Mark McGhee

[unnameable]

McGhee is one of the most successful managers that we've ever had, and fans slate him. I don't get it. Apart from the on-field success that he brought, he deserves our respect for standing up to Big Time Charlies, like Leon and CKR, who thought that they were bigger than the team and the club. Turning Virgo from a drop-out into a £1.5m player was no mean feat, either. Only a tiny minority of our players failed to respond to McGhee, out of a lack of respect, and those players have not distinguished themselves since they moved on. Brian Clough himself could not have got more out of the players that McGhee had at his disposal.

 

[TonyW]

How did he destroy the other clubs?

Reading 'hate' him as he said he would stay, but then jumped ship - having taken them up to the old Second Division.

His hands were tied, when he was losing influential players left/right/centre due to financial restraints. Of course, he is not the perfect manager and team spirit did suffer. But I don't feel you can lay the blame entirely at his doorstep. Leon was a huge factor in that and creating a divide amongst the squad. Considering he got more out of the player than any other manager has managed would suggest he is not as bad as you think. In hindsight, we may have been better off selling him after the playoff victory.

Gave away all our goalscorers? Which ones? I am thinking Leon, but I can't think of another one.

Finally back where he belongs? He has never managed lower than us or Reading.

Leon Knight was perfectly happy to contribute under our previous managers.

Reading, Wolves, Leicester and Millwall felt the weight of his squad-destroying tactics well before we did.

None of our previous managers over the last decade have had any funds to work with but all managed to take the club forward.

He systematically got rid of goal-scoring opportunities (Iwelumo, McCammon and Knight).
OK McCammon hasn't exactly set the world alight with goals (but he was very useful as a supplier to a strike partner) but Leon has and now too has Iwelumo.

Our wonderful manager thought it would be a good idea to put a 27 goal striker on the left of midfield as some sort of punishment for disruptive behaviour.

What a dick head!!

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

McGhee is one of the most successful managers that we've ever had, and fans slate him. I don't get it. Apart from the on-field success that he brought, he deserves our respect for standing up to Big Time Charlies, like Leon and CKR, who thought that they were bigger than the team and the club. Turning Virgo from a drop-out into a £1.5m player was no mean feat, either. Only a tiny minority of our players failed to respond to McGhee, out of a lack of respect, and those players have not distinguished themselves since they moved on. Brian Clough himself could not have got more out of the players that McGhee had at his disposal.

I agree with most of that, However without knowing what went on behind the scenes could he have done something to stop the likes of Leon getting like he did ealrier or off loading him before he did?

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

Leon Knight was perfectly happy to contribute under our previous managers.

Reading, Wolves, Leicester and Millwall felt the weight of his squad-destroying tactics well before we did.

!!

This is true

 

[Barrel of Fun]

Leon Knight was perfectly happy to contribute under our previous managers.

Coppell managed him for two months and that was it...

Reading, Wolves, Leicester and Millwall felt the weight of his squad-destroying tactics well before we did.

I haven't paid a great deal of attention to that, but I can't imagine that he destroyed the squads of four teams. I know he left Reading after a promotion and didn't they finish in a promotion spot the following season, missing out on promotion to the prem due to the downsizing? He also had Millwall is a decent position - Certianly those two cases would suggest these clubs were not destoryed.

None of our previous managers over the last decade have had any funds to work with but all managed to take the club forward.

He took us to our highest finish in something like 15 years!! If that is not forward...

He systematically got rid of goal-scoring opportunities (Iwelumo, McCammon and Knight).
OK McCammon hasn't exactly set the world alight with goals (but he was very useful as a supplier to a strike partner) but Leon has and now too has Iwelumo.

We all know why Leon moved on. He was disruptive and not pulling his weight. Things have not worked out well for him. Iwelumo jumped ship when he got a sniff of more money. There was nothing to suggest that he was going to score 20 odd in the Championship. I don't remember an outcry when he ende4d up at Colchester.

Our wonderful manager thought it would be a good idea to put a 27 goal striker on the left of midfield as some sort of punishment for disruptive behaviour.

He wasn't scoring and being our most creative player and one of the very few that could put a cross in, it doesn't seem to be that stupid.

