beorhthelm
A. Virgo, Football Genius
- Jul 21, 2003
- 36,014
they have mask mandates in Europe, look at how well they are doing.
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Main Coronavirus / Covid-19 Discussion Thread
- Thread starter GingerBeerMan
- Start date
they have mask mandates in Europe, look at how well they are doing.
Fat Boy Fat
New member
- Aug 21, 2020
- 1,077
So, what's the answer? Do nothing?
Went to a long-arranged Christmas Dinner last night. We had a small number of our group drop out of the event as they have big family Christmas events planned, but most still attended. We had a private room and all took LFTs beforehand and avoided close contact. However, interesting to see place was otherwise absolutely rammed, with barely a mask in sight. As we left a disco was in full swing, also packed. Caution seems to have been thrown to the wind for a large number, can’t see any chance of a lockdown being observed to anything like the same level previously.
beorhthelm
A. Virgo, Football Genius
- Jul 21, 2003
- 36,014
the vaccines are the answer. we're not suffereing harsher effects of the virus due to such high adoption of vaccines, even if we get covid, the disease is mild.
Fat Boy Fat
New member
- Aug 21, 2020
- 1,077
There's that "we" again!
Forgetting for one minute those that make a conscious decision not to get vaccinated, there are the millions who either can't have the vaccine or for who the efficacy is unknown!
They are the ones that need some idea as to how they will be protected going forward.
I think there are a lot of people being cautious this week in the lead up to Christmas for fear of testing positive and therefore having to self-isolate and miss out. Once that's over and there's nothing particularly exciting happening, we'll find even more people happy to take risks. I agree that lockdowns won't be observed.
vegster
Sanity Clause
- May 5, 2008
- 28,272
Yes, equivalent size European countries all have less cases than us and yes they're vaccinated to a similar level to us...so the " look over there " defence for the UK is wearing a bit thin....
The official line is " we need to slow the spread and ramp up the booster programme in order to slow the spread... " Oh, but feel free to go to Nativity plays, Christmas parties and other public places and mix..."
Thanks to that stupidity there is now talk of a pre Christmas Circuit Breaker!
beorhthelm
A. Virgo, Football Genius
- Jul 21, 2003
- 36,014
look at recent data, countries with more restictions have seen massive surges in covid from October. this shows the effects of masks are limited. its not "look over there", there's no competition, its studying the data for real evidence.
or they've had a more virilent from ripping through undetected, no one is suggesting that. open to other hypothesis to explain the data.
Marty___Mcfly
I see your wicked plan - I’m a junglist.
- Sep 14, 2011
- 2,251
The big question is whether the current level of covid cases actually leads to a dramatic increase in ICU / deaths. If it doesn’t, we are in the same place we’ve been since July which has seemed manageable with no additional restrictions.
Big picture, surely no one wants an saga going on for years where we have to panic when cases go up etc. Ideally we get to a place where we can deal with this the same way we deal with flu- with annual jabs offered to elderly / high risk folk, and everyone just stay at home / avoid contacts if you get Ill etc. Put an end to testing, restrictions and panicking and get back to life as we knew it.
I hope this latest saga turns out to be not too serious, if it doesn’t lead to high ICU / deaths then we can ditch restrictions ASAP, otherwise- we do what is needed to get through this and then we are back around to spring and we ditch measures then and prepare for next winter- maybe for that we could offer booster jabs to the elderly / high risk folk earlier- e.g. give them all a chance to get one before end of Sept so that they are in place before the winter season.
Big picture, surely no one wants an saga going on for years where we have to panic when cases go up etc. Ideally we get to a place where we can deal with this the same way we deal with flu- with annual jabs offered to elderly / high risk folk, and everyone just stay at home / avoid contacts if you get Ill etc. Put an end to testing, restrictions and panicking and get back to life as we knew it.
I hope this latest saga turns out to be not too serious, if it doesn’t lead to high ICU / deaths then we can ditch restrictions ASAP, otherwise- we do what is needed to get through this and then we are back around to spring and we ditch measures then and prepare for next winter- maybe for that we could offer booster jabs to the elderly / high risk folk earlier- e.g. give them all a chance to get one before end of Sept so that they are in place before the winter season.
