[News] Major incident in Newhaven

[Justice]

I was going through Newhaven on the train at about 1020 this morning and there were loads of OB, Search and Rescue and a few ambulances waiting for the incoming ferry. There were a lot still there at 1pm when I was returning.

Now you know why, the state of the world 2024 and people are being forced into freezers or onto a death raft seeking some kind of new or in a lot of cases a promised life that will never materialise.

 

[AmexRuislip]

Once the take a look at Newhaven I’m sure they’ll head back on their own accord. Poor souls.

Comedy gold

 

[Stato]

"What's wrong with you? It's only a joke," is often the get out clause of privileged cowards who want to punch down, but don't want to take responsiblity for the lack of empathy inherent in their true beliefs. I think of it as 'The Top Gear Clause'. I'm glad that nobody on here would think of doing it.

 

[jackalbion]

I was going through Newhaven on the train at about 1020 this morning and there were loads of OB, Search and Rescue and a few ambulances waiting for the incoming ferry. There were a lot still there at 1pm when I was returning.

Just a standard Friday there.

 

[jackalbion]

Awful you'd stick yourself in a freezer like that, hope everyone is ok, tragic if people have died.

 

[WATFORD zero]

Not something to be joking about, IMO.

He's not joking, as you would know if you followed his posting history. Immigration, General Racism, he is all over it like a Tramp on chips.

That post was serious, but he slipped up because it is the first time (to my knowledge) that he has actually said exactly what he thinks rather than post some dubious link with a question mark. At least Pretty pink fairy was honest.

He'll run off and hide now, rather than justify his comment, same as always

 

[Greg Bobkin]

They will all qualify for a flat in Shoreham........apparently.


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-sussex-68316252

There's nothing – apparently or not apparently – about Shoreham in that story

 

[Colonel Mustard]

Really? We're talking about people who were desperate enough to put their lives at risk. For me, life and death matters are not for joking around. None of us know who they are or why they did it, so IMO making jokes at their expense is not what anyone should be doing.

That's not being easily offended. It's called "empathy".

There’s always a balance to be struck, but most people seem incapable of striking it. I have full sympathy with genuine refugees in fear of their lives and needing assistance. I think the developed world as a whole should be cooperating to establish a system of providing help — or even better in some cases, tackling the root cause of their plight.

At the other end of the scale you have simple economic migration which I’ve also no problem with at all, as long as it’s managed legally and efficiently, and based on matching skills with skills shortages. I’ve been an economic migrant myself, living and working in several countries, all above board. There are also two countries (US and Australia) that I applied for work permits to, but was refused. I was a bit pissed off at the time, but I didn’t meet the criteria and had to accept the decision,

The Newhaven incident looks like a simple case of illegal people smuggling, presumably from France if they were in the container for just a few hours. It's quite an industry, and I don’t have much patience with it.

Like a lot of contentious issues, people get stupidly polarised. As outlined above, there are very clearly distinct groups of migrants, and it’s not just possible but perfectly reasonable to be in favour of some but against others. Some people feel bound to support all migration regardless of legality, country of origin and motivation. Others seem completely opposed to all migration regardless of legality, country of origin and motivation. The most rational position to take is somewhere between the two. Until people stop being so naive and ideological about this issue (and I’m looking at both camps here), it will continue to antagonise everyone.

 

[The Clamp]

There’s always a balance to be struck, but most people seem incapable of striking it. I have full sympathy with genuine refugees in fear of their lives and needing assistance. I think the developed world as a whole should be cooperating to establish a system of providing help — or even better in some cases, tackling the root cause of their plight.

At the other end of the scale you have simple economic migration which I’ve also no problem with at all, as long as it’s managed legally and efficiently, and based on matching skills with skills shortages. I’ve been an economic migrant myself, living and working in several countries, all above board. There are also two countries (US and Australia) that I applied for work permits to, but was refused. I was a bit pissed off at the time, but I didn’t meet the criteria and had to accept the decision,

The Newhaven incident looks like a simple case of illegal people smuggling, presumably from France if they were in the container for just a few hours. It's quite an industry, and I don’t have much patience with it.