What a dick head!!

That is gratitude for you.

 

[TonyW]

I've had WAY too many drunken pub debates about MM in the past.
And, despite my words on this thread, I actually LIKE the guy.

He comes across as a genuine bloke who works hard to achieve his goals.

The problem is - HE'S BLOODY USELESS.

Effort and commitment are no substitute for abilty.

And its a pre-requisite for a football manager to be able to MANAGE his players - not just fall out with them and get rid.

Look at Sir Alex. Tactical awareness of a drug-addled baboon, but he gets 110% out of his players. They want to work for each other and for the manager.

MM, just can't get that kind of attitude from his squads.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

I haven't paid a great deal of attention to that, but I can't imagine that he destroyed the squads of four teams.[/quote]


I think destroy is a bit ott, but certainly with Wolves he upset a few of the sqaud.

 

[withdeanwombat]

Well,I'll wait 'til I've read his book,but have always regarded him as good as a manager,often working in difficult circumstances.First signing (of his,for Motherwell)..........McVirgo on loan?

 

[TonyW]

Coppell managed him for two months and that was it...



I haven't paid a great deal of attention to that, but I can't imagine that he destroyed the squads of four teams. I know he left Reading after a promotion and didn't they finish in a promotion spot the following season, missing out on promotion to the prem due to the downsizing? He also had Millwall is a decent position - Certianly those two cases would suggest these clubs were not destoryed.



He took us to our highest finish in something like 15 years!! If that is not forward...


We all know why Leon moved on. He was disruptive and not pulling his weight. Things have not worked out well for him. Iwelumo jumped ship when he got a sniff of more money. There was nothing to suggest that he was going to score 20 odd in the Championship. I don't remember an outcry when he ende4d up at Colchester.


He wasn't scoring and being our most creative player and one of the very few that could put a cross in, it doesn't seem to be that stupid.



That is gratitude for you.

I owe no debt of gratitude to a man that brought my football team to its lowest ebb in 10 years.

His gross ineptitude led to several key players leaving and the destruction of team spirit.

Disruptive players need handling when you have no way of replacing their flair.

Look at cantona. One of the gretest players to have walked out on the park, but a complete moron.
Good man management turned a bloody good team into something virtually unbeatable.

I use the Old trafford link for a reason.
By all accounts MM and Sir Alex are best buddies, and speak at least once a week on the phone.
Shame MM didn't actually listen to the other end of the conversation sometimes.

 

[El Presidente]

If we are talking about Sir Alex, let's take a look at some of the players he has fallen out with

Beckham
Ince
Stam
Van Nistelrooy
Keane

what do they have in common..........NONE of them would get into our first team

 

[unnameable]

I agree with most of that, However without knowing what went on behind the scenes could he have done something to stop the likes of Leon getting like he did ealrier or off loading him before he did?

Clearly, McGhee's personality is more antagonistic than that of Steve Coppell, who managed Leon without a problem. However, most managers would have a problem managing Leon, as has been shown since Leon left Albion. Most managers are not as stoical and sedate as Coppell. I'm not sure how culpable McGhee is where Leon is concerned.

Also, like Kinky Gerbils said, we don't know what goes on behind the scenes. For all we know, Leon could have shagged McGhee's wife.

 

[TonyW]

If we are talking about Sir Alex, let's take a look at some of the players he has fallen out with

Beckham
Ince
Stam
Van Nistelrooy
Keane

what do they have in common..........NONE of them would get into our first team

Yep, all of whom (except Stam the druggy) continued to give months (if not years ) of dedicated service depite not actually getting along with the boss.

MM just sends them on their way - that's the difference.

 

[El Presidente]

Clearly, McGhee's personality is more antagonistic than that of Steve Coppell, who managed Leon without a problem. However, most managers would have a problem managing Leon, as has been shown since Leon left Albion. Most managers are not as stoical and sedate as Coppell. I'm not sure how culpable McGhee is where Leon is concerned.

Also, like Kinky Gerbils said, we don't know what goes on behind the scenes. For all we know, Leon could have shagged McGhee's wife.

If you look at Coppell's public comments about Paul Kitson however, they are similar to those of McGhee's about Knight & McCammon.