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Marty___Mcfly
I see your wicked plan - I’m a junglist.
- Sep 14, 2011
- 2,251
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article...hairman-of-the-sage-covid-modelling-committee
Interesting article on the Sage modelling figures.
Interesting article on the Sage modelling figures.
dsr-burnley
Well-known member
- Aug 15, 2014
- 2,625
Have the people who want lockdown, said what they hope to achieve by it? Are they hoping that if we lockdown in January, then the whole omicron thing will have disappeared by February? Or that by February the natural spike will have ended and we'll be back to relatively low levels ongoing?
Because it seems to me that the most likely scenario, if we lockdown in January and succeed in reducing the case numbers, that the case numbers will go up again if we release in February. So we have to lockdown in February and release in March - but the cases will shoot up in March, so we lock dwon in March - ad infinitum. Or at least, until the virus does in fact disappear of its own accord, without herd immunity, and without any new vaccine.
So the question I would want answering by lockdown supporters, the professionals I mean, not necessarily people on here - in the scenario they put forward, do they expect lockdown in January to end before February, and if so, what will have changed to make that possible?
Because it seems to me that the most likely scenario, if we lockdown in January and succeed in reducing the case numbers, that the case numbers will go up again if we release in February. So we have to lockdown in February and release in March - but the cases will shoot up in March, so we lock dwon in March - ad infinitum. Or at least, until the virus does in fact disappear of its own accord, without herd immunity, and without any new vaccine.
So the question I would want answering by lockdown supporters, the professionals I mean, not necessarily people on here - in the scenario they put forward, do they expect lockdown in January to end before February, and if so, what will have changed to make that possible?
Jaw dropping. Deciding to take no action is not the same as ignoring scenarios that “need no decision “. You need ALL the scenarios before you can make a decision. It’s almost as if Boris wants to be bounced into a lockdown.
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nicko31
Well-known member
Just look at our near neighbours, so much like March 2020. Johnson is now a lame duck PM
They are looking to avoid the total collapse of the National Health Service. Have you not been listening AT ALL? Until we get to a point where we can manage the virus and keep the NHS on it’s free et without lockdowns then we are going to be stuck in this cycle. It’s really not that difficult.
I guess the hope would be by that point the boosters would have taken more of an effect, as it seems that they're key to fighting Omicron.
Weststander
Well-known member
beorhthelm
A. Virgo, Football Genius
- Jul 21, 2003
- 36,014
though as noted before, the NHS remained on its feet a year ago with cases 30% higher than current high end prediction.
Weststander
Well-known member
The attention seeker's still loving his 15 minutes of fame.
"Piers Corbyn, the anti-lockdown protester, has been arrested on suspicion of encouraging people to burn down MPs' offices.
The Metropolitan Police said a man in his 70s - who it did not name - was arrested in south London in the early hours of Sunday.
"The arrest relates to a video posted online in which people were encouraged to burn down MPs' offices," the force said.
Earlier, the Met said it was assessing a video which appears to show Mr Corbyn, 74, calling for MPs' offices to be burned down.
The video, shared on social media, shows the brother of former Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn criticising politicians who voted for Covid restrictions.
After decrying "those scum who have decided to go ahead with introducing new fascism", the 74-year-old tells a crowd in the video: "You've got to get a list of them... and if your MP is one of them, go to their offices and, well, I would recommend burning them down, OK. But I can't say that on air. I hope we're not on air." ".
"Piers Corbyn, the anti-lockdown protester, has been arrested on suspicion of encouraging people to burn down MPs' offices.
The Metropolitan Police said a man in his 70s - who it did not name - was arrested in south London in the early hours of Sunday.
"The arrest relates to a video posted online in which people were encouraged to burn down MPs' offices," the force said.
Earlier, the Met said it was assessing a video which appears to show Mr Corbyn, 74, calling for MPs' offices to be burned down.
The video, shared on social media, shows the brother of former Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn criticising politicians who voted for Covid restrictions.
After decrying "those scum who have decided to go ahead with introducing new fascism", the 74-year-old tells a crowd in the video: "You've got to get a list of them... and if your MP is one of them, go to their offices and, well, I would recommend burning them down, OK. But I can't say that on air. I hope we're not on air." ".