Like a lot of contentious issues, people get stupidly polarised. As outlined above, there are very clearly distinct groups of migrants, and it’s not just possible but perfectly reasonable to be in favour of some but against others. Some people feel bound to support all migration regardless of legality, country of origin and motivation. Others seem completely opposed to all migration regardless of legality, country of origin and motivation. The most rational position to take is somewhere between the two. Until people stop being so naive and ideological about this issue (and I’m looking at both camps here), it will continue to antagonise everyone.

I don’t support indiscriminate immigration. At all. It has to be controlled.

I do support treating human beings with dignity and due process.

Being taken to Newhaven? Where’s the dignity?

 

[TomandJerry]

"One man has been arrested on suspicion of facilitating illegal entry to the UK and a second man has been arrested for illegally entering the UK, Sussex Police say."

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

There's nothing – apparently or not apparently – about Shoreham in that story

I know I was referring to the Shoreham Traffic Thread.

 

[Stato]

There’s always a balance to be struck, but most people seem incapable of striking it. I have full sympathy with genuine refugees in fear of their lives and needing assistance. I think the developed world as a whole should be cooperating to establish a system of providing help — or even better in some cases, tackling the root cause of their plight.

At the other end of the scale you have simple economic migration which I’ve also no problem with at all, as long as it’s managed legally and efficiently, and based on matching skills with skills shortages. I’ve been an economic migrant myself, living and working in several countries, all above board. There are also two countries (US and Australia) that I applied for work permits to, but was refused. I was a bit pissed off at the time, but I didn’t meet the criteria and had to accept the decision,

The Newhaven incident looks like a simple case of illegal people smuggling, presumably from France if they were in the container for just a few hours. It's quite an industry, and I don’t have much patience with it.

Like a lot of contentious issues, people get stupidly polarised. As outlined above, there are very clearly distinct groups of migrants, and it’s not just possible but perfectly reasonable to be in favour of some but against others. Some people feel bound to support all migration regardless of legality, country of origin and motivation. Others seem completely opposed to all migration regardless of legality, country of origin and motivation. The most rational position to take is somewhere between the two. Until people stop being so naive and ideological about this issue (and I’m looking at both camps here), it will continue to antagonise everyone.

You're reaching slightly. Nobody has made polarised arguments about the pros and cons of immigration in the thread. The only polarisation that has happened is that on one side, there are people who read this story and, whatever their views on immigration, felt sympathy for those who are being flown to hospital, and on another side, someone who wanted to point and laugh.

I've nothing against dark humour. It can be an essential coping method in dealing with tragic circumstances. Saying the most outrageous thing in an awful situation can be very funny and very cathartic. However, this didn't seem to be the intent of the post that annoyed people. Rather, it was just a cheap bit of posturing, a way for the poster to write 'Send 'em back', whilst winking and pretending he was joking. It's a joke solely for those who want to dehumanise.

However, it's perfectly possible to be anti all immigration and still treat people with respect and empathy. Views about immigration are not what people are condeming the poster for and I suspect those who think it was a crap, cheap, tasteless and pointless shot come from both sides of the political divide on the issue.

 

[A1X]

Every bully in history when confronted over their behaviour has responded with "FFS it's a joke, can't you take a joke?"

 

[Stato]

Being taken to Newhaven? Where’s the dignity?

Once the take a look at Newhaven I’m sure they’ll head back on their own accord. Poor souls.

By the way, my complaint wasn't about the Newhaven jokes. The usual stereotyping of Seaford's poor relation, but they made me smile with recognition. All of us who grew up in the town that advertised itself on road signs as the 'Gateway To Europe' appreciated the irony that the best thing the town could say about itself was that there was a way out.

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

By the way, my complaint wasn't about the Newhaven jokes. The usual stereotyping of Seaford's poor relation, but they made me smile with recognition. All of us who grew up in the town that advertised itself on road signs as the 'Gateway To Europe' appreciated the irony that the best thing the town could say about itself was that there was a way out.

Yeh, spot on mate. Newhaven is fair game

 

[Colonel Mustard]

You're reaching slightly. Nobody has made polarised arguments about the pros and cons of immigration in the thread. The only polarisation that has happened is that on one side, there are people who read this story and, whatever their views on immigration, felt sympathy for those who are being flown to hospital, and on another side, someone who wanted to point and laugh.