I don't think anyone could have kept us up a second season without any cash to spend to be honest.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

I owe no debt of gratitude to a man that brought my football team to its lowest ebb in 10 years.

His gross ineptitude led to several key players leaving and the destruction of team spirit.

Disruptive players need handling when you have no way of replacing their flair.

Look at cantona. One of the gretest players to have walked out on the park, but a complete moron.
Good man management turned a bloody good team into something virtually unbeatable.

I use the Old trafford link for a reason.
By all accounts MM and Sir Alex are best buddies, and speak at least once a week on the phone.
Shame MM didn't actually listen to the other end of the conversation sometimes.

I would suggest key players leaving were Virgo, Currie, Harding and Cullip. They are four key reasons for our decline in the league. Of course, if Knight had been performing then he would have been a key departure. But was he? Was it enitrely McGhee's fault that Knight was difficult to handle? He got the most out of him, out of any manager in the past and present.

If you are comparing MM to Ferguson, then perhaps we should compare Knight to Cantona......Erm.....no comparison. Cantona played for the best team in England, whereas Leon thought he should be playing for the best team in England.

I can't be arsed to talk about this anymore About 70% of my posts have been defending McGhee.

He was not a perfect manager, but he does not get the respect he deserves.

Lowest ebb for 10 years?

 

[El Presidente]

Lowest ebb for 10 years?

Absolutely, don't you remember the free flowing total football we played at Priestfield in 1997/8?

 

[Icy Gull]

I owe no debt of gratitude to a man that brought my football team to its lowest ebb in 10 years.

His gross ineptitude led to several key players leaving and the destruction of team spirit.

Disruptive players need handling when you have no way of replacing their flair.

Look at cantona. One of the gretest players to have walked out on the park, but a complete moron.
Good man management turned a bloody good team into something virtually unbeatable.

I use the Old trafford link for a reason.
By all accounts MM and Sir Alex are best buddies, and speak at least once a week on the phone.
Shame MM didn't actually listen to the other end of the conversation sometimes.

To compare McGhee at potless Albion with Ferguson at world famous United is ridiculous. All the players that fel out with MM thought they were better than the club, bit different when you are at United's level isn't it?

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

If you look at Coppell's public comments about Paul Kitson however, they are similar to those of McGhee's about Knight & McCammon.

I don't think anyone could have kept us up a second season without any cash to spend to be honest.

That is true but it wasnt just Knight that had the media treatment, How much of that was down to Mcghee is unknown.

I just dont agree any media should be used to slag off a player, the team is fair enough.

 

[Uncle Buck]

Lucky manager. Inherited reasonable team from Coppell, got them up, so well done on that front. Things started to go wrong when he tried to build his own team, signed players that did not do it. Also I would suggest he was lazy when it comes to signing players in that he relied on agents to recommened players to him, rather than getting out there and scouting, hence some interesting overseas players ending up here.

Should have been sacked by Christmas 2005, the rot had set in, public fall outs with players and the team nose diving.

Also a bit of a tinker man. Would tinker with things and get great results, but on the back of this would tinker again the next game and things not work.

Will be OK for 18 months, then things will fall apart.

 

[Simster]

Will be OK for 18 months, then things will fall apart.

That is about right - somewhere between a year and two years seems to be his shelf life, which actually isn't that uncommon.

I thought the football under MM was a bit dull at times, but you can't argue with his track record until the second Championship season - when the wheels fell off.

But I'd still back McGhee over Leon Knight any day of the week.

 

[Trigger]

Lucky manager. Inherited reasonable team from Coppell, got them up, so well done on that front. Things started to go wrong when he tried to build his own team, signed players that did not do it. Also I would suggest he was lazy when it comes to signing players in that he relied on agents to recommened players to him, rather than getting out there and scouting, hence some interesting overseas players ending up here.

Should have been sacked by Christmas 2005, the rot had set in, public fall outs with players and the team nose diving.

Also a bit of a tinker man. Would tinker with things and get great results, but on the back of this would tinker again the next game and things not work.

Will be OK for 18 months, then things will fall apart.

Nail head and all that, no doubt we'll hear different from those 'in the know' though.