[Football] Potter [NOT] at Chelsea

[schmunk]

Sounds like a highly improbable clause, never heard of such a thing sounds like it would be illegal.

Not at all, it's a fairly normal clause in a termination agreement to require the (former) employee to take reasonable steps to mitigate the losses from a wrongful termination, in the same way as most other commercial contracts.

This article from a very reputable source, whilst paywalled, gives enough of a flavour in the visible paragraphs: https://www.lexisnexis.co.uk/legal/guidance/wrongful-dismissal-mitigation

 

[The Wizard]

Not at all, it's a fairly normal clause in a termination agreement to require the (former) employee to take reasonable steps to mitigate the losses from a wrongful termination, in the same way as most other commercial contracts.

This article from a very reputable source, whilst paywalled, gives enough of a flavour in the visible paragraphs: https://www.lexisnexis.co.uk/legal/guidance/wrongful-dismissal-mitigation

If you sack the manager: how can you stop them going into management for 4 years after you have sacked them?

Unless I’m misunderstanding, in footballing terms I have never seen any clause like that, never even seen one mentioned.

 

[BNthree]

If you sack the manager: how can you stop them going into management for 4 years after you have sacked them?

Unless I’m misunderstanding, in footballing terms I have never seen any clause like that, never even seen one mentioned.

Read something online before about clause in a manager's contract saying it can be terminated without compensation if they don't meet certain targets. Meaning the manager could be sacked if they were crap without paying up loads of cash. Obviously not all contracts will include such a clause but it is not unheard of. Obviously once they're sacked they can go work for whoever.

 

[Sarisbury Seagull]

I think it is fairly likely he'll have a break regardless what his contract says. He's been in a job for 12 years now without any breaks (or sackings as it is also called), which is basically unheard of these days. Its a 16 hour per day job really, I imagine he must be quite exhausted.

Could see him taking a break for 6-18 months and then taking over some mid-sized PL club. He isn't going to move to Wales and work for the asset strippers again, that much is clear.

You know who the perfect mid sized PL club would likely be at that point don’t you?!

As much as some don’t like it and it’s highly unlikely to happen, Potter and Brighton is a great match for both parties.

 

[schmunk]

If you sack the manager: how can you stop them going into management for 4 years after you have sacked them?

Unless I’m misunderstanding, in footballing terms I have never seen any clause like that, never even seen one mentioned.

Employment contracts (and subsequently termination agreements) can (and in certain industries / seniority levels often do) contain "non-compete" clauses which prevent terminated employees from working for competitors for a stated period. 4 years is far too long, though, that would not be enforceable - they have to be reasonably tightly defined and for a reasonable period, most usually 6 months and almost never more than 12 months.v

I (and I expect you) have no practical experience of how these are applied in football management contracts however, and it's fairly likely that they are very little used or enforced as otherwise it will make future recruitment more difficult - many managers would not want to be tied in like this.

That said, this is not what I was talking about - the suggestion is that if Graham Potter was sacked with 4 years of his contract left he would be entitled to full payment of the remaining 4 years of the contract. In practice this is likely to be mitigated firstly by various clauses in the employment contract specifying maximum periods/payments under several different "for cause" situations, and also then this particular point that if Potter was to obtain a new employment within this period he would be deemed to have mitigated his losses from the termination of his Chelsea employment, which restricts the level of "damages" caused by the termination.

 

[Acker79]

Paywalled. Essentially, they know what is going on behind the scenes, planned for ups and downs, and he took a chance leaving a stable job mid-season.

 

[Hamilton]

Paywalled. Essentially, they know what is going on behind the scenes, planned for ups and downs, and he took a chance leaving a stable job mid-season.

Just read it. It's well written, although I question whether Todd Boehly watching Potter undertake training at Cobham is going to leave him any the wiser.

It all makes sense, but there are limits, and if Potter can't win some games soon then he'll have to go.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

These long runs are odd but you can not deny they are consistent across each of his three Premier League seasons, periods of 10-15 games were results are good followed by 10-15 games were results are poor.

I think it is normal for a 'team like Brighton' to have these inconsistent periods but for a team that cost several hundred million to assemble...

We’re a mid-table team…mid-table teams do have runs and periods like the ones we had last season….it’s what mid-table teams do. If we won all the time we’d be top, and bottom if we lost all the time.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

I must admit I was never 100 percent sold on the Potter hype, whilst seeing he had done a decent job in switching the style of play at Brighton completely.

Always felt the long periods without a win would be a problem at a club like Chelsea.

What has done for him more than his dire form at Chelsea is how well Brighton have done with out him with the supposed goal scoring issues in the past, with the odd exception and players like March kicking on to a higher level.

Spurs v Chelsea on Sunday, that's normally 3 points for Chelsea, lose that and I think he could go.

 

[deletebeepbeepbeep]

I know they've got one more game to play, but it's time for Chelsea's February goal of the month competition. Which one would you choose?

Funny but why can't we have a defence switch off like that against us. We always have to work for it

Hopefully Wet Sham are as useless in 2 weeks.