I've nothing against dark humour. It can be an essential coping method in dealing with tragic circumstances. Saying the most outrageous thing in an awful situation can be very funny and very cathartic. However, this didn't seem to be the intent of the post that annoyed people. Rather, it was just a cheap bit of posturing, a way for the poster to write 'Send 'em back', whilst winking and pretending he was joking. It's a joke solely for those who want to dehumanise.

However, it's perfectly possible to be anti all immigration and still treat people with respect and empathy. Views about immigration are not what people are condeming the poster for and I suspect those who think it was a crap, cheap, tasteless and pointless shot come from both sides of the political divide on the issue.

I didn't say that people have advanced detailed arguments on this thread -- I was talking more generally. That said, I can detect from some of the reponses here that some are likely broadly in favour of giving all would-be immigrants the benefit of the doubt, and those not showing much empathy are likely to be more on the other side of the argument. I agree, obviously, that people should be treated with decency in almost any situation. But I also believe that this is a two-way street, and if people arrive illegally and are then found to have no justification for being here, they should not be allowed to stay. Cooperating with that demands decency on their part too. I don't think that's too controversial but it's a view you never hear from one camp. If people are found to be eligible for assistance including settlement, they should be helped and not be discriminated against. My only caveat there is that many who arrive illegally are those who can afford to pay smugglers and bribe their way across very long distances. So it's often people who can most afford it rather than those who need it most. This makes me uneasy.

 

[LamieRobertson]

Chilling story …oops sorry

 

[The Clamp]

I didn't say that people have advanced detailed arguments on this thread -- I was talking more generally. That said, I can detect from some of the reponses here that some are likely broadly in favour of giving all would-be immigrants the benefit of the doubt, and those not showing much empathy and likely to be more on the other side of the argument. I agree, obviously, that people should be treated with decency in almost any situation. But I also believe that this is a two-way street, and if people arrive illegally and are then found to have no justification for being here, they should not be allowed to stay. I don't think that's too controversial but it's a view you never hear from one camp. If people are found to be eligible for assistance including settlement, they should be helped and not be discriminated against. My only caveat there is that many who arrive illegally are those who can afford to pay smugglers and bribe their way across very long distances. So it's often people who can most afford it rather than those who need it most. This makes me uneasy.

Often they don’t pay much up front, if any. How they are made to pay the smugglers back when they get to their destination is another matter. A very unpleasant matter.

Problem is that once they are tied up with a people smuggling / modern slavery ring, they are vulnerable. As is their family back home. And they need to be helped. Whatever the original motivation was. Viscious circle.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

By the way, my complaint wasn't about the Newhaven jokes. The usual stereotyping of Seaford's poor relation, but they made me smile with recognition. All of us who grew up in the town that advertised itself on road signs as the 'Gateway To Europe' appreciated the irony that the best thing the town could say about itself was that there was a way out.

I was raised in Newhaven myself.

 

[Zeberdi]

He's not joking, as you would know if you followed his posting history. Immigration, General Racism, he is all over it like a Tramp on chips.

His Islamophobic sentiments have been very obvious on the Israel/Gaza/Hamas thread too - like posting fake news, calling pro-Palestinian marches, ‘Hamas’ and suggesting several times Palestinians should all be moved to Jordan.

Not as chilling though as the video of the Hamas terrorists playing football with decapitated children's heads

Like a lot of contentious issues, people get stupidly polarised. As outlined above, there are very clearly distinct groups of migrants, and it’s not just possible but perfectly reasonable to be in favour of some but against others. Some people feel bound to support all migration regardless of legality, country of origin and motivation. Others seem completely opposed to all migration regardless of legality, country of origin and motivation. The most rational position to take is somewhere between the two. Until people stop being so naive and ideological about this issue (and I’m looking at both camps here), it will continue to antagonise everyone.

I agree that most contentious issues are not dichotomous (actually most of us do) but there are ways of voicing arguments against something without dehumanising people or being racist so sorry, your comments here are not why people are antagonised by @carlzeiss’s comments. One can voice arguments against migration without resorting to hatred.

Perhaps some folk really should hide their light under a bushel when it comes to personal beliefs unless they can express them without inflicting discriminatory abuse or bullying on others.