[Politics] May 2021 local elections and Hartlepool by-election

[Curious Orange]

Construction in recession.(https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp....-brace-for-recession-risk-eu-workers-leave-uk)

I suspect the current picture on this one is somewhat different now than it was in 2019. A lot of houses are being extended or having alterations around our way. The builders who are working on our extension say they have enough work booked for the next year and are actively avoiding doing quotations for new business. Demand for materials is such that the lead times for some things like windows and cement is now much longer than usual.

 

[attila]

Congratulations to Mrs. Robina Baine - First ever Labour Councillor* for Southwick Green on a 20% swing
*apart from a Lib Dem defector 30 years ago

 

[stewart12]

think people are slightly guilty of assuming that Labour have "lost" the working class vote. It's true that in SOME working class communities they have lost seats but look at places like Manchester, Newcastle, Sheffield, Leeds, Liverpool, Birmingham and London- all cities with large working class communities with Labour still dominating. The key difference between say, Newcastle and Hartlepool is that the lower income voters are on average younger, have a larger amount of exposure to other cultures, and it's mixed in with students, young professionals etc but actually a lot of the issues faced are similar- job prospects, housing, putting food on your table etc. Labour still very much appeal to these voters.

Tories are definitely appealing to older, lower income voters but it isn't all doom and gloom for Labour like the media are portraying, especially if they continue to pick up votes in previous hardcore Tory areas in the South that have seen a change in demographics (younger people being forced out of cities into adjacent towns) or older, wealthier voters who think Johnson is a prize dickhead

 

[zefarelly]

I suspect the current picture on this one is somewhat different now than it was in 2019. A lot of houses are being extended or having alterations around our way. The builders who are working on our extension say they have enough work booked for the next year and are actively avoiding doing quotations for new business. Demand for materials is such that the lead times for some things like windows and cement is now much longer than usual.

I did drawings and started our house extension/renovation project 2 years ago . . . . still not finished, it's been a ****ing nightmare.

 

[zefarelly]

View attachment 136552
Congratulations to Mrs. Robina Baine - First ever Labour Councillor* for Southwick Green on a 20% swing
*apart from a Lib Dem defector 30 years ago

Top Work Mrs B

 

[nicko31]

View attachment 136552
Congratulations to Mrs. Robina Baine - First ever Labour Councillor* for Southwick Green on a 20% swing
*apart from a Lib Dem defector 30 years ago

20% swing take a bow!!

 

[Curious Orange]

I did drawings and started our house extension/renovation project 2 years ago . . . . still not finished, it's been a ****ing nightmare.

You have my sympathy. We're only a couple of weeks in so have just had the concrete foundations poured. Should be a 16 week build, but our fingers are crossed.

My impression is that the pandemic has been a boon for the sector because people have been stuck at home and are keen to make where they live, which in a lot of cases is now also where they work, more liveable.

Anyway, this is probably O/T so I'll say no more.

 

[nicko31]

think people are slightly guilty of assuming that Labour have "lost" the working class vote. It's true that in SOME working class communities they have lost seats but look at places like Manchester, Newcastle, Sheffield, Leeds, Liverpool, Birmingham and London- all cities with large working class communities with Labour still dominating. The key difference between say, Newcastle and Hartlepool is that the lower income voters are on average younger, have a larger amount of exposure to other cultures, and it's mixed in with students, young professionals etc but actually a lot of the issues faced are similar- job prospects, housing, putting food on your table etc. Labour still very much appeal to these voters.

Tories are definitely appealing to older, lower income voters but it isn't all doom and gloom for Labour like the media are portraying, especially if they continue to pick up votes in previous hardcore Tory areas in the South that have seen a change in demographics (younger people being forced out of cities into adjacent towns) or older, wealthier voters who think Johnson is a prize dickhead

The thing with places like Hartlepool is young people disappear and go to Uni but never return because there is no opportunities. The population is increasingly old, the socially conservative policies from Johnson and co seem pretty appealing whether you are old and poor or old and wealthy.

