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[Politics] Liz Truss **RESIGNS 20/10/2022**



KZNSeagull

Well-known member
Nov 26, 2007
21,028
Wolsingham, County Durham
they have to wait for someone, anyone to call a date

if we can understand, precisely where we have gone wrong, the solutions will leep out at us

as it stands, the only realistic option the nation now has is, starmer
No they don't, they can start whenever they like.
The one solution that has leapt out at us (rejoining the single market in some form) has already been rejected.
Starmer is the only realistic option at the moment Providing they do not come up with anything vaguely controversial and shoot themselves in the foot, although even then it would have to be really bonkers.
 




Bozza

You can change this
Helpful Moderator
Jul 4, 2003
57,126
Back in Sussex
They do but they are going to look very stupid if they constantly refuse to answer questions, rather like Truss. I currently have no idea who I am going to vote for next as I do not know who will be standing in my constituency - if it is the Corbyn lover that stood last time then there is no way I will vote for them.
Ashworth was woefully poor on the BBC immediately following the Truss press conference. He was asked directly, twice, which parts of the mini-budget that remain in place Labour didn't agree with. He swerved it both times, so the interviewer gave up as he was out of time. I know this is standard politician procedure and they are all drilled to do the same, but it's just so frustrating. Be better - it's not hard.

Another Labour MP (didn't catch the name as I was out for a run) was interviewed by the easy-going Tony Livesey on 5Live's Drive show yesterday afternoon and he was asking about Labour's energy plans, and she completely floundered and had to resort to parroting pre-rehearsed lines that didn't go anywhere close to answering what she'd been asked. It was utterly piss poor.

To be clear, I'm not saying this to suggest Labour are worse or even the same as the current shambolic government, but if Labour are going to step up, do actually step up. Be professional. Answer the question even if it's a little bit awkward to do so. Let's have some honest politics, please.
 


sparkie

Well-known member
Jul 17, 2003
13,219
Hove
you're fine, it's just some spotty faced student with no real world knowledge talking nonsense about a subject he knows very little about
Indeed. Insists on long interchanges about MMT when there is no suggestion that the thread subject, Truss, even knows what MMT is.

I might even start a dedicated MMT thread if it becomes that much of a hot topic on this thread. Lol.
 


rogersix

Well-known member
Jan 18, 2014
8,201
We'll ignore the £70bn cost of furlough then ? Or the billions spent on PPE ?
you need to move on, the ppe billions have gone, just gone, and no one knows where, it's just another, "one of those things"

(i think they might find the money underneath the russia report)
 


KZNSeagull

Well-known member
Nov 26, 2007
21,028
Wolsingham, County Durham
Ashworth was woefully poor on the BBC immediately following the Truss press conference. He was asked directly, twice, which parts of the mini-budget that remain in place Labour didn't agree with. He swerved it both times, so the interviewer gave up as he was out of time. I know this is standard politician procedure and they are all drilled to do the same, but it's just so frustrating. Be better - it's not hard.

Another Labour MP (didn't catch the name as I was out for a run) was interviewed by the easy-going Tony Livesey on 5Live's Drive show yesterday afternoon and he was asking about Labour's energy plans, and she completely floundered and had to resort to parroting pre-rehearsed lines that didn't go anywhere close to answering what she'd been asked. It was utterly piss poor.

To be clear, I'm not saying this to suggest Labour are worse or even the same as the current shambolic government, but if Labour are going to step up, do actually step up. Be professional. Answer the question even if it's a little bit awkward to do so. Let's have some honest politics, please.
Absolutely this. The country requires answers, not being constantly reminded of what we already know.
 




rogersix

Well-known member
Jan 18, 2014
8,201
They do but they are going to look very stupid if they constantly refuse to answer questions, rather like Truss. I currently have no idea who I am going to vote for next as I do not know who will be standing in my constituency - if it is the Corbyn lover that stood last time then there is no way I will vote for them.
am i correct in thinking you will vote abc, anyone but conservative?
 




rogersix

Well-known member
Jan 18, 2014
8,201
No they don't, they can start whenever they like.
The one solution that has leapt out at us (rejoining the single market in some form) has already been rejected.
Starmer is the only realistic option at the moment Providing they do not come up with anything vaguely controversial and shoot themselves in the foot, although even then it would have to be really bonkers.
strategically, labour will be attempting to maximise the political anguish for the torys, so as to govern for a decade or more
 






Randy McNob

> > > > > > Cardiff > > > > >
Jun 13, 2020
4,715
That sounds like winning by default. The country needs solutions, not the least worst option.
This was their 2019 election manifesto, got it pretty spot on if you ask me. Tax the rich to fund public services - Tick. Tories want to tax them less and cut services. increase the health budget year on year - we'd be far better prepared for Covid. Tories just thought how their mates could make a quick buck out of overpriced and unusuitable PPE. Get Brexit sorted in 6 months, Tories still wrangling with the EU 3 years on. Nationalisation inc the national grid - would have had more control over current energy prices. - Tick 10gbp minimum wage - would mean the poorest would have been better off to deal with the cost of living crisis

Seems they had the answers back then but the Corbyn smear campaign went into overdrive
 

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Bold Seagull

strong and stable with me, or...
Mar 18, 2010
30,426
Hove
Ashworth was woefully poor on the BBC immediately following the Truss press conference. He was asked directly, twice, which parts of the mini-budget that remain in place Labour didn't agree with. He swerved it both times, so the interviewer gave up as he was out of time. I know this is standard politician procedure and they are all drilled to do the same, but it's just so frustrating. Be better - it's not hard.

