[Politics] Russia invades Ukraine (24/02/2022)

[raymondo]

Zelensky said yesterday, there will be no legal recognition or legal relinguishing of Ukrainian lands, he also said theyll be no weakening of constitution or forced elections.

I missed that from Zelenskiy - it was separate from the message to Trump n co then

 

[sully]

I still haven’t seen anything regarding what Trump is expecting of Russia in his peace plan. Is he saying anything about that at all?
What coercion is he applying to Russia to stop the killing?
I can’t believe he’s not being challenged on this by anyone.

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

I still haven’t seen anything regarding what Trump is expecting of Russia in his peace plan. Is he saying anything about that at all?
What coercion is he applying to Russia to stop the killing?
I can’t believe he’s not being challenged on this by anyone.

He has given most bargaining chips away every time his lips move. If or now when the mineral deal is signed only then will we begin to find out what a shitshow of a deal Ukraine will be driven to agree too.

 

[sully]

He has given most bargaining chips away every time his lips move. If or now when the mineral deal is signed only then will we begin to find out what a shitshow of a deal Ukraine will be driven to agree too.

I just don’t understand why nobody is challenging him on this. Not any of the European politicians, none of the media, just nobody. It’s utterly bizarre.

 

[Hugo Rune]

US curbs intelligence sharing with Ukraine – Europe live

CIA director indicates move is temporary and limited in scope in order to force sides back to negotiations

www.theguardian.com

Absolutely horrific.

Taking a lot of their ability away to defend themselves is unforgivable.

The optimist in me hopes that this is just ‘words’ and ‘propoganda’ for Russian consumption and that in reality, nothing has changed but that’s wildly hopeful and unrealistic.

 

[Triggaaar]

After recently demanding that the Gulf of Mexico be renamed the Gulf of America, Trump has now stated that it should be known as the Gulf of Russia.

 

[Triggaaar]

Why don’t they just invite the Russians into the Pentagon and go all in!!

I think it's safe to assume that the Russians are already in the Pentagon, given that they're in the White House.

 

[Nobby]

Russian warship tracked near British waters by Royal Navy

The Russian warship had been escorting a cargo ship on its voyage from Syria through the English Channel and North Sea.

www.bbc.co.uk

See now if I was in authority maybe just sink it and say it wasn’t us. It’s what Russia does.
Probably best I’m not

 

[Flounce]

And what will they do to force Russia to negotiate?
Ahh... Ukraine gets the stick and Russia will get the carrot.

Quite, screw Ukraine over which only helps Russia. Only designed to force and intimidate Zelensky. Nothing detrimental to the Russians, in fact the complete opposite. Trump is looking like a Russian asset to me

 

[portlock seagull]

It's not semantics whatsoever - by saying "a majority of the american people" most would assume you were suggesting most Americans like Trump, when the hard facts tell us the truth is absolutely nowhere near that.

It’s semantics depending on your pov, and happens to be mine. It’s also shorthand in a conversation such as this. You know very well what’s meant by. But more importantly in context of conversation the majority of people who care to influence (see how much ink that takes!) back Trump. Or are we now going to argue they don’t they back Republican Party and that’s also different…?

 

[peterward]

I missed that from Zelenskiy - it was separate from the message to Trump n co then

At the end if this, around 3:20 but worth a listen to all.

 

[portlock seagull]

More or less, yes. I wouldn't necessarily class her as a thicko, but certainly easily pursuaded.

Remember 20+ years ago when you used to get well-meaning emails forwarded to you warning you of various elaborate but easily-disprovable scams, and then when Facebook became popular similar people would similar share hoaxes as well as stuff about people going to your local park and putting nails in dog food or other sorts of nasty deeds? This was failry harmless, but then I reckon that more sinister operators saw how easily people would believe stuff and started using it in political campaigns.

Politics has always exploited the gullible. Free press essential to counter lies. Today’s world is unprecedented because of the internet and AI. Our brains are behind the times essentially and very easily manipulated by technology. Techniques are same, it’s the means that’s an altogether whole new ball game. Uncharted waters as they say!

 

[raymondo]

He has given most bargaining chips away every time his lips move. If or now when the mineral deal is signed only then will we begin to find out what a shitshow of a deal Ukraine will be driven to agree too.

Then the

Quite, screw Ukraine over which only helps Russia. Only designed to force and intimidate Zelensky. Nothing detrimental to the Russians, in fact the complete opposite. Trump is looking like a Russian asset to me

That's how they all look, unless it's some Masterplan of negotiation
If the next meeting is partly held in front of the media in the White House, I'm expecting a similar shit show of intimidation.

 

[raymondo]

At the end if this, around 3:20 but worth a listen to all.

Thank you, I'll listen fully this evening.

 

[portlock seagull]

Ok, going to bow out of this thread again for a while. Eating up too much time, it’s all very worrying and not going to get better anytime soon, so for own sanity…

 

[Flounce]

…

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

Then the

That's how they all look, unless it's some Masterplan of negotiation
If the next meeting is partly held in front of the media in the White House, I'm expecting a similar shit show of intimidation.

He needs us and France with him. A united front.

 

[Nobby]

At the end if this, around 3:20 but worth a listen to all.

Slava Ukraini

 

[raymondo]

He has given most bargaining chips away every time his lips move. If or now when the mineral deal is signed only then will we begin to find out what a shitshow of a deal Ukraine will be driven to agree too.

I didn't reply properly before...yes, I'm expecting a shit show. I can't imagine Trump is suddenly going to pivot and support Ukraine.
I expect Trump to denounce Zelenskiy at some point again ' he's not serious about peace, he won't stand down, he won't relinquish fully the part occupied states. I mean, Russia has lost thousands of soldiers, they've earned the right to increase their prize '
I hope to goodness that I'm wrong

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

I didn't reply properly before...yes, I'm expecting a shit show. I can't imagine Trump is suddenly going to pivot and support Ukraine.
I expect Trump to denounce Zelenskiy at some point again ' he's not serious about peace, he won't stand down, he won't relinquish fully the part occupied states. I mean, Russia has lost thousands of soldiers, they've earned the right to increase their prize '
I hope to goodness that I'm wrong

Sadly I think you're right. Whenever he talks about the invasion he always says Russia has lost a lot of men, then mentions Ukraine. He never mentions the fact Putin has used prisioners sending them to the front to die and recently N Korea young men. Putin ad Trump are f***ing evil wankers.