Labour needs to forget places like Hartlepool, they can win elsewhere

 

[stewart12]

The thing with places like Hartlepool is young people disappear and go to Uni but never return because there is no opportunities. The population is increasingly old, the socially conservative policies from Johnson and co seem pretty appealing whether you are old and poor or old and wealthy.

Labour needs to forget places like Hartlepool, they can win elsewhere

yep, and I'd say the bigger divide in this country in terms of values etc isn't in class but in age. This is a large generalisation but the trend APPEARS to be that older voters are more socially conservative and younger voters are more socially liberal. Hence why seats in places with older populations are voting for the socially conservative Conservative party (even if Johnson is shagging everything in sight) and seats in places with younger populations are voting for the more socially liberal Labour/Lib Dem/Green parties (plus SNP in Scotland)

 

[Thunder Bolt]

[tweet]1391389933726806026[/tweet]

 

[Brian Fantana]

The thing with places like Hartlepool is young people disappear and go to Uni but never return because there is no opportunities. The population is increasingly old, the socially conservative policies from Johnson and co seem pretty appealing whether you are old and poor or old and wealthy.

Labour needs to forget places like Hartlepool, they can win elsewhere

The thing about Hartlepool though, and other areas on Teesside, is that the Tory metro mayor has been working really hard to bring the opportunities for the younger generations. He's kept Teesside Airport open, and managed to secure huge expansions to routes (which has created additional employment), he's pumped a lot of money into the renewable technologies sector, which has also led to a shedload of jobs and apprenticeships in this area. In an area of the country that has basically been ignored by governments of all colours for a very long time, it is a Tory (albeit a mayor and not an MP) who has actually delivered on bringing some semblance of hope and prosperity back to the region. Don't underestimate how much this has landed in the psyche of the younger generations.

 

[zefarelly]

[tweet]1391389933726806026[/tweet]

An you get slated for suggesting most of the population is stupid and ignorant. That really is astonishing.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

An you get slated for suggesting most of the population is stupid and ignorant. That really is astonishing.

You have seen a video on YouTube or Twitter or somewhere and are drawing a conclusion about millions of people. Aren’t you doing exactly what you and others accuse others of doing ie forming an opinion based on ignorance ? Perhaps worse. You really should read Brian Fantana in post 611 for a different perspective from a Hartlepool resident.

 

[stewart12]

You have seen a video on YouTube or Twitter or somewhere and are drawing a conclusion about millions of people. Aren’t you doing exactly what you and others accuse others of doing ie forming an opinion based on ignorance ? Perhaps worse. You really should read Brian Fantana in post 611 for a different perspective from a Hartlepool resident.

Definitely. I would disagree with almost everything that the man in that video stands for BUT most importantly what he's saying is his perception of his life situation. It's not for me to tell someone who lives in Hartlepool what life in Hartlepool is like. Like with many things, politics is largely the perception of reality rather than reality itself

A lot of people in the North East already have a bit of a thing about "Southerners" looking down on them. I have a lot of family from the North East, in fact it's the vast majority of my heritage and a lot of my family assume that I'm super posh and think that I'm better than them due to my southern accent. The fact that I grew up in a tiny flat with a single mother with barely any disposable income and they live in a 5 bed house with a huge garden is irrelevant to them

So when people from the south start labeling people from Hartlepool as "thick" I can tell you know that it's not going to get the outcome that you desire.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

You have seen a video on YouTube or Twitter or somewhere and are drawing a conclusion about millions of people. Aren’t you doing exactly what you and others accuse others of doing ie forming an opinion based on ignorance ? Perhaps worse. You really should read Brian Fantana in post 611 for a different perspective from a Hartlepool resident.

BBC Breakfast.

I posted another quote the other day from a woman who said the Tories had provided foodbanks, when before there weren't any. I disagree with Zef about most of the population, but it is hard to deny there are many people who only read red tops or watch the BBC news (which is just a government mouthpiece) so are unaware of the real situation. People in Hartlepool were told to vote for change. Surely most people think that after 11 years of the same governing party, that change isn't going to happen. Maybe? Maybe not?
I suppose a lot of people just don't take any notice of the news, until it affects them personally.

 

[Mellor 3 Ward 4]

The thing about Hartlepool though, and other areas on Teesside, is that the Tory metro mayor has been working really hard to bring the opportunities for the younger generations. He's kept Teesside Airport open, and managed to secure huge expansions to routes (which has created additional employment), he's pumped a lot of money into the renewable technologies sector, which has also led to a shedload of jobs and apprenticeships in this area. In an area of the country that has basically been ignored by governments of all colours for a very long time, it is a Tory (albeit a mayor and not an MP) who has actually delivered on bringing some semblance of hope and prosperity back to the region. Don't underestimate how much this has landed in the psyche of the younger generations.

My niece and her boyfriend live and work in the North East.

She's a midwife, he's a BT engineer - both natural target Labour voters.

Both voted for Ben Houchen for mayor, simply because he's worked incredibly hard on behalf of the people of the NE and delivered on his promises (particularly with regards to the Airport at Teeside)

The Tories have thrown money at the NE in the last coupe of years (I thought there wasn't any left...) and he has a £500 million war chest to deliver 25,00 new, high quality, jobs within the next 5 years.

The problem the Tories have is that perhaps by throwing cash at the red wall, the blue wall in the South East will start to crack? People down here will see lack of investment and Council cuts in this area, too much housebuilding (anyone who thinks Labour would build less are completely deluded) and think 'it's not fair, all the cash is now going north'....

I guess it's called levelling up?

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

BBC Breakfast.

I posted another quote the other day from a woman who said the Tories had provided foodbanks, when before there weren't any. I disagree with Zef about most of the population, but it is hard to deny there are many people who only read red tops or watch the BBC news (which is just a government mouthpiece) so are unaware of the real situation. People in Hartlepool were told to vote for change. Surely most people think that after 11 years of the same governing party, that change isn't going to happen. Maybe? Maybe not?
I suppose a lot of people just don't take any notice of the news, until it affects them personally.

Fair enough, but it is possible for both views to be true ie your examples and those in posts 611 and 616. I would imagine not many Sussex residents know much about Ben Houchen, the Tory mayor, which means they are not seeing the whole picture when making fairly sweeping generalizations.

 

[dazzer6666]

Starmer's 'radical shakeup' of the Labour front bench seems to have left it almost unchanged...............................opportunity missed ? We really need a strong and functioning opposition.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

My niece and her boyfriend live and work in the North East.

She's a midwife, he's a BT engineer - both natural target Labour voters.

Both voted for Ben Houchen for mayor, simply because he's worked incredibly hard on behalf of the people of the NE and delivered on his promises (particularly with regards to the Airport at Teeside)

The Tories have thrown money at the NE in the last coupe of years (I thought there wasn't any left...) and he has a £500 million war chest to deliver 25,00 new, high quality, jobs within the next 5 years.

The problem the Tories have is that perhaps by throwing cash at the red wall, the blue wall in the South East will start to crack? People down here will see lack of investment and Council cuts in this area, too much housebuilding (anyone who thinks Labour would build less are completely deluded) and think 'it's not fair, all the cash is now going north'....

I guess it's called levelling up?

The Tories are throwing money at specific areas even Newhaven. Our MP had her majority reduced from 5K to 2K in 2019 and all of a sudden the roadworks that have needed doing for years are now in progress.

 

[Brian Fantana]

My niece and her boyfriend live and work in the North East.

She's a midwife, he's a BT engineer - both natural target Labour voters.

Both voted for Ben Houchen for mayor, simply because he's worked incredibly hard on behalf of the people of the NE and delivered on his promises (particularly with regards to the Airport at Teeside)

There we go. A solid example of what I've been talking about. People here couldn't really give a shit when they see Keir Starmer spending most of PMQs probing about decorating and curtains. What they do care about is the all too rare occurrence of a politician delivering on their promises. And with the plaster ripped off for a lot of people here when it comes to voting Tory, they're now a lot more savvy and open-minded when it comes to choosing where their cross in the box goes. By no means am I saying that these traditional Labour areas won't swing back that way in the short-medium term, but it's somewhere where the party really needs to pull its socks up and show some fighting spirit. In the 2019 election, Corbyn and his top team essentially ignored the North East, assuming it was a done deal, whilst Boris visited probably a dozen times during the campaign.