Another Labour MP (didn't catch the name as I was out for a run) was interviewed by the easy-going Tony Livesey on 5Live's Drive show yesterday afternoon and he was asking about Labour's energy plans, and she completely floundered and had to resort to parroting pre-rehearsed lines that didn't go anywhere close to answering what she'd been asked. It was utterly piss poor.

To be clear, I'm not saying this to suggest Labour are worse or even the same as the current shambolic government, but if Labour are going to step up, do actually step up. Be professional. Answer the question even if it's a little bit awkward to do so. Let's have some honest politics, please.
Rightly so he swerved it, the devil is in the detail and right not to fall into the trap of saying 'don't agree with this cut' then in your own budget you make a similar cut but it's inextricably linked to something else that you weren't able to go into. Headline is that Labour MP goes back on disagreeing with said cut even if it's a completely different context.

Honest politics starts with honest media and sorry, but Labour in both 2015, 17 and 19 did not deal with an honest media or an honest presentation of policies. Stability and strong government with me or chaos with Ed Miliband...you talk about honest professional politics and yet they went after Ed for eating a bacon sandwich awkwardly. Look at us now, that's 7 years of stable and strong government...
 




Bozza

You can change this
Helpful Moderator
Jul 4, 2003
57,126
Back in Sussex
Honest politics starts with honest media and sorry, but Labour in both 2015, 17 and 19 did not deal with an honest media or an honest presentation of policies. Stability and strong government with me or chaos with Ed Miliband...you talk about honest professional politics and yet they went after Ed for eating a bacon sandwich awkwardly. Look at us now, that's 7 years of stable and strong government...
When you've got a microphone in your hand and/or a camera in your face then you are in control of the messaging at that moment in time. You have the benefit of being able to give your view of the world, without it going through a biased filter that will twist your words to suit a different narrative.

Since making my post above, I've looked up the point that was being discussed on 5Live, relating to insulating 19m homes and how it would be funded, and I'm now in no doubt that the Labour MP (again - sorry I was slogging up the Downs on a 9 mile run at the time so missed her name) had absolutely no idea what she was talking about. It was piss poor. Did you hear it?
 


rogersix

Well-known member
Jan 18, 2014
8,201
That sounds like winning by default. The country needs solutions, not the least worst option.
if truss had an ounce of patriotism in her, she would resign

she won't, so as is stands, we have two years to ask ourselves "well, how did we get here?"
 


Bozza

You can change this
Helpful Moderator
Jul 4, 2003
57,126
Back in Sussex
Since making my post above, I've looked up the point that was being discussed on 5Live, relating to insulating 19m homes and how it would be funded, and I'm now in no doubt that the Labour MP (again - sorry I was slogging up the Downs on a 9 mile run at the time so missed her name) had absolutely no idea what she was talking about. It was piss poor. Did you hear it?
...and to follow-up on myself, this is important because after hearing the interview I was left with the impression that Labour had an expensive policy that seemed to have no solid funding proposal behind it.

But, having researched it myself, I can see there is a solid funding proposal that makes sense.

How many other people listening to the interview went away to research it themselves?
 




Bold Seagull

strong and stable with me, or...
Mar 18, 2010
30,426
Hove
When you've got a microphone in your hand and/or a camera in your face then you are in control of the messaging at that moment in time. You have the benefit of being able to give your view of the world, without it going through a biased filter that will twist your words to suit a different narrative.

Since making my post above, I've looked up the point that was being discussed on 5Live, relating to insulating 19m homes and how it would be funded, and I'm now in no doubt that the Labour MP (again - sorry I was slogging up the Downs on a 9 mile run at the time so missed her name) had absolutely no idea what she was talking about. It was piss poor. Did you hear it?
The interviewer is controlling the questions. You're upset Ashworth didn't answer a specific question about which parts within the mini budget he didn't agree with. That isn't an answer you can give in 30 seconds because a budget is a collection of interrelated policies. So Ashworth wanted to control his message, but you wanted him to answer that question. You can't have it both ways.

I didn't hear that interview or who she was. If she was in the shadow cabinet, or part of the energy or treasury shadow teams then I'd hope she would have a reasonable grasp of it, but again there is quite a bit of detail into how the whole of Labour's energy policies are funded that probably doesn't translate into a nice tidy soundbite for someone on a run.
 


WATFORD zero

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 10, 2003
27,607
Ashworth was woefully poor on the BBC immediately following the Truss press conference. He was asked directly, twice, which parts of the mini-budget that remain in place Labour didn't agree with. He swerved it both times, so the interviewer gave up as he was out of time. I know this is standard politician procedure and they are all drilled to do the same, but it's just so frustrating. Be better - it's not hard.