 

[Paulie Gualtieri]

Just read it. It's well written, although I question whether Todd Boehly watching Potter undertake training at Cobham is going to leave him any the wiser.

It all makes sense, but there are limits, and if Potter can't win some games soon then he'll have to go.

Hey Gra-ham in the states we shout “De-Fence” to get a tune out of them, what do you think

 

[GT49er]

But the fact that so many on here continue to be obsessed with his failures at Chelsea suggests that we all very much cared when he left; if he was average then we would have shrugged our shoulders and moved on. There was a real feeling of dread when he left (before RDZ was appointed) - because so many recognised what a good thing we had with him. Even if some are pretending that wasn't the case now.

Yep - I think they're the ones that accuse the rest of us of being cults .............. something like that anyway!

 

[Hiheidi]

Interesting that the Telegraph piece highlights one of the reasons to give Potter more time is the significance of the Paul Winstanley / Potter partnership, and how well they worked together at Brighton.

I wonder how much of it was those two working on recruitment together, and how was much Tony Bloom's influence in finding gems? Another possible shortcoming to be found out in time?

 

[GT49er]

These long runs are odd but you can not deny they are consistent across each of his three Premier League seasons, periods of 10-15 games were results are good followed by 10-15 games were results are poor.

Consistent runs of good followed by runs of bad was what got Joseph the top job from the king of Egypt, so ..............

Funny but why can't we have a defence switch off like that against us. We always have to work for it
Hopefully Wet Sham are as useless in 2 weeks.

New manager bounce??

 

[Icy Gull]

Yep - I think they're the ones that accuse the rest of us of being cults .............. something like that anyway!

They are, makes their constant whinging during his tenure hold water…in their heads. Some people can’t take not being right and Potter’s woes at Chelsea are like manna from heaven

 

[Swansman]

You know who the perfect mid sized PL club would likely be at that point don’t you?!

As much as some don’t like it and it’s highly unlikely to happen, Potter and Brighton is a great match for both parties.

Indeed. It can never be ruled out. Obviously it is unlikely to happen in the short term because of the upwind that would come from recent events, but I'd hardly find it shocking to see Graham coaching Brighton in ten years time or so. Lots can happen to both him and Brighton, impossible to predict. And sure some would be opposed to appointing him if the time and situation is the right one for TB to make a decision like that, but TB knows football... good results and good football and everything bad will be forgotten quite quickly.

 

[Icy Gull]

Indeed. It can never be ruled out. Obviously it is unlikely to happen in the short term because of the upwind that would come from recent events, but I'd hardly find it shocking to see Graham coaching Brighton in ten years time or so. Lots can happen to both him and Brighton, impossible to predict. And sure some would be opposed to appointing him if the time and situation is the right one for TB to make a decision like that, but TB knows football... good results and good football and everything bad will be forgotten quite quickly.

Apart from the manner of his departure and ****ish comments about us since, he was brilliant for us. I think it would be quite toxic unless he hit the ground running if he did return, even in 10 years.

Even an ex cult member like me might struggle with it

 

[Blues Guitarist]

It was a cheeky, slightly misleading headline given the actual quote, but amusing all the same (they played Albion a few days later)...

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I was at that game, which featured Bernardo playing for Salzburg. The two Chelsea goals were indeed stunning, but apart from that Salzburg more than matched them. Chelsea had most of the ball, but spent lots of time passing back and forth in front of their own penalty area. The shot count was 16-15 to Salzburg, and the corner count 9-2 to Salzburg. Potter should have realised that his team was less than the sum of their parts.

 

[GT49er]

Paywalled. Essentially, they know what is going on behind the scenes, planned for ups and downs, and he took a chance leaving a stable job mid-season.

Doesn't appear to be paywalled now. Excellent article.

 

[The Fits]

His biggest problem is fairly obvious and ultimately it was his biggest problem here. He can't get teams scoring consistently. It's almost comedic. They had so many chances in the second half against Saints. I genuinely think it's about the quality of chances. I think that is the difference with RDZ and what we've missed in the last few games. When our RDZ team gets it right it's almost impossible not to score because the opposition is absolutely run ragged. That's about immense organisation throughout the thirds, it's about serious work on the training ground. And it's about individual players understanding their roles and having a chance to build some confidence by playing in them. I suspect it's as simple as that. He has a bit of a blind spot when it comes to the final third and a massive blind spot when it comes to the value of knowing your best team and giving players the chance to find some form.
Maybe training lacks a focus on it. Maybe they simply don't have the ideas. Then players lose confidence because they don't fully understand what they are doing. And when they lose confidence they end up fluffing even the decent chances. And so it continues. Lack of attacking confidence from manager and staff= lack of confidence when in attack=lack of confidence in front of goal ad infinitum.
March is the obvious example. He knows what he is doing now. He knows where he is playing. He is confident because he totally understands his attacking role and because he's been allowed the time (by being picked consistently in one position) to discover some form and self belief. It's not rocket science and feels like GP is really making a total hash of things. Playing Mount on the wing when you have a team of world class wingers is total lols.