazing tea party with the students. Another cultural quiz about the Uk, a tour of the college, taken to watch the Philharmonic Orchestra one night and pretty much treated like royalty. One of the students said that others had visited before but no one had actually interacted with the students before. Other trips and projects with them will be discussed but one of the things I am keen to work on is getting them an outdoor sports area. Currently in disrepair and in need of a new all weather covering. Ive attached some images and if anyone has questions Ill answer when I can. Thanks all.

 

[raymondo]

Brilliant stuff, I loved reading that and seeing the pics . I'm sure your visit has given the children a new perspective and some different things for them to discuss! No doubt they are all Seagulls fans now!
If you decide to raise money to fund the outdoor play area... don't be shy to ask nsc for help... I feel sure you'll get some.
Congratulations again .