Another Labour MP (didn't catch the name as I was out for a run) was interviewed by the easy-going Tony Livesey on 5Live's Drive show yesterday afternoon and he was asking about Labour's energy plans, and she completely floundered and had to resort to parroting pre-rehearsed lines that didn't go anywhere close to answering what she'd been asked. It was utterly piss poor.

To be clear, I'm not saying this to suggest Labour are worse or even the same as the current shambolic government, but if Labour are going to step up, do actually step up. Be professional. Answer the question even if it's a little bit awkward to do so. Let's have some honest politics, please.
I would really like more honesty in politics but if you have political ambitions then there has been nothing to suggest in the last few years that honesty and openness will be successful, rather the complete opposite. Being blatantly dishonest is continuing to be way to be successful in Politics. Liz Truss became Prime Minister a month ago and is now going in the exact opposite direction to her whole election campaign.

I agree completely that we need more honest politics, but how many and who are willing to put their head above the parapet and get it shot off finishing their political careers before things even start to change direction. It's taken a few years to get here :shrug:
 
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Bozza

You can change this
Helpful Moderator
Jul 4, 2003
57,126
Back in Sussex
The interviewer is controlling the questions. You're upset Ashworth didn't answer a specific question about which parts within the mini budget he didn't agree with. That isn't an answer you can give in 30 seconds because a budget is a collection of interrelated policies. So Ashworth wanted to control his message, but you wanted him to answer that question. You can't have it both ways.

I didn't hear that interview or who she was. If she was in the shadow cabinet, or part of the energy or treasury shadow teams then I'd hope she would have a reasonable grasp of it, but again there is quite a bit of detail into how the whole of Labour's energy policies are funded that probably doesn't translate into a nice tidy soundbite for someone on a run.
It wasn't a soundbite, it was an interview that ran for some time. She was given two opportunities to explain the funding. I was able to find the answer myself and I could explain it in about 15 seconds.

Your posts illustrate why I'm sick of the political "debate" on here - you're trying to defend something you haven't heard, likely because you see it as an attack on your team, whereas if it was the "other team" it would be open season.

I'm minded to move all political threads to the bear pit so I don't see them, and don't feel tempted to engage, because it's a complete waste of time doing so.

(Don't waste your time replying - I'll not see it)
 


Cheshire Cat

The most curious thing..
I'm minded to move all political threads to the bear pit so I don't see them, and don't feel tempted to engage, because it's a complete waste of time doing so.
Do it.

:moo:
 




rogersix

Well-known member
Jan 18, 2014
8,201
It wasn't a soundbite, it was an interview that ran for some time. She was given two opportunities to explain the funding. I was able to find the answer myself and I could explain it in about 15 seconds.

Your posts illustrate why I'm sick of the political "debate" on here - you're trying to defend something you haven't heard, likely because you see it as an attack on your team, whereas if it was the "other team" it would be open season.

I'm minded to move all political threads to the bear pit so I don't see them, and don't feel tempted to engage, because it's a complete waste of time doing so.

(Don't waste your time replying - I'll not see it)
do you hold the torys to the same level of fiscal responsibility?
 


Baldseagull

Well-known member
Jan 26, 2012
11,839
Crawley
Ashworth was woefully poor on the BBC immediately following the Truss press conference. He was asked directly, twice, which parts of the mini-budget that remain in place Labour didn't agree with. He swerved it both times, so the interviewer gave up as he was out of time. I know this is standard politician procedure and they are all drilled to do the same, but it's just so frustrating. Be better - it's not hard.

Another Labour MP (didn't catch the name as I was out for a run) was interviewed by the easy-going Tony Livesey on 5Live's Drive show yesterday afternoon and he was asking about Labour's energy plans, and she completely floundered and had to resort to parroting pre-rehearsed lines that didn't go anywhere close to answering what she'd been asked. It was utterly piss poor.

To be clear, I'm not saying this to suggest Labour are worse or even the same as the current shambolic government, but if Labour are going to step up, do actually step up. Be professional. Answer the question even if it's a little bit awkward to do so. Let's have some honest politics, please.
I didn't see or hear the interviews so I hesitate to defend the interviewees, but giving answers on the hoof about Party Policy in regard to a constantly reversing/changing mini budget statement is difficult and likely to bite you in the bum.
In regard to Energy Policy, whoever it was should have been able to say that for more than a year they have been suggesting windfall taxes to fund holding the price cap down, and insulation grants for up to 19 million homes, and it was funded without borrowing. In fact part of the funding was through expected reduction in inflation through holding energy prices down, and therefore reducing expected cost of borrowing and Government interest on Bonds.
But again, in the context of Labour V Kwarteng Budget + amendments/reversals, it is hard to speak for the Party Policy.
There is also the Media training that they get given, which must be similar to what Footballers get, as they all stick to the same safe phrases, until they get a bit more experienced and comfortable with the media.
